Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[sathya]

Any idea what is the 50 % offset clause ?

I mean 10 billion $ what woulda they invest ?

 

[IND151]

Livefist: Dassault's Rafale Tech Transfer Offer Compliant: Indian MoD

 

[nair]

The thread was opened in 2005.... and still we are talking about the tender......

 

[surya kiran]

@sancho @sandy_3126 @Dillinger @Oscar any idea on what the ToT will finally encompass and what the RFP asked for?

I thought, it was just the AESA and the source code the same. Does it include anything else like engines? And what will this finally entail for us? Does it include building the engine right from the raw material?

 

[Dillinger]

@sancho @sandy_3126 @Dillinger @Oscar any idea on what the ToT will finally encompass and what the RFP asked for?

I thought, it was just the AESA and the source code the same. Does it include anything else like engines? And what will this finally entail for us? Does it include building the engine right from the raw material?

Nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING on the engines, I know there are posters here even senior ones who think that some turbine tech will be accrued but that's patently false. Even when GTRE went to SNECMA for help on the Kaveri SNECMA gave them the finger and not too subtly by stating that they could get help in redesigning the engine around a SNECMA core and nothing else (understand that this would translate to a french engine with some Indian contribution and not tech sharing for fixing the Kaveri itself).

The following will illustrate what Dassault deems to be ToT:-

Beyond the scope of generic M-ToT but nothing of the sort that people believe the term ToT to entail.


NOTE:- Know how is accrued even when HAL or DRDO assembles equipment, machines or fabricates systems from scratch (from RM to stage to finished product, not the design itself) right here. What people envisage ToT to be is the transfer of the "Know why", which just does not happen and will not happen. The accurate way of expanding upon this is to understand that they will tell you how to produce the rotables and spares in country, provide you with the relevant codes so that programmable systems can be maintained and used independently, in country integration of non-OEM systems and munitions will be enabled, access will be provided to certain sensitive constituent systems but again sans the Know why.

 

[Agent_47]

 

[Dillinger]

Did anyone bother to notice that we have, as a policy, diluted our offset requirements. As per the original clause all retrenchment of acquisition cost amount (a certain percentage of it) was to be with our private companies specifically in the defence sector, we diluted that to allowing the OEM to invest a certain amount of the offset requirements even in areas of civilian applications.

 

[Fahad Khan 2]

the thread is open from 2005 and now its 2014 india wasted time you must have had a 2 or 3 sq..

 

[Abingdonboy]

Did anyone bother to notice that we have, as a policy, diluted our offset requirements. As per the original clause all retrenchment of acquisition cost amount (a certain percentage of it) was to be with our private companies specifically in the defence sector, we diluted that to allowing the OEM to invest a certain amount of the offset requirements even in areas of civilian applications.

To be fair this was a missive hurdle that many defence deals were getting stuck on, the "dilution" as you put it is in line with international norms.

Can't wait for the day these offsets are no longer mandated- they are a bloody nuisance to negotiate and implement and have messed up and even scuppered many defence deals for India.

 

[atlssa]

India's 20-Year Late LCA Faces Fresh Delays

Jul. 20, 2014 - 02:32PM | By VIVEK RAGHUVANSHI

India's Light Combat Aircraft is expected to miss its 2014 deadline for final operational clearance. (AFP)
​

NEW DELHI — India’s Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Mark-1, already 20 years late, likely will miss its final operational clearance (FOC) deadline set for the end of 2014, an Indian Air Force source said.

In the run-up to the FOC stage, handling tests are being performed on only one aircraft while the remaining five are still in production. Ideally, handling flight tests should be performed on at least six aircraft to ascertain their operational readiness, the source said.

“With handling tests on only one aircraft, and the remaining not even manufactured, it is impossible to get FOC by December’s end,” the source said.

The initial operational clearance (IOC) for LCA Mark-1 was received in December. Now the aircraft must demonstrate full performance as defined by the design and agreement of the Indian Air Force.

