Counter terrorism: ‘Arabic to be a compulsory subject’ in Pakistan

[Not Sure]

Might sound silly..but why can't the Quran be translated to any other language? Why it must be in Arabic only...take the Bible for instance...it is available in every language. People all over the world accept it without losing their cultural identity. A Christian in Mizoram reads his Bible in Mizo a Keralian would read it Malayalam and so on..nobody has to learn an alien language to read it. Same goes to their prayers...all Christians pray in their own language.

That is because Kuran is not Bible.

Bible got overwritten many times in history. Many sects came out with different interpretations, and even the radical ones have successfully survived - Quakers, Amish, Mormons etc just a handful of examples. Whereas, Kuran is supposed to be the same book, letter by letter, with strictly the same interpretation for all the followers. A slight deviation, and interpreter shall be considered a non-Muslim/Heretic/Apostate, and consequences can be bloody.

This is one of the basic reasons why Kuran must be studied in the very language that it was first narrated in.

You do understand that geographical features guide the culture of humans, and that culture in turn forms the basis of communication, or language, right? Because geographical features can be very different, so can be the cultures, and thus the difference in languages. So it is not necessary that the translation of Kuran may be the same as interpretation.

To help you understand a little - Paschim in Hindi means West. Paschatya - Western. Paschat - After/Latter. It comes from the fact that dawn comes later in the west, than in the east. In countries near the North Pole, the word for blue is a similar/same word for grass, which is supposed to be green. But the lack of light there makes it look blue. Translation of their works to any culture near the equator will make people feel grass is actually blue, which it is not.

So you see, translation of such words by an authority who has not studied both the languages and both the cultures thoroughly can create confusion and such confusion can create violent problems such as the Wahhabs and the Talibs.

Now you know.

 

[liall]

May be Kuran needs a bit of update as well. I read about how you can beat your wife and the rules. How about not beating at all? rofl

 

[Chronos]

May be Kuran needs a bit of update as well. I read about how you can beat your wife and the rules. How about not beating at all? rofl

That is going to take a massive, tectonic shift in religious and cultural thinking.

 

[HRK]

How about not beating at all? rofl

how about saathi custom .....

 

[Jayanta]

And

That is because Kuran is not Bible.

Bible got overwritten many times in history. Many sects came out with different interpretations, and even the radical ones have successfully survived - Quakers, Amish, Mormons etc just a handful of examples. Whereas, Kuran is supposed to be the same book, letter by letter, with strictly the same interpretation for all the followers. A slight deviation, and interpreter shall be considered a non-Muslim/Heretic/Apostate, and consequences can be bloody.

This is one of the basic reasons why Kuran must be studied in the very language that it was first narrated in.

You do understand that geographical features guide the culture of humans, and that culture in turn forms the basis of communication, or language, right? Because geographical features can be very different, so can be the cultures, and thus the difference in languages. So it is not necessary that the translation of Kuran may be the same as interpretation.

To help you understand a little - Paschim in Hindi means West. Paschatya - Western. Paschat - After/Latter. It comes from the fact that dawn comes later in the west, than in the east. In countries near the North Pole, the word for blue is a similar/same word for grass, which is supposed to be green. But the lack of light there makes it look blue. Translation of their works to any culture near the equator will make people feel grass is actually blue, which it is not.

So you see, translation of such words by an authority who has not studied both the languages and both the cultures thoroughly can create confusion and such confusion can create violent problems such as the Wahhabs and the Talibs.

Now you know.

Well it hasn't been bloody for the Christians though. There have been bibles in different languages in India and I haven't seen Christians from one area going for the throat of the other. Be it in one language or thousand it finally depends on the comprehension and interpretation of an individual. What is the point of having it in one language when it can be interpreted in different ways. Translation of a book in different language doesn't change its content and its message and translation is always done by a learned person not a novice. Any ways whatever keeps people happy..who am I to question. But again I fail to understand how will people in different parts of the world understand and follow the quran when they can just manage to read it as their spoken language or official language is completely different. Most of my Muslim friends have the basic knowledge of Arabic to read the quran and cannot speak it fluently neither can they understand it when somebody speaks in it. Going by your logic all Maulvis must be from Arab country because the Quran being in Arabic only an Arab will be person to interpret and teach it correctly.

Who about saathi custom .....

I think you got it wrong. It should be what about Sati??
1.Sati is not a custom.
2. According to Hinduism "Sati" is not to be practiced in "Kalyuga"..which is this period. So who ever practiced "Sati" were not Hindus by definition.

 

[HRK]

I think you got it wrong. It should be what about Sati??
1.Sati is not a custom.
2. According to Hinduism "Sati" is not to be practiced in "Kalyuga"..which is this period. So who ever practiced "Sati" were not Hindus by definition.

don't get me wrong but can you tell me who have a right to term any particular time period as "Kalyuga" or 'Satyayuga'..... ???

so my dear interpretation can be wrong ....... same way that troll should avoid to term or interpret Quran .....

 

[Jayanta]

don't get me wrong but can you tell me who have a right to term any particular time period as "Kalyuga" or 'Satyayuga'..... ???

so my dear interpretation can be wrong ....... same way that troll should avoid to term or interpret Quran .....

According to Hindu scriptures, all mortal beings are destined to pass through four great epochs in every cycle of creation and destruction. This divine cycle turns full-circle at the end of what is known as kalpa. A kalpa is a yuga cycle, which is a period of 10,000 divine years, and is divided into four ages or yugas (Sanskrit yuga = age/epoch). According to one calculation, oneyuga cycle is estimated to be 4,320,000 years, and one kalpa 4,320,000,000 years.

The four great epochs in Hinduism are: Satya Yuga, Treta Yuga, Dwapar Yuga and Kali Yuga.Satya Yug or the Age of Truth is said to last for four thousand divine years, Treta Yuga for three thousand, Dwapara Yug for two thousand and Kali Yuga will last for one thousand divine Years that equals to 432,000 earthly years. Current yuga is the Kaliyuga..or Kalyuga.
We live in the Kali Yuga — in a world infested with impurities and vices. People possessing genial virtues are diminishing day by day. Floods and famine, war and crime, deceit and duplicity characterize this age. This will lead to the end and the cycle will begin again.

 

[liall]

how about saathi custom .....

may be you should said something like yup needs to be changed it is wrong etc. but nope you have to go there lol. and yea I agree sati WAS wrong. We outlawed it can you say the same about your kuran?

 

[Kambojaric]

Why all the negativity...Do you know why the Arab have problems because everyone is grossed into Hadith and proving the other's Madhab wrong rather than adhering to the Quran....

Changing a language may not "wipe out" all the evil but it may "that is if people have neurons" help people understand the "real" meaning in the Quran and decrease the number new recruits who blindly follow thinking they are doing good...

I understand your point but still believe it is very optimistic to believe that it will decrease the number of people with extremist beliefs. Even if for arguments sake it does help reduce extremism, that still doesn't take away