countries should be buying Saab’s Gripen fighter jet

[Ultima Thule]

We currently use
1.mirages (considering both 3&5 as single)
2.F-7
3.C-130
4.refueling tankers
5.F-16
6.JF-17
7.K-8
What will happen if v add another one?

only 3 fighter jets rest of refueling tankers/cargo/trainer aircraft

Just put some light on it ....
Also
PAF need Gripen? If yes then why?

we ask gripen in early 2000 but Sweden denies, what do you want to give more explanation

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

Kindly explain about it....
We already maintaining few plateforms
What if we add another one?


Excellent then
What happened in MMRCA of India where they select rafale?

SAAB participated in MMRCA with the Gripen C/D, but India had an AESA radar as a requirement, and this resulted in Gripen not making the short list.

 

[ziaulislam]

But it took us 20 years to put these avionics in JF-17......
Also there is a class difference between
Gripen and jf-17
One is medium and a the other is light
Respectively.

Because the french screwed us
The deal was done in 2003 and all of sudden french withdrew..they literally have become our enemy no.1 now ..
The benefit of that was that we embraced chinese avionics but delay was inevitable due to quality issue

 

[Abdul Rehman Majeed]

Gripen has been mature for about 20 years, Brazil is buying the third generation.

What is your definition of mature? Gripen E testing has just started.


Gripen E testing ahead of schedule, vendor claims
By: Christina Mackenzie   May 24, 2019

The Gripen E fighter. (Saab photo)

LINKÖPING, Sweden — Flight-testing of Saab’s Gripen E combat aircraft is moving faster than anticipated, according to Eddy de la Motte, vice president and head of the Gripen E/F business unit at Swedish manufacturer Saab.

De la Motte told a media briefing that tests to fire MBDA’s Meteor missile had been carried out by test aircraft 39-8 and 39-9 in northern Sweden. “We’d planned two weeks for the testing and were able to get everything done in one,” the executive remarked, adding, “We’re getting more out of each individual flight test hour than we’d anticipated, which is helping to move the program forward.”

Today the flight envelope is being expanded, with 9g being achieved earlier this month, according to the company. Test pilot Marcus Wandt explained that although the aircraft is heavier than the Gripen C, “the agility is still there because it’s stronger and carries its weight very well.” Wandt and his five colleagues have flown 125 test hours.


2nd Gripen E takes flight
Saab's second Gripen E aircraft has taken to the skies, setting the program up for deliveries starting in 2019.

By: Jeff Martin
The first Gripen E for Sweden will be delivered this year to the test and evaluation force made up of personnel from Saab and the Swedish Air Force.

The first of the 36 aircraft ordered by Brazil (28 single-seater E versions and 8 twin-seater F versions) for $4.16 billion will be delivered to the Brazilian Air Force in 2021, but the first pilots will come to Sweden next January to start training.


Mikael Franzen, vice president and head of the Gripen Brazil business unit, explained that the two production lines for the aircraft – one in Sweden and one in Brazil – would both be used to produce aircraft that may be ordered by other clients in the future. Franzen said eight aircraft would be built by Brazilians in Sweden (four Fs and four Es) to ensure that the Brazilians were totally at ease with the building processes, and 15 would be built in Brazil by Brazilians and 13 by Swedes in Sweden. The two-seater Gripen F, developed specifically for Brazil and 65 cm longer than the E nevertheless has systems and displays that are identical as in the E version.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...en-e-testing-ahead-of-schedule-vendor-claims/


Saab has taken another important step in the delivery of Gripen E to the Brazilian customer.
Marked by a ceremony in Linköping, Sweden, on 10 September, the first Brazilian Gripen E aircraft was delivered to start the flight test programme.

Initially flight tests will be performed in Sweden and by the end of 2020, the aircraft will move to Brazil to continue the flight test campaign in the country. In 2021, deliveries to the Brazilian Air force will begin.


“Together with the Brazilian industry, I am proud to be part of building a long-term strategic partnership with Brazil and the Brazilian Air Force. With Gripen Brazil will have one of the most advanced fighters in the world and the technology transfer programme will allow Brazil to develop, produce and maintain supersonic fighters,” says Håkan Buskhe, President and CEO of Saab.

“Gripen increases the operational capacity of the Brazilian Air Force and boosts a partnership that ensures transfer of technology to Brazil, fosters research and industrial development in both countries,” says Fernando Azevedo e Silva, Brazilian Minister for Defence.