In addition, the aircraft will integrate missiles and must have the capability for midair refueling. The LCA undergoing testing has still not been modified to allow air-to-air refueling and is unlikely to have that capability by the end of 2014, the source added.

No official from LCA producer Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) was available for comment or responded to questions submitted by Defense News. The Air Force ordered 40 LCAs from HAL.

The LCA’s project cost has ballooned from about $90 million in 1983, when the project was conceived, to more than $4 billion. The aircraft is unlikely to be ready for operational deployment before 2016, the source said; the latest projected date had been 2014.

LCA has been developed by the Aeronautical Development Agency, a laboratory under the government’s Defence Research and Development Organisation.

An Air Force official said the Ministry of Defence promised the aircraft will be ready for combat missions from 2015 after receiving the FOC.

“We are keeping our fingers crossed for that day,” the official said.

Development delays forced the Air Force to hunt for a fighter aircraft. The process is still underway to procure 126 medium multirole combat aircraft (MMRCA) at a cost of more than $12 billion. French company Dassault’s Rafale is the preferred vendor.

The LCA was due to replace aging Russian MiG-21 fighters.

“With the MMRCA already in procurement stage for over seven years, and the wait for the LCA Mark-1 getting longer, the combat worthiness of the Air Force has been severely affected, for which the Ministry of Defence should fix responsibility,” said Bhim Singh, retired Air Force wing commander. “With the ongoing resource crunch and the new government committing a meager hike of 2.3 percent over the proposals made by the outgoing government in defense spending for the current financial year, it is unlikely the MMRCA will be inked this year.”

The fate of the LCA Mark-2, which would eventually meet the Air Force requirement for heavier payloads, is unknown as the MoD has not yet signed a deal to buy GE-414 engines from the US. The Air Force selected GE-414 over the Eurojet EJ 200 engine in 2011.

The service said it chose the GE-414 for LCA Mark-2 because of its higher thrust over the GE-4014 engine powering the Mark-1.

The Mark-2 will have additional features, including a new flight control computer; upgraded avionics; retractable in-flight refueling; on-board oxygen generation; an active electronically scanned array radar; new electronic warfare suite; and the ability to reach supersonic speed in level flight.

The Mark-2 was expected to be ready for flight tests by 2018, but the Air Force source said that because no significant work has begun on the aircraft, the 2018 deadline will be missed as well.

“The Indian Air Force has a requirement of over 200 LCA Mark-1 and Mark-2 aircraft, but with delays looking imminent and the procurement process of MMRCA getting longer, the Indian Air Force could take a major hit on its fleet strength in the years ahead,” Singh said. ■

India's 20-Year Late LCA Faces Fresh Delays | Defense News | defensenews.com

 

[Abingdonboy]

MMRCA Misgivings Unfounded (a must read)

 

[meena24]

MMRCA Misgivings Unfounded (a must read)

Exactly those nations whom the article points out have not gone to war with their neighbors, exactly this is what we fail to learn, many people here support domestic defence products very much even at the cost of National Security.

Best example is M777 artillery guns, there is no other gun produced like M777 howitzers which will give us a edge over pakistan in LOC artillery exchanges, If we had brought it along with M9082 Excalibur munitions we would have vaporized many of our adversary positions using this but we failed

 

[DrSomnath999]

FROM AIR & COSMOS MAGAZINE 2329- SPECTRA WITH GaN TECH

FRENCH

Le GaN passe en bande X

Un démonstrateur d’émetteur Spectra au nitrure de gallium est attendu en 2014.




Dans les laboratoires de la fonderie UMS, detenue a parts egales par EADS et Thales, une revolution se prepare. Des l'an prochain, une filiére de production de semi-conducteurs au nitrure de gallium (GaN) en bande X devrait etre qualifiee. C’est une premiere pour l'Europe.


