Daring attempt: Army colonel drowns in Attabad Lake

[MastanKhan]

To shut the mouths of people who talk against the Pak Army, let me narrate. Today I got the opportunity to attended funeral prayer of SHAHEED Col Arif, after even 60 hrs of his shahadat , his face was as fresh as rose. His beard was two days grown which clearly proves that he is ALIVE according the the verse of Quran. He gave his life to save others lives. Yes he was a senior officer but he set a personal example like Pak Army officers have been doing in the past. He sacrificed his today and his family's tomorrow for an voluptuary , cheap and apathetic Nation. I SALUTE YOU MY DEAR FRIEND. I a m sure by now you would be in orchards of heaven.

Sir,

First---welcome to the board---second----it is only your first post----so you haven't earnt any right to shut anyone's mouth on this board----thirdly---if you had posted here for awhile---you would have recognized the futility of your comments---. So far---on this board----we donot look forward to shutting down anyone's mouth---rather we look forward to different opinions---harsh as they might sound---they bring a different perspective to our lives.

His death is indeed extremely valiant---only an extremely brave man---a man devoted to his job can do this---but should he-----.

You all people love to hear SOB STORIES like this one----but don't even bother to look any further than that---.

Even though this is a tragic moment---this is also a moment of reckoning----. This is how far back pakistan is form the rest of the advanced world----any other first world army----a regular soldier would have taken this job without any questions asked----in pakistan it takes a colonel----so count the ranks between a soldier and a colonel-----and then multiply that number by a factor of 2.5----that is how far behind the pak millitary is from the leading forces.

Anybody read the JACOBABAD DIARIES of the paf base commander---where he talks about a damaged F 18 coming for emergency landing and the ammunition has to be taken off the plane---and an american non com is doing the job---upon seeing that the base commander asks---don't you need an officer to do that job -----and the reply is----no sir---I am fully capable to do that job---. Listen, think, understand and accept----.

 

[alibaz]

BTW, have you guys ever heard of something like; Leading from the front, and setting personal examples?

Absolutely shocking comment

Sir this is very much heard, observed, seen and practiced in this profession.

 

[Xeric]

Hi Xeric,

How are you? Long time no talk.

i am guud, and you? Yeah we have been 'out of contact' for some time now. Probably because of having different priorities as regards to the handling of topic at PDF.

Absolutely---whomsoever knows a little bit about pak millitary knows about 'leading from the front'----it used to be the normal practise world wide with professional armies----but with changing times and technologies that trend also changed---the non coms are better trained at handling their jobs---I would say that the non coms are doing the jobs that the oficers used to do 20--30 years ago---.

Agreed in totality.

The troops are more aware and more educated as compared to the past. You are absolutely right that today, a job which was entrusted to a Captain can very well be performed by a NCO, may be a junior NCO. This tends to put unde pressure on Officers and at the same time make our Men more experienced and capable of handling problems independently.

It is a sad state of affairs when a colonel has to go down for the rescue----first thing is that you cannot just replace a colonel ranked officer in the amry which is already spread so thin---secondly---it also tells a state of affairs----that there is a problem with some ranks obeying the orders---or not having capable troops to jump into the situation.

Indeed it is sad. Apparently, there didnt seem a need for a Colonel to jump in himself. And indeed it may tell us that there might a certain problem regarding the 'state of affairs' as you have put forth, for now i would like to go with "not having capable troops to jump into the situation", rather than "that there is a problem with some ranks obeying the orders". So as i have mentioned earlier, with paucity of resources and lack of proper conditioning of troops, we may continue to have such issues in the future also. All we can do is to improve upon our existing infrastructure, equipment and training so that these incidents can be minimize to the extent possible.

Xeric---I won't stop you from jumping to rescue your men---but here is what I will reccommend for you----next time if you or your team is in a situation like that----use two ropes---if they are available---one for reaching the object and second---possibly a thinner rope around the armpits---if you fall into the water---at least you can be pulled out----. I am pretty sure that you knew it---I just re-itterated it.

Ok, sir

i do wonder that more precautions must have been taken before the Officer had decided to go in the harms way. Also, as the fluid, tense and time sensitive situation may have compeled the Offcier to take the unfortunate decision, so i still wont attribute this loss to some lapse or failure of SOP.

