Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[flanker143]

Source plz , of 1m2 .
On f16.net some claim F16E has 1.6m2 as its Frontal sector RCS in X band .
And how did they achieve it - Google "HAVE GLASS2 RCS reduction on F16 " and "Golden canopy treatment on F22/F16e/F35"

i gave an estimate man , u want source !!! just give a google search and find out urslf its everywhere on the net !!!

I, agree

Even if that is a true RCS , which i doubt it is.

Add weapons and pod and what ever reduction made becomes meaningless.

Most planes have the same ~RCS , when carrying weapons.

i agree with u mate but to some extent , addition of weapons does adds up rcs, but it does not adds a hooligan rcs , airforces round the globe are not bunch of idiots who r inducting 'stealthier' jet (not stealth) into their forces !

 

[KEETARP]

gave an estimate man , u want source !!! just give a google search and find out urslf its everywhere on the net !!!

Could not find one , plz help me out and post that link here , would also benefit other readers

 

[flanker143]

Situation Awareness

and u can see janes an f16.net also , its even there in wiki ,
i know wiki is not reliable , but its still not that bad for taking even estimates !

 

[KEETARP]

The link you provided , is writer's personal opinion . Not even a single source to backup his claims . Blog /Personal opinions vary from person to person
See what he writes -

F-117, B-2 F-22 also given as 0.01-0.001 m2, ‘marble sized’ or fighter x 0.12-0.21

F-22 RCS requirement was 1/1000th the F-15. This has probably be exceeded by a large margin. Even if the F-15 RCS is a large 25 m2, the F-22 is 0.025 m2 worst case (fighter x 0.26).

He is not even sure of RCS of F15 , how much credible is this ? ? ? .

Janes and Lockheed martin + F16.net are reliable , post that link

 

[flanker143]

he might be talkin about the earliar versions of f15 which had larger rcs(maybe)

 

[sudhir007]

I would also like to point out one of the most important advantages that Gripen offers over other competitors, they are offering integration of weapons of India's choice. Which means if I understand that we can have either of Indian, Russian, European and/ or American weapons on this fighter which will provide us the weapons versatility and also reduce cost due to commonality of weapons already available in IAF.

HF did you think other country like Russia or may any other country allow to add on their weapon on Gripen. this is Big Question ?? then what will you do and what will be use of These kind of Fighter Plane.

 

[sudhir007]

EADS to shift some Eurofighter development projects to India-Politics/Nation-News-The Economic Times

BERLIN: European Aeronautic Defence and Space Company NV (EADS) would transfer some of the development projects of its advanced fourth generation Eurofighter Typhoon or other military aircraft to India soon, a top company official said on Thursday.

"We will transfer some of our development projects, which we have in Europe for Eurofighter or other military aircraft to India, where we have set up a military research and development (R&D) centre in Bangalore," EADS chief executive (defence & security) Stefan Zoller told IANS here.

The Netherlands-based European aerospace corporation was created in 2000 by merging Aerospatiale Matra of France, DaimlerChrysler Aerospace AG (DASA) of Germany (excluding the MTU engine business) and Construcciones Aeronauticas SA (CASA) of Spain.

Asserting that the consortium's R&D activities were independent of its bid for the 126 medium multirole combat aircraft (MMRCA) for the Indian Air Force (IAF), Zoller said leveraging the high-skilled Indian talent and the potential of the emerging Indian aerospace industry would lead to developing new technologies and creation of jobs.

"If we win the IAF order, the development of newer versions of Typhoon for India and global market will result in creation of about 20,000 direct jobs, as the bid involves the winner re-investing 50 percent of the deal in India's defence manufacturing industry," Zoller said at the 100th Berlin international air show.

Besides Eurofighter, the US-based Lockheed Martin F-16s and Boeing's F/A-18IN Super Hornet, French D'Assault's Rafale, Swiss SAAB's Gripen and Russian MiG-35 are the other five contenders for the IAF order, estimated to be $10-12 billion.

The IAF plans to acquire 18 of these in ready-to-fly condition, with the remaining 118 being manufactured by the Indian defence behemoth Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) under technology transfer and licensed production, to replace its ageing Russian MiG-21 fleet and enhance its strike capability.

"We will transfer 60 percent of the Eurofighter technology to India if Typhoon wins the bid. Our long-term strategy is to partner with the Indian aerospace industry for our global market, as we consider the Indian talent and resources as an ideal source for knowhow and to develop newer technologies," Zoller said.

The consortium is keen on building a centre of competence and a centre of excellence in Bangalore through its Indian subsidiary to design and develop next-generation products and solutions to its European and global markets.

"We also want to establish a division of our defence and security wing in India independent of the IAF order for Typhoon not to duplicate what we are doing in Europe but replicate its business model to leverage the potential of the Indian aerospace industry through joint ventures and offset projects," Zoller added.

 

[SpArK]

EF is getting aggressive ..

 

[SpArK]

European Eurofighter project to create 20,000 jobs in India

BERLIN: Four-nation European consortium EADS is offering to create 20,000 high-skilled jobs in India if it bags the lucrative Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) contract.

The contract would entail technology transfer and manufacture of the fighter planes by the buyer country.

"We will create with the Eurofighter 20,000 high-skilled jobs in India. We have already hired eight engineers and will hire another 100 within the next 10-14 months and are looking particularly for electronic engineers," Stefan Zoller, head of EADS Defence and Security said.

He maintained that this figure would go upto 250 engineers for Eurofighter in two years.