Depuis cette annee, UMS etait deja parvenu a maitriser la production de compo-sants GaN fonctionnant en bande S, visant notamment le marche de la gamme de radars Ground Master de Thales.

Mais la realisation d’elements en bande X restait jusqu’alors l'apanage des Etats-Unis. Pour l'heure, les radars a antenne active developpes en Europe, comme le RBE2-AESA du Rafale, utili-sent des composants en arseniure de gallium (GaAs) comme ampEifi-cateurs hyperfrequences en bande X. “A taille equiva-lente, le GaN amene la promesse d’un gain de facteur 5 sur la puissance emise”, explique l'ingenieur en chef de l'armement Xavier Grison, de la

Direction generale de l'armement. C’est done bien l'avenir des radars aeroportes qui se joue sur cette revolution techno-logique. “Avec le GaAs, la marge de progression est faible et les radars actuels sont deja a leur limite haute en termes de
performances”, ajoute l’ingenieur.



Le GaN en bande X qualifie en 2013.

Depuis plusieurs annees, a la faveur de programmes d’etudes amont (PEA) successifs, la Direction generale de l'armement a favorise l'emergence de cette technologie. Le dernier PEA en date, baptise Ganiméde, doit aboutir a la realisation de prototypes de composants en bande X representatifs de ceux qui pourront etre utilises dans un systeme operationnel. Au titre du calendrier actuel, cette etape devrait etre atteinte d’ici deux a trois ans. Mais des l'an prochain, la filiére GaN sera deja qualifiee, ce qui signifie que le processus industriel sera maitrise et que les performances ainsi que la fiabilite du composant auront été clairement caracterisées

ENGLISH

[SIZE = "4"][COLOR = "blue"] GaN X-band passes

A transmitter Spectra demonstrator GaN is expected in 2014.[/COLOR][/SIZE]




In laboratories UMS foundry, has detained being equal EADS and Thales shares, a revolution is preparing. The next year, a production of semiconductor gallium nitride (GaN) X-band should be characterized. This is a first for Europe.


Since that year, UMS was already succeeded to master the production of compo-nents operating in S-band GaN, including walking to the range of Thales Ground Master radars.

- But the realization of elements X-band remained hitherto the preserve of the United States. For now, the active antenna radar has developed in Europe as the RBE2-AESA Rafale are in use feels component of gallium arsenide (GaAs) as ampEifi-ers hyperfrequences X-band "A slow-Equiva size GaN brings the promise of a gain factor of 5 on the power emitted, "said the chief engineer of armaments Xavier Grison, the

Directorate General of Armaments. It's done well the future of airborne radar that is played on this techno-logical revolution. "With the GaAs, the room for improvement is low and the current radars are already at their upper limit in terms of
performance, "added the engineer.

-

GaN X-band calls in 2013.

For several years, favored by upstream studies programs (EAP) successive, the Directorate General of Armaments has fosters the emergence of this technology. The final PEA dated baptizes Ganymede, should lead to the realization of prototype X-band components representative of those that will be used in an operational system. Under the current schedule, this step should be reached within two to three years. But next year, the sector GaN is already qualified, which means that the manufacturing process is mastered and the performance and reliability of the component have been clearly characterized

FRENCH
Restera a trouver l’application qui permettra au GaN de prendre son envoi et d’assurer un plan de charge significatif a UMS. Par rapport au GaAs, qui s’était rapidement impose dans les telecommunications sans fil, le GaN presente moins de debouches potentiels dans le civil. Selon Xavier Grison, il faudra attendre au moins cinq ans avant de voir de premieres applications opera-tionnelles du GaN sur des systemes aeroportes.






Faire évoluer Spectra.