 

[Comet]

This shows the kind of dedication of officers in Pakistan Army. Salute.

 

[Windjammer]

Colonel Arif Mehmood

 

[alibaz]

Colonel Arif Mehmood

 

[arsalabbasi]

May he RIP

 

[MastanKhan]

Xeric,

My point here is that the colonel cannot be replaced----you know that---I know that----I look at the man---and the picture tells a thousand things about him.
It shows a man of character, conviction and dignity---a very kind man. It is a sacrifice that pains me as much as it does to anyone else not related to him----.

People don't realize or are ignorant of the fact that iran lost the war to iraq---or it was a stalemate due to the fact that the iranian revolutionaries had executed all the command staff officers after the revolution and the iranian army had no capable officer to plan and lead the army against the iraqis.

Now---coming back to the original issue it all comes back to the same old thing---how long does an insurgency has to last to over shadow the morale and discipline of the armed forces----it is 6 months to a year----. After that time small cracks start to appear in the structure and operation of the organization.
Serving troops start asking questions.

They get upset when an operation is started and then stopped in mid step----they have seen their brethren, colleagues die in combat, taken hostage and executed, tortured etc---and they don't understand why they cannot complete the job right from the gitgo----.

In their hearts---they were against the operation right from day one---but their training and duty forced them to take action----. Even though I have praised Musharraf many a times----that is one of the things he failed to recognize---the fact that the troops will only let him go so far.

Small insubordinations are a terrible thing for any organization leave alone the army---.

Indira Gandhi knew about it---recognized the fact and did what she had to do---got the right officer with the proper authority to do the right job---operation blue star-----. If she would have done what Gen Musharraf did----minimal action as needed----india would have had severe consequences to face.

 

[TaimiKhan]

And then people say that the officers are coming into the army for a luxury life, for plots and worldly materialistic things which they get after retirement.

Officers like Col Arif and the hundreds of the martyred officers are an example that they are not. Hope the people with such thinking are ashamed of their thinking.

Anyway, RIP to the brave soldier, who gave his life to protect others.


@ Mastan Sir,

Such kind of senior officers are very rare, who lead by an example. I remember my dad when commanding his infantry unit in Kashmir and he going to the forward posts, and in the process he got his knees fcuked up, but still he used to take Brufen tablets and kept going. Why ?? So that the morale of his troops is high after seeing their commanding officer with them. And at one post which is linked with an Indian one, my dad had a cup of tea with the Indian soldiers. The Indian post was being led by a NCO\Subidar, and he was surprised to see the commanding officer of the opposing side visit his troops, while he told my dad that they hardly get any visit from any officer of their side. I was young at that time, but i still remember the day when we received a call at home that contact with my dad has been lost while being on the tour of the forward posts, and after 3 days the contact was established. Can't describe the 3 terrible days we had to spend with the thinking and feeling that we may never see him again. Even though by the 3rd day, preparations for the worst had been completed at the unit HQs and my mom was kind of ready. Anyway, he still did not stopped and kept touring his forward formations, my dad's is a very very stubborn pathan . Yeah, he was stuck in a 3 days snow storm at some forward post.

I have many many examples, where officers lead the way. This is not something new or for the first time or would be the last time.

 

[Rafi]

And then people say that the officers are coming into the army for a luxury life, for plots and worldly materialistic things which they get after retirement.

Officers like Col Arif and the hundreds of the martyred officers are an example that they are not. Hope the people with such thinking are ashamed of their thinking.

Anyway, RIP to the brave soldier, who gave his life to protect others.


@ Mastan Sir,

Such kind of senior officers are very rare, who lead by an example. I remember my dad when commanding his infantry unit in Kashmir and he going to the forward posts, and in the process he got his knees fcuked up, but still he used to take Brufen tablets and kept going. Why ?? So that the morale of his troops is high after seeing their commanding officer with them. And at one post which is linked with an Indian one, my dad had a cup of tea with the Indian soldiers. The Indian post was being led by a NCO\Subidar, and he was surprised to see the commanding officer of the opposing side visit his troops, while he told my dad that they hardly get any visit from any officer of their side. I was young at that time, but i still remember the day when we received a call at home that contact with my dad has been lost while being on the tour of the forward posts, and after 3 days the contact was established. Can't describe the 3 terrible days we had to spend with the thinking and feeling that we may never see him again. Even though by the 3rd day, preparations for the worst had been completed at the unit HQs and my mom was kind of ready. Anyway, he still did not stopped and kept touring his forward formations, my dad's is a very very stubborn pathan . Yeah, he was stuck in a 3 days snow storm at some forward post.