The partnership with Brazil started in 2014 with the contract (order value 39.3 BSEK) for the development and production of 36 Gripen E/F for the Brazilian Air Force, including related systems, support and equipment. Saab is driving the development of the local aeronautics industry through its national partners in the Brazilian Gripen programme, which includes a comprehensive transfer of technology programme to Brazil, to be delivered over approximately ten years.

The Brazilian Gripen E/F aircraft are developed and produced with the participation of Brazilian technicians and engineers. This integration is part of the transfer of technology and aims to provide practical knowledge necessary for the execution of these same activities in Brazil. Starting in 2021, the complete aircraft assembly of 15 aircraft will begin in Brazil. Development of the two-seat Gripen F is progressing with extensive activities at Gripen Design and Development Network in Gavião Peixoto, Brazil. Gripen F deliveries are expected to start in 2023.

https://saab.com/gripen/our-fighters/evolution/saab-presents-first-gripen-e-to-brazil/

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

What is your definition of mature? Gripen E testing has just started.


Gripen E testing ahead of schedule, vendor claims
By: Christina Mackenzie   May 24, 2019

The Gripen E fighter. (Saab photo)

LINKÖPING, Sweden — Flight-testing of Saab’s Gripen E combat aircraft is moving faster than anticipated, according to Eddy de la Motte, vice president and head of the Gripen E/F business unit at Swedish manufacturer Saab.

De la Motte told a media briefing that tests to fire MBDA’s Meteor missile had been carried out by test aircraft 39-8 and 39-9 in northern Sweden. “We’d planned two weeks for the testing and were able to get everything done in one,” the executive remarked, adding, “We’re getting more out of each individual flight test hour than we’d anticipated, which is helping to move the program forward.”

Today the flight envelope is being expanded, with 9g being achieved earlier this month, according to the company. Test pilot Marcus Wandt explained that although the aircraft is heavier than the Gripen C, “the agility is still there because it’s stronger and carries its weight very well.” Wandt and his five colleagues have flown 125 test hours.


2nd Gripen E takes flight
Saab's second Gripen E aircraft has taken to the skies, setting the program up for deliveries starting in 2019.

By: Jeff Martin
The first Gripen E for Sweden will be delivered this year to the test and evaluation force made up of personnel from Saab and the Swedish Air Force.

The first of the 36 aircraft ordered by Brazil (28 single-seater E versions and 8 twin-seater F versions) for $4.16 billion will be delivered to the Brazilian Air Force in 2021, but the first pilots will come to Sweden next January to start training.


Mikael Franzen, vice president and head of the Gripen Brazil business unit, explained that the two production lines for the aircraft – one in Sweden and one in Brazil – would both be used to produce aircraft that may be ordered by other clients in the future. Franzen said eight aircraft would be built by Brazilians in Sweden (four Fs and four Es) to ensure that the Brazilians were totally at ease with the building processes, and 15 would be built in Brazil by Brazilians and 13 by Swedes in Sweden. The two-seater Gripen F, developed specifically for Brazil and 65 cm longer than the E nevertheless has systems and displays that are identical as in the E version.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...en-e-testing-ahead-of-schedule-vendor-claims/


Saab has taken another important step in the delivery of Gripen E to the Brazilian customer.
Marked by a ceremony in Linköping, Sweden, on 10 September, the first Brazilian Gripen E aircraft was delivered to start the flight test programme.

Initially flight tests will be performed in Sweden and by the end of 2020, the aircraft will move to Brazil to continue the flight test campaign in the country. In 2021, deliveries to the Brazilian Air force will begin.


“Together with the Brazilian industry, I am proud to be part of building a long-term strategic partnership with Brazil and the Brazilian Air Force. With Gripen Brazil will have one of the most advanced fighters in the world and the technology transfer programme will allow Brazil to develop, produce and maintain supersonic fighters,” says Håkan Buskhe, President and CEO of Saab.

“Gripen increases the operational capacity of the Brazilian Air Force and boosts a partnership that ensures transfer of technology to Brazil, fosters research and industrial development in both countries,” says Fernando Azevedo e Silva, Brazilian Minister for Defence.