Mais le Rafale bénéficiera indéniablement de la technologie GaN à plus ou moins long terme. Déjà, un PEA baptisé InCas (Intégration de nouvelles capacités à Spectra) étudie le remplacement des émetteurs au GaAs actuels par des émetteurs au GaN. Dans le cadre de ce PEA, un démonstrateur d’émetteur Spectra au GaN est attendu fin 2014. Le gain potentiel se situe au niveau de l’augmentation de la puissance d’emission, du rendement et de la largeur de bande couverte.

Ici encore, la mise en production de tels systemes reste liee au timing des evolutions Rafale et n’est pas attendue avant la prochaine decennie. Encore plus futuriste, mais tout

aussi plausible : le remplacement des radars de pointe avant actuels par des antennes conformes, véritables “peaux” intelligentes qui pourraient être facilement disséminées sur la cellule et combineraient des fonctions radars, brouillage, communications...

A plus court terme, estime-t-on à la DGA, c’est du côté de brouilleurs terrestres anti-IED ou d’autres systèmes de leurrage que les composants GaN pourraient trouver leur première application opérationnelle. De son côté, l’industrie civile pourrait adhérer à la technologie pour développer des composants de puissance destinés aux stations de base pour téléphones mobiles, par exemple. Le secteur spatial est lui aussi intéressé : l’ESA et le Cnes ont contribué à financer certains développements autour du GaN et sa possible “spatialisation”, en vue d’une utilisation dans de futurs satellites de communication. En Europe, UMS est la seule chance de voir émerger une filière industrielle complètement indépendante dans le domaine du GaN. Le défi est d’importance puisque, comme ils l’avaient fait pour le GaAs, les Etats-Unis n’hésitent pas à appliquer un embargo sur les circuits au GaN.

Côté britannique, la fonderie RFMD (qui fournit entre autres les modules d’émission-réception utilisés par les radars AESA de Selex Galileo) a réussi à acquérir son indépendance dans le domaine du GaAs - mais n’affiche pas de volonté de développer une filière GaN en Europe.

Guillaume Steuer

ENGLISH

Will find the application that will allow GaN to make sending and ensure a significant workload UMS. Compared to GaAs, which was quickly needed in the wireless telecommunications, GaN presents fewer potential market outlets in civilian life. According to Xavier Grison, it will take at least five years before we see opera-tional First applications of GaN on airborne systems.

Changing Spectra.

But undeniably benefit the Rafale GaN technology in the longer term. Already a PEA called Incas (Integration of new capabilities to Spectra) examines the replacement of existing GaAs emitters by issuers GaN. As part of this PEA, a transmitter Spectra demonstrator GaN is expected end of 2014 the potential gain is at the increasing power of emission, performance and breadth of covered band.


Again, the commissioning of such systems remains bound to the timing of evolutions Rafale and is not expected until the next decade. Even more futuristic, but

also possible: replacing existing radars nose by antennas compliant real smart "skins" that could be easily spread over the cell and combine radar functions, jamming communications ...

In the shorter term, says do we DGA is on the side of anti-IED or other decoy systems that GaN components could find their first operational application terrestrial jammers. For its part, the civilian industry could join the technology to develop power components for base stations for mobile phones, for example. The space sector is also interested: ESA and CNES have helped fund some developments around the GaN and its possible "spatial", for use in future communications satellites. In Europe, UMS is the only chance to see the emergence of a completely independent industrial sector in the field of GaN. The challenge is important because, as they had done for GaAs, the United States did not hesitate to apply an embargo on GaN circuits.


British side, molding RFMD (which provides among other transceiver used by AESA radars from Selex Galileo modules) managed to gain independence in the field of GaAs - but displays no desire to develop a die GaN Europe.

William Steuer

 

[hiphop]

I made this video of French Dassault Rafale soon joining Indian Air Force
I hope you guys will like it I am new in Video Editing
Subscribe to my Youtube channel

 

[hiphop]

@arp2041 @Abingdonboy @DRAY @Ravi Nair @nair @OrionHunter @sreekumar @TejasMk3 @gslv mk3 @Soumitra
Check out my first video in post above