Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[kish]

Dude i am not a defense expert .. all these things i said are from the hours i spend on here from the experts like them.. if u go back few pages there were interesting debates involving sancho , prateek and few others.. most of the rest just listen to that and got the knowledge. Afterall that is the main purpose of a "defence forum".

That is what i also do . . And ya i m following them from last few months . . And i prefer to read there post always . .
But i think king got hurt . . . . But that was misprint . . . And ya u again mention some of my favourite and forget one . . . . . . . Ok enough fun . . Can u tell me rafale have operational AESA or not . . If not then if we select it will it be operational before we induct jet

 

[jha]

With Jags and Hawks i guess there is no problem with money... they are always good and are more reliable... Further Mirage is a different successful product compared to Rafael.. it is a screwed up work by France who developed it because EU didnt accept to use snecma in Eurofighter... EU did find Snecma is underpowered and it is still ..
And want to highlight that France was in Eurofighter project first and latter dropped because of engine.. so Eurofighter is the boss of Rafael...

so Benny deal with the boss to get the work done than his subordinates .. so change your opinion to EF

ho ho ho...Hold it there buddy..France DID not drop because of engine. In addition to the ego clash between France and Germany , the major problem was the difference in Requirements.
The current EF nations wanted a pure Air-superiority aircraft which suited their doctrine at that time while france was always in favor of an omni-role fighter.
Plus there was also an issue in further developing the naval version of aircrafts.France was in favor of this while the other nations were not.
And thats why we will see F-35s flying from QE .

BTW i think EF nations are the losers in this fiasco..

 

[SpArK]

That is what i also do . . And ya i m following them from last few months . . And i prefer to read there post always . .
But i think king got hurt . . . . But that was misprint . . . And ya u again mention some of my favourite and forget one . . . . . . . Ok enough fun . . Can u tell me rafale have operational AESA or not . . If not then if we select it will it be operational before we induct jet

On trials now expected in 2012..

http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=4697061&c=EUR&s=AIR

 

[kingdurgaking]

EF is the one actually in serious trouble with funds.

UK is cutting its funds , delays happened due to germany's delays of decision, Austria reduced it orders.. Saudi deal faced troubles. etc etc..

France, they just need a good partner like we plan to do Kaveri with snecma..

I agree to u about MKI part..

See the comparison with Superbug

F/A-18E/F Super Hornet vs. Sukhoi Flanker

Please look deeply.... What EF has achieved and what Rafael has achieved... Though orders were reduced but not the commitment.. still far more than Rafael... Saudi Deal is through buddy when UK govt intervened on the issue of the fraud i guess... Saudis are getting trained and already one is dead in training ... so dont come back on accident.. It usually happens...

And i hate F18 ... For that we can go for Rafael...

 

[jha]

That is what i also do . . And ya i m following them from last few months . . And i prefer to read there post always . .
But i think king got hurt . . . . But that was misprint . . . And ya u again mention some of my favourite and forget one . . . . . . . Ok enough fun . . Can u tell me rafale have operational AESA or not . . If not then if we select it will it be operational before we induct jet

operational..? I dont think so..
Available when we induct them..?? Most probably..

Look AESA is not that a big concern imo ( even though i know that some of the poster will disagree)...The cause according to me is that the future war will be 98% Net centric...We will have the Phalcons and the DRDO AWACs along with the numerous satellites and the huge balloons guiding our pilots..The only use of the Radar will be in close battle which i doubt IAF will want to do..
Another example is SU-30 MKI which is one of the best Fighter available even though it lacks AESA..
Plus we will always have the choice to integrate it when we have our own ready...

 

[SpArK]

Please look deeply.... What EF has achieved and what Rafael has achieved... Though orders were reduced but not the commitment.. still far more than Rafael... Saudi Deal is through buddy when UK govt intervened on the issue of the fraud i guess... Saudis are getting trained and already one is dead in training ... so dont come back on accident.. It usually happens...

And i hate F18 ... For that we can go for Rafael...

It was commitment for the participation for the program.

As Jha said.. we are looking for a Medium multi role aircraft. Rafale is the only one which can carry a nuke.

And the only European fighter with AESA.