The partnership with Brazil started in 2014 with the contract (order value 39.3 BSEK) for the development and production of 36 Gripen E/F for the Brazilian Air Force, including related systems, support and equipment. Saab is driving the development of the local aeronautics industry through its national partners in the Brazilian Gripen programme, which includes a comprehensive transfer of technology programme to Brazil, to be delivered over approximately ten years.

The Brazilian Gripen E/F aircraft are developed and produced with the participation of Brazilian technicians and engineers. This integration is part of the transfer of technology and aims to provide practical knowledge necessary for the execution of these same activities in Brazil. Starting in 2021, the complete aircraft assembly of 15 aircraft will begin in Brazil. Development of the two-seat Gripen F is progressing with extensive activities at Gripen Design and Development Network in Gavião Peixoto, Brazil. Gripen F deliveries are expected to start in 2023.

https://saab.com/gripen/our-fighters/evolution/saab-presents-first-gripen-e-to-brazil/

The first flight of the Gripen A/B was in 1989 or 31 years ago, and it was operative in 1996.
After that the Gripen C/D was developed making it NATO compatible.
Gripen E is the third generation, which has lots of new avionics, but these has been tested on the Gripen NG which was rebuilt from a Gripen D, and this has been flying for 10 years.
Every thing in the Gripen E builds on the experience they have had with the earlier versions.
An example is the radar. While the Raven radar AESA frontend is from Leonardo, the backend is proprietary SAAB and uses the same or extended detection algorithms to improve detection of stealth aircrafts as the MS20 release for the Gripen C/D for the PS-05/A non AESA radar.

 

[airomerix]

@Windjammer @araz @airomerix @Path-Finder @Imran Khan
Why Pakistan back in 2000s did not buy
Saab Gripen?

It had an American engine. And it was not as capable as a Block 52 in terms of maturity. Block 52's made sense and US was happy giving them to us. It created jobs for them aswell. Its never about the aircraft. It is about the bigger picture.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

It had an American engine. And it was not as capable as a Block 52 in terms of maturity. Block 52's made sense and US was happy giving them to us. It created jobs for them aswell. Its never about the aircraft. It is about the bigger picture.

That is just sour grapes.
Immediately when Pakistan showed interest it was told to forget Gripen.
There was no evaluation, no discussion, no negotiation at all.

 

[Haris Ali2140]

That is just sour grapes.
Immediately when Pakistan showed interest it was told to forget Gripen.
There was no evaluation, no discussion, no negotiation at all.

What was the condition of gripen program in early 2000???

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

What was the condition of gripen program in early 2000???

Gripen A/B was in production with first deliveries in 1996.
Sweden ordered a total of 204 Gripen.
The same year, it was decided the remainder of the order (about half) would be the upgraded NATO compatible C/D version. It was also decided to reduce the size of the Air Force, first to 140, then to 100 aircraft. All the ordered aircrafts were delivered, but the surplus aircrafts were sold or leased to other countries that passed through the needlehole.

Swedish Law requires that any interested buyer is evaluated according to a number of criteria, which are weighed together to give a go, no go for a weapons sale.
How democratic a country is has quite heavy weight. Military Coups likewise but results in anegative rating. Once someone gets approval, follow on orders of spares etc are generally not a problem, even if conditions change.

With a series of military coups, it was obvious Pakistan would not make the cut.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

That is just sour grapes.
Immediately when Pakistan showed interest it was told to forget Gripen.
There was no evaluation, no discussion, no negotiation at all.

You can keep thinking what ever you want to satisfy your tiny ego. As far as PAF is concerned - after lifting of sanctions (due to joining WOT) PAF was looking for 4th gen aircrafts and Grippen may have been looked at as F16s were not available. Once F16s were allowed with proper configurations it was a no brainer for PAF, as it ALREADY has them along with the infrastructure and trained pilots. The deal wasn't just for the 18 block 52s but also used F16s and MLUs of existing F16. No deal from Saab can ever beat this. And yes your country did allow a much more capable and sophisticated force multiplier called SAAB Erieye - we had to really go for this one from Sweden as Uncle SAM did not clear AWACS sale which PAF had been trying since 80s; so we had to settle with what ever Sweden could offer ( Israel was a no go, Chinese options weren't mature).

Gripen A/B was in production with first deliveries in 1996.
Sweden ordered a total of 204 Gripen.
The same year, it was decided the remainder of the order (about half) would be the upgraded NATO compatible C/D version. It was also decided to reduce the size of the Air Force, first to 140, then to 100 aircraft. All the ordered aircrafts were delivered, but the surplus aircrafts were sold or leased to other countries that passed through the needlehole.