Zoller argued that India's human resource had a rich talent in the field of software and had "proven high-quality" software professionals which could be tapped by the EADS, a consortium formed by UK, Germany, Spain and Italy.

If the consortium wins this contract then several other companies would also be involved in the ambitious project, generating more employment.

EADS, which makes Eurofighter Typhoon MMRCA, is one of the bidders for the 126 such fighter planes that India has floated tenders for.

The European consortium is already working with India in building the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) being built in Bangalore.

"40 Indian engineers are working in the LCA project partly here and in India," Bernhard Gerwert, CEO of (Military Air Systems) EADS, Defence and Security said.

Though EADS is more than eager to include technology transfer as one of the key components of the deal, there is a concern about not getting 50 per cent stake in any venture established by the consortium in India.

Recalling an earlier attempt to strike a deal with Larsen and Toubro in India, Zoller said a foreign company getting only 26 per cent stake became an issue.

"Whatever we generate there, we get only 26 per cent. We want 50 per cent participation," he said. EADS officials maintain that they look at India as a partner and not just an "interesting market".

"We want to become a strong security and defence company in India," Zoller said, adding that his aim was to create "centres of competence" there which would be meet global standards.



European Eurofighter project to create 20,000 jobs in India-Jobs-News By Industry-News-The Economic Times

 

[KS]

@Lt.Prateek.

Ur comments on this..?

http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/4347-mrca-news-discussions-92.html#post920856

 

[Tejas-MkII]

It seem like EADS making their offer sweeter and sweeter.

I don't what the hell france is doing.

Rafale is my FAV. but Typhoon is going great

 

[SpArK]

Eurofighter Snipes Lockheed, Says Typhoon More 5th-Gen Than F-35, Latter Not Even A Fighter!​

Friday, June 11, 2010

The Eurofighter Typhoon is much more of a 5th-Generation fighter than the Lockheed-Martin F-35 Lightning-II. That's the refrain of an article in the latest edition of Eurofighter's magazine Eurofighter World. Suggesting that the "generation sequence and headings used by Lockheed-Martin for fighters are generally shared by the defence community", the piece goes on to point out that "these classifications are truly too rigid and schematic to have any credibility, in the sense that a fighter such as the Eurofighter Typhoon exhibits all the qualities of a 5th generation fighter with the exception of full spectrum stealthiness (VLO) but is well above the legacy 4th generation platforms in all other measures of performance." Eurofighter says the US "uses and sometimes abuses" the generations issue.

"If we take the key attributes defining a 5th generation fighter the JSF satisfies only a few of them. Scoring the Eurofighter Typhoon against the same “admission criteria” as the 5th generation club, would produce a much higher compliance than JSF, for example, as the only missing part would be the VLO stealthiness," the article states, with a table depicting this compliance.

Here's the rest:

• So, if the F-35/JSF is not a 5th generation fighter, what is it then? Where does it belong? That is a very important question and needs a definition before it can be answered properly.
  
• A fighter is a combat aircraft whose aerodynamic characteristics, sensor suite and weapon capabilities are optimised to achieve the control of the air. Fighters actively look for and engage the opponent's fighter force. Strike aircraft generally avoid engagements with other fighters. The fighter generations concept obviously applies and is restricted to fighters. It cannot apply to bombers, strike and attack aircraft, even if sometimes these are inaccurately termed as fighters. Where does the good old A-4 Skyhawk or the Close Air Support A-10 belong in terms of fighter generations? Where does the F-117 fit? Certainly not in the fighter generation classes. The same is true also for the F-35/JSF.
  
• So, the inclusion of a tactical strike and attack platform in the fighter generation concept is a mistake. Simply put, the JSF is not a fighter and the two classes are not comparable. The process of designing a combat aircraft will inevitably result in a number of trade-offs. Any fighter is a compromise between aircraft manoeuvrability; high specific excess power; weapon effectiveness; highoff bore sight; IR/RF missiles; gun; combat persistence; high fuel fraction; maximum firepower; aircraft systems/sensors; human machine interface; situational understanding; helmet mounted displays; threat warning; countermeasures; good cockpit visibility.
  
• Survivability can beachieved by means other than Low Observability. For example thanks to layered information systems; mission definable preferences;automation of routine tasks; threat prioritisation; sensor fusion and inherent safety, you are able to avoid compromising the performance and flight characteristics of the aircraft and create a weapon system that does not suffer from the same inflexibility issues that the F-35 JSF appears to have. During the first Desert Storm attack against Iraq on the 17th January 1991, only 10 stealth aircraft from a total of 658 non stealth attack aircraft successfully hit targets in Iraq and Kuwait. That night there were no losses at all. So what is the lesson learnt? Clearly if you can hide an F-117, the primary stealth bomber of that time... you can also hide a B-52! However, if any air force is going to choose just one platform, they have to make sure it is fit for purpose. The main considerations should be: forget the generation labels and instead consider requirements & capabilities. Overall, military capability must meet a nation’s needs. If you cannot have the F-22, you need something of similar air-to-aircapability to support your attack aircraft at the same time. Survivability can be achieved by means other than stealthiness. A single platform designed only for strike missions is unlikely to satisfy all combat air power requirements. Today the Typhoon is the only aircraft capable of evolving ahead of the threat and in step with maturing technology.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: Eurofighter Snipes Lockheed, Says Typhoon More 5th-Gen Than F-35, Latter Not Even A Fighter!

Original article. LINK

 

[SpArK]

 

[SpArK]

 

[KS]

@Lt.Prateek,sancho,gogbot..

U guys keep squabbling among urselves so that I can keep updating my knowledge due that...