CPEC: Asking the Wrong Question

[gslv mk3]

The question is not whether a country needs infra it is about at what cost it comes. You're offering a 50 billion project for barely 2000 miles of highway, a few power plants and some additional infra like airport?

Last year we added 34 GW to the grid, which is basically 2 X the installed capacity envisaged in CPEC plan. That too 'without a corridor'.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

LAME!

Sureley. We are building only highway and road, you're building silk road. So obviously the roads China is building is made of silk and so costs cannot be compared. Is 'new silk road made of new silk'? is it different from old silk?

Last year we added 34 GW to the grid, which is basically 2 X the installed capacity envisaged in CPEC plan. That too 'without a corridor'.

we shuld ideally invest money in CPEC because if Pakistanis are ready to give more than 100% return why should we give up the opp?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Please don't abuse Aboriginals by associating them with Shudras. I am literally writing this while travelling on traditional Aboriginal land, so I have a right to be offended.

Sorry for offending your sensibilities but this is a defence site and not a cooking channel for aunties. So expect some "vivid" language given our rivalry with our neighbour. Not to make the point to strongly our boys are getting shot on the border so some slack can be cut here on a defence site that is supposedly in honour of our armed forces.

And by the way when I use "Abos.," I don't mean the native Australians but relate to Indians.

 

[cocomo]

The biggest benefit of CPEC for Pakistan is alignment of Pakistani and Chinese interests. That is the best weapon against Indians. Indian thought they could walk over Pakistan because they were under the umbrella of a super power after 9/11 and that they have the same interests (eg. Denuclearizing Pakistan). CPEC have strategic benefits that are not discussed generally. Importing Chinese work ethics will be one other substantial benefit of CPEC and economic dividends of CPEC will be huge if majority of the projects are completed.
There are quite evident regional benefits of CPEC. one of the most important being that a economically stable and strong Pakistan is necessary for regional peace, the Indians never talk to an unstable weak Pakistan because they don't see any strategic compulsion, I read somewhere when in 2001 Chinese and Pakistanis planed the Gwadar port the Indian Prime Minister Vajpai himself invited Musharraf for peace talks.

 

[CriticalThought]

Sorry for offending your sensibilities but this is a defence site and not a cooking channel for aunties. So expect some "vivid" language given our rivalry with our neighbour. Not to make the point to strongly our boys are getting shot on the border so some slack can be cut here on a defence site that is supposedly in honour of our armed forces.

And by the way when I use "Abos.," I don't mean the native Australians but relate to Indians.

Aboriginal is a term that was coined specifically to refer to native Australians. As abhorable as its origins are, today there are efforts to undo the wrongs done to them for many years. Not just me, any civilized Australian will be offended if you use the term derogatively.

Then, there is the added subtlety that the concept of 'Shutra' is even worse than 'Aboriginal'. Note, I consider Shutras as human beings and respect them, I am talking about the concept of Shutra vs. concept of Aboriginal. In 2017, Aboriginal is treated with civility. Please respect this.

Also, vivid language is actually not allowed by the moderators of this forum. Somebody used R******S to refer to Indians and they got a warning.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Aboriginal is a term that was coined specifically to refer to native Australians

aboriginal
abəˈrɪdʒɪn(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: aboriginal
1.
inhabiting or existing in a land from the earliest times or from before the arrival of colonists; indigenous.

https://www.culturalsurvival.org/publications/cultural-survival-quarterly/aboriginal-groups-india
http://www.australiangeographic.com.au/news/2013/01/aboriginal-genes-suggest-indian-migration/

Now go please crack your whip on one of the Indian's here who disparage Pakistani's as a living and leave me alone.

 

[Kamikaze Pilot]

Atta boy! From 'unmitigated success', 'game changer' to 'some will succeed, some will fail' . @Genesis to ensure CPEC success I think think of a few prudent measures that every single country uses:

- Employ local Pak labor to reduce costs instead of bringing in Chinese labor and paying them heavy, taking care of their expensive living in Pak etc.
-Use more pak companies to sub contract
- Transparently set what margins the chinese companies are making- are they charging 15% or 20% - no one in Pak knows - see at 40 Billion, that's a good 6 to 8 Billion in margins

(the same as above is also true for OBOR)

FOr 'unmitigated success of CPEC' will you be ready to make compromises in any of the above?



woye @ranjeet ab bata. You were calling RG pappu when he said this. Turns out this is a universal feeling and these guys are ready to pay 50 billion for the right state of mind.

Jhakaas! Main tou tera fan ho gaya. I will put you on follow list. @SOUTHie is not the only guy who can post nice posts. People like you are an set to PDF because if this single post is any indication then you write some really nice posts and attract readers.

 

[Fireurimagination]

Trade balance tilts further in Beijing’s favour

So it begins?

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Trade balance tilts further in Beijing’s favour

So it begins?