Swedish Law requires that any interested buyer is evaluated according to a number of criteria, which are weighed together to give a go, no go for a weapons sale.
How democratic a country is has quite heavy weight. Military Coups likewise but results in anegative rating. Once someone gets approval, follow on orders of spares etc are generally not a problem, even if conditions change.

With a series of military coups, it was obvious Pakistan would not make the cut.

Just the usual hypocritical BS you have been spouting about this PAF affair with Grippen and how Sweden rejected it. Erieyes were sold to the same military dictator regime. AWACS are a much bigger force multiplier than a fighter jet. Before you pull out another BS argument about offensive vs defensive weapons: AWACS >> Fighter jets. The capability boost from AWACS are much greater than a Fighter aircraft. In Pakistans case it already has fighter jets but was missing AWACS badly after India went for Phalcons. To illustrate the point Pakistan had been begging US for E3s but they were never cleared - but F16s blk 52s were along with AIM 120Cs were!! So it makes no sense why Sweden would block Grippens but allow Erieyes to the same Dictator regime. I think you are just trying to promote Grippen by stating that a professional airforce like PAF wanted Grippen instead of F16s (despite being an existing user!), and the only reason for no sale was denial by Sweden due to HR issues - where as reality is opposite as PAF never pursued Grippens seriously once door to F16s was open. The sour grapes seemed to be stuck in your throat instead.

 

[airomerix]

That is just sour grapes.
Immediately when Pakistan showed interest it was told to forget Gripen.
There was no evaluation, no discussion, no negotiation at all.

Pakistan showed interest in Eurofighter aswell. Mirage 2000 has been evaluated multiple times. So what?

We never had the financial security to experiment with a new platform back in the day. Sour grapes or not. F-16 was the most logical choice. And the best one. Time has proven it.

Gripen A/B was in production with first deliveries in 1996.
Sweden ordered a total of 204 Gripen.
The same year, it was decided the remainder of the order (about half) would be the upgraded NATO compatible C/D version. It was also decided to reduce the size of the Air Force, first to 140, then to 100 aircraft. All the ordered aircrafts were delivered, but the surplus aircrafts were sold or leased to other countries that passed through the needlehole.

Swedish Law requires that any interested buyer is evaluated according to a number of criteria, which are weighed together to give a go, no go for a weapons sale.
How democratic a country is has quite heavy weight. Military Coups likewise but results in anegative rating. Once someone gets approval, follow on orders of spares etc are generally not a problem, even if conditions change.

With a series of military coups, it was obvious Pakistan would not make the cut.

Oh please.

Either its your lack of information or you have some idiotic agenda.

Gripen has been repeatedly offered to Saudi's despite for all the wrong things they are famous for. And they are far from democracy.

And as someone said, SAAB 2000 is a 10x times more complex and lethal platform. You like it or not, PN has also considered acquiring Swordfish just a few years ago as a P-3 replacement.

Hence this democracy BS is nothing but some sort of misfire from your end.

 

[SQ8]

It had an American engine. And it was not as capable as a Block 52 in terms of maturity. Block 52's made sense and US was happy giving them to us. It created jobs for them aswell. Its never about the aircraft. It is about the bigger picture.

straight answer from the chief during a casual meeting “We need a bomber(strike fighter), not another ADA light fighter - we have the JF-17 for that”

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

You can keep thinking what ever you want to satisfy your tiny ego. As far as PAF is concerned - after lifting of sanctions (due to joining WOT) PAF was looking for 4th gen aircrafts and Grippen may have been looked at as F16s were not available. Once F16s were allowed with proper configurations it was a no brainer for PAF, as it ALREADY has them along with the infrastructure and trained pilots. The deal wasn't just for the 18 block 52s but also used F16s and MLUs of existing F16. No deal from Saab can ever beat this. And yes your country did allow a much more capable and sophisticated force multiplier called SAAB Erieye - we had to really go for this one from Sweden as Uncle SAM did not clear AWACS sale which PAF had been trying since 80s; so we had to settle with what ever Sweden could offer ( Israel was a no go, Chinese options weren't mature).