And the only fighter with no strings attached. (apart from MIG-35)

 

[jha]

Please look deeply.... What EF has achieved and what Rafael has achieved... Though orders were reduced but not the commitment.. still far more than Rafael... Saudi Deal is through buddy when UK govt intervened on the issue of the fraud i guess... Saudis are getting trained and already one is dead in training ... so dont come back on accident.. It usually happens...

And i hate F18 ... For that we can go for Rafael...

What EF has achieved..? Nothing ..Its damn too expensive to procure and even more to maintain and any hope of upgrades is NIL..
What RAFALE has achieved -- Close to nothing because of their alleged High headed attitude..

Infact i am not in favor of a very expensive aircraft for MRCA..I would just like something which fits between LCA and MKI..We already are getting an expensive one in FGFA..

 

[jha]

It was commitment for the participation for the program.

As Jha said.. we are looking for a Medium multi role aircraft. Rafale is the only one which can carry a nuke.

And the only European fighter with AESA.

And the only fighter with no strings attached. (apart from MIG-35)

Now thats whole another issue on which I have a slight different opinion..But thats OT..

 

[kingdurgaking]

ho ho ho...Hold it there buddy..France DID not drop because of engine. In addition to the ego clash between France and Germany , the major problem was the difference in Requirements.
The current EF nations wanted a pure Air-superiority aircraft which suited their doctrine at that time while france was always in favor of an omni-role fighter.
Plus there was also an issue in further developing the naval version of aircrafts.France was in favor of this while the other nations were not.
And thats why we will see F-35s flying from QE .

BTW i think EF nations are the losers in this fiasco..

Boss.. France opted out and one of the reason was Engine... France pushed for Snecma..


The ECA project collapsed in 1981 for several reasons including differing requirements, Dassault's insistence on "design leadership" and the British preference for a new version of the RB199 to power the aircraft versus the French preference for the new SNECMA M88.[11]


Yes Requirements where different.. and France wanted to lead the design...

 

[SpArK]

Here is pdf document of all the information need to know about the Rafale.

http://www.dassault-aviation.com/fileadmin/user_upload/redacteur/AUTRES_DOCS/Fox_three/Fox_Three_nr_8.pdf

 

[SpArK]

Boss.. France opted out and one of the reason was Engine... France pushed for Snecma..


The ECA project collapsed in 1981 for several reasons including differing requirements, Dassault's insistence on "design leadership" and the British preference for a new version of the RB199 to power the aircraft versus the French preference for the new SNECMA M88.[11]


Yes Requirements where different.. and France wanted to lead the design...

And the RB199 never flew..but the Snecma did.

 

[kingdurgaking]

What EF has achieved..? Nothing ..Its damn too expensive to procure and even more to maintain and any hope of upgrades is NIL..
What RAFALE has achieved -- Close to nothing because of their alleged High headed attitude..

Infact i am not in favor of a very expensive aircraft for MRCA..I would just like something which fits between LCA and MKI..We already are getting an expensive one in FGFA..

And i know what you are trying to push... We dont want the Crap around.. if you want you buy and keep it for your self ...

So what has EF and Rafale not achieved? .... we can list a page full of achievements...

 

[kingdurgaking]

And the RB199 never flew..but the Snecma did.

Because that is what they have as there base.. They dont have any other product to develope... Where as a new powerful modern engine came out.. called EJ.... and it has proven to better and more scalable unlike Snecma

 

[SpArK]

What EF has achieved..? Nothing ..Its damn too expensive to procure and even more to maintain and any hope of upgrades is NIL..
What RAFALE has achieved -- Close to nothing because of their alleged High headed attitude..

Infact i am not in favor of a very expensive aircraft for MRCA..I would just like something which fits between LCA and MKI..We already are getting an expensive one in FGFA..

That leaves us with Gripen, F-16 and MIG-35.

No way...

Superbug or Rafale... should win.

 

[SpArK]

Because that is what they have as there base.. They dont have any other product to develope... Where as a new powerful modern engine came out.. called EJ.... and it has proven to better and more scalable unlike Snecma

I remember reading in the forum that SNECMA's advantages are that it was built with easy maintainability and reduced operating costs.

I cant find the link though.