'officially'

 

[Fireurimagination]

'officially'

Pakistan should in fact study the relation between it's declining exports and CPEC

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Sorry for offending your sensibilities but this is a defence site and not a cooking channel for aunties. So expect some "vivid" language given our rivalry with our neighbour. Not to make the point to strongly our boys are getting shot on the border so some slack can be cut here on a defence site that is supposedly in honour of our armed forces.

And by the way when I use "Abos.," I don't mean the native Australians but relate to Indians.

I disagree...aunties or not, this is a cooking channel, main speciality being 'khwabi pulao' . Trust me the only person who uses 'vivid' language on issues like this is a troll/ stupid person who doesn't know how to add.

 

[Shane]

Sureley. We are building only highway and road, you're building silk road. So obviously the roads China is building is made of silk and so costs cannot be compared. Is 'new silk road made of new silk'? is it different from old silk?

Your attempt at sarcasm is just as ironic as your knowledge and comprehension.

we shuld ideally invest money in CPEC because if Pakistanis are ready to give more than 100% return why should we give up the opp?

Keep drinking what you have been that has made you this way. I am sure your countrymen fully support your brain f@rt$.

I know it hurts deep down and you are looking to invest elsewhere since local investments are turning into cow excrement. Please accept my heart felt but look at the bright and smelly side, at least it is adored, craved and even loved by so many amongst you:
http://www.financialexpress.com/economy/the-make-in-india-flop-show/711912/lite/

 

[Abingdonboy]

True Bro. Though maybe we may not need Trump largesse just yet. Our budget for building...eh...10,000 KM of new highway and up gradation of another 50,000 KM is somehow only 28 Billion. Our power plants probably come at about, say, 1 billion. Now if it was 50 billion for 2000 KM motorway, maybe we'd have to beg trump. But since it hasn't yet reached that amount, we'll keep begging for later and depend on urine exports for now.

Funniest thing is they are paying $46-50 billion, actually not paying but taking high interest loans, for BASIC infrastructure- roads and coal fuelled power plants.

Not HSR, not smart cities, not electrified heavy duty freight railway capable of transporting double stacked containers from Pakistan's economic hubs. Just look at the DFCs of IR, Pakistan isn't even planning anything like them.


The purpose of this post is clear- expectation management, the hype has gotten far too high for CPEC amongst Pakistanis and the Chinese are now terrified that the reality of what CPEC will turn out to be is going to result in massive backlash for them.


Funny thing is that they are feeling the need to do this already with most of the CPEC projects yet to even begin construction. I'd be very very worried if I had placed all my hopes on CPEC to save Pakistan's economic future.

Last year we added 34 GW to the grid, which is basically 2 X the installed capacity envisaged in CPEC plan. That too 'without a corridor'.

Bro, placing all of one's hopes on a single project (and one as insignifcant as this relatively speaking) like this is akin to relying on a single political figure to turn around a nation.


Not only is it not going to happen but it is going to lead to massive dissilusionment. Pakistan would've been better served building up its institutions and coming up with comprehensive infrastructure development plans.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Your attempt at sarcasm is just as ironic as your knowledge and comprehension.



Keep drinking what you have been that has made you this way. I am sure your countrymen fully support your brain f@rt$.

I know it hurts deep down and you are looking to invest elsewhere since local investments are turning into cow excrement. Please accept my heart felt but look at the bright and smelly side, at least it is adored, craved and even loved by so many amongst you:
http://www.financialexpress.com/economy/the-make-in-india-flop-show/711912/lite/

'make in India is flop so CPEC is star' man how logical.

Funniest thing is they are paying $46-50 billion, actually not paying but taking high interest loans, for BASIC infrastructure- roads and coal fuelled power plants.

Not HSR, not smart cities, not electrified heavy duty freight railway capable of transporting double stacked containers from Pakistan's economic hubs. Just look at the DFCs of IR, Pakistan isn't even planning anything like them.


The purpose of this post is clear- expectation management, the hype has gotten far too high for CPEC amongst Pakistanis and the Chinese are now terrified that the reality of what CPEC will turn out to be is going to result in massive backlash for them.


Funny thing is that they are feeling the need to do this already with most of the CPEC projects yet to even begin construction. I'd be very very worried if I had placed all my hopes on CPEC to save Pakistan's economic future.


Bro, placing all of one's hopes on a single project (and one as insignifcant as this relatively speaking) like this is akin to relying on a single political figure to turn around a nation.


Not only is it not going to happen but it is going to lead to massive dissilusionment. Pakistan would've been better served building up its institutions and coming up with comprehensive infrastructure development plans.

I'm very certain that economic flops in our area will not leave us unscathed. It will lead to increased organized crime in our neighborhood that china doesn't have to worry about.

 

[gslv mk3]

Please accept my heart felt but look at the bright and smelly side, at least it is adored, craved and even loved by so many amongst you:
http://www.financialexpress.com/economy/the-make-in-india-flop-show/711912/lite/

Still Make in India has attracted more investment than CPEC. Not loan. Investments.