Just the usual hypocritical BS you have been spouting about this PAF affair with Grippen and how Sweden rejected it. Erieyes were sold to the same military dictator regime. AWACS are a much bigger force multiplier than a fighter jet. Before you pull out another BS argument about offensive vs defensive weapons: AWACS >> Fighter jets. The capability boost from AWACS are much greater than a Fighter aircraft. In Pakistans case it already has fighter jets but was missing AWACS badly after India went for Phalcons. To illustrate the point Pakistan had been begging US for E3s but they were never cleared - but F16s blk 52s were along with AIM 120Cs were!! So it makes no sense why Sweden would block Grippens but allow Erieyes to the same Dictator regime. I think you are just trying to promote Grippen by stating that a professional airforce like PAF wanted Grippen instead of F16s (despite being an existing user!), and the only reason for no sale was denial by Sweden due to HR issues - where as reality is opposite as PAF never pursued Grippens seriously once door to F16s was open. The sour grapes seemed to be stuck in your throat instead.

You simply don’t get it.
The sale of Gripen is not blocked because it can shoot down enemy fighters.
It is blocked because it can bomb civilians.
An AWACS cannot kill babies.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...’t-sell-gripen-jets-to-pakistan-(july-8).html

ISLAMABAD --- In a setback to Pakistan’s efforts to get new generation Swedish-made Gripen fighter planes, Stockholm has said that it will not sell any weapons or weapon-related equipment to Islamabad.

“There is no question of selling them weapons or anything directly related to weapons,” Swedish Foreign Minister Laila Freivalds said after her talks with visiting Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf in Stockholm yesterday.

Before his talks with Freivalds, Musharraf, who is currently on a tour of Scandinavian countries, said that Pakistan might be interested in purchasing JAS Gripen fighter planes from Sweden. “Pakistan is looking for a high-tech aircraft. Gripen is one of several alternatives,” he was quoted as saying by Swedish newswire TT.

And no, I do not claim that this was the only reason Pakistan did not buy Gripen.
I claim that Sweden rejected Pakistan as a Gripen customer the moment it became aware that Pakistan had an interest. There was no discussion, no evaluation.
The only negotiation was a ”NO WAY!”.

And no, Gripen has NEVER been marketed by SAAB to a single country in the Middle East.
British Aerospace might have done it, when they were cooerating with SAAB,
but I think such a sale would be blocked.

 

[airomerix]

You simply don’t get it.
The sale of Gripen is not blocked because it can shoot down enemy fighters.
It is blocked because it can bomb civilians.
An AWACS cannot kill babies.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...’t-sell-gripen-jets-to-pakistan-(july-8).html

ISLAMABAD --- In a setback to Pakistan’s efforts to get new generation Swedish-made Gripen fighter planes, Stockholm has said that it will not sell any weapons or weapon-related equipment to Islamabad.

“There is no question of selling them weapons or anything directly related to weapons,” Swedish Foreign Minister Laila Freivalds said after her talks with visiting Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf in Stockholm yesterday.

Before his talks with Freivalds, Musharraf, who is currently on a tour of Scandinavian countries, said that Pakistan might be interested in purchasing JAS Gripen fighter planes from Sweden. “Pakistan is looking for a high-tech aircraft. Gripen is one of several alternatives,” he was quoted as saying by Swedish newswire TT.

And no, I do not claim that this was the only reason Pakistan did not buy Gripen.
I claim that Sweden rejected Pakistan as a Gripen customer the moment it became aware that Pakistan had an interest. There was no discussion, no evaluation.
The only negotiation was a ”NO WAY!”.

And no, Gripen has NEVER been marketed by SAAB to a single country in the Middle East.
British Aerospace might have done it, when they were cooerating with SAAB,
but I think such a sale would be blocked.

You conveniently left out the original source. I can see why.

"Source: Press Trust of India; issued July 7, 2004)"

As for middle east, SAAB or BAE, Gripen was marketed to the Middle East.

I'd suggest you to come up with something original next time. Not some Indian media crap.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

You conveniently left out the original source. I can see why.

"Source: Press Trust of India; issued July 7, 2004)"

As for middle east, SAAB or BAE, Gripen was marketed to the Middle East.

I'd suggest you to come up with something original next time. Not some Indian media crap.

Plenty of sources in Swedish.

https://www.dn.se/nyheter/politik/freivalds-traffade-pakistans-ledare/

Sweden does not stops BAe from talking to the Saudis, but SAAB knows that it would be a waste of time.