I have many many examples, where officers lead the way. This is not something new or for the first time or would be the last time.

Simply put your father is a hero, and all the Pakistani Soldiers, Airmen, Sailors - who are on the borders willing to face our enemies have my, and tens of millions of other Pakistanis eternal gratitude.

 

[MastanKhan]

TK,


What you are describing is the sign of a warrior and a true leader of men----and what I am saying is not to challenge their integrity and honour, but something totally different----.

 

[SQ8]

And then people say that the officers are coming into the army for a luxury life, for plots and worldly materialistic things which they get after retirement.

Officers like Col Arif and the hundreds of the martyred officers are an example that they are not. Hope the people with such thinking are ashamed of their thinking.

Anyway, RIP to the brave soldier, who gave his life to protect others.


@ Mastan Sir,

Such kind of senior officers are very rare, who lead by an example. I remember my dad when commanding his infantry unit in Kashmir and he going to the forward posts, and in the process he got his knees fcuked up, but still he used to take Brufen tablets and kept going. Why ?? So that the morale of his troops is high after seeing their commanding officer with them. And at one post which is linked with an Indian one, my dad had a cup of tea with the Indian soldiers. The Indian post was being led by a NCO\Subidar, and he was surprised to see the commanding officer of the opposing side visit his troops, while he told my dad that they hardly get any visit from any officer of their side. I was young at that time, but i still remember the day when we received a call at home that contact with my dad has been lost while being on the tour of the forward posts, and after 3 days the contact was established. Can't describe the 3 terrible days we had to spend with the thinking and feeling that we may never see him again. Even though by the 3rd day, preparations for the worst had been completed at the unit HQs and my mom was kind of ready. Anyway, he still did not stopped and kept touring his forward formations, my dad's is a very very stubborn pathan . Yeah, he was stuck in a 3 days snow storm at some forward post.

I have many many examples, where officers lead the way. This is not something new or for the first time or would be the last time.

The problem is Taimi .. with the 2% who give the rest a bad name.
Do the idiots that have run this country.. murdered people in the name of religion, looted.. represent anything more than 2% of every Pakistani that has ever been and is??
NO..
But it is these people that leave us faithless in our selves, ruin everybody else's lives , reputations.. for their gain.
and They must be stopped now, they must be rooted out.

 

[TaimiKhan]

The problem is Taimi .. with the 2% who give the rest a bad name.
Do the idiots that have run this country.. murdered people in the name of religion, looted.. represent anything more than 2% of every Pakistani that has ever been and is??
NO..
But it is these people that leave us faithless in our selves, ruin everybody else's lives , reputations.. for their gain.
and They must be stopped now, they must be rooted out.

Agreed, but what i like is that people should not generalize. Just due to the 1-2% if bad, doesn't means whole army officers are bad or corrupt.

It feels bad when people generalize, as i just said that people say these officers are after plots and stuff like that, but on the other hand hundreds have lost their lives to protect the very same who say such kind of things and generalize without distinguishing the bad ones from the good ones.

 

[SQ8]

Agreed, but what i like is that people should not generalize. Just due to the 1-2% if bad, doesn't means whole army officers are bad or corrupt.

It feels bad when people generalize, as i just said that people say these officers are after plots and stuff like that, but on the other hand hundreds have lost their lives to protect the very same who say such kind of things and generalize without distinguishing the bad ones from the good ones.

I could not agree more, that whole "jhagra" we have is when people generalize it to just civilians.. or just military..
Forgetting that they both are part of the same being that is Pakistan.
Unfortunately when critiquing either, somehow it comes off as the critique is for the whole lot.. and then the defensive tirade starts up...and ends up in "tu tu mein mein".
Anyway.. it is a credit to the colonel in leading from the front..
There are many others, in all sectors of life, who set the example for their sub-ordinates by showing initiative first.. sadly these people are not appreciated as they should be.. and usually end up the target of jealous sycophants.

 

[Windjammer]

Watch the last interview of this dedicated and devoted officer. Until men like him are around, there is plenty of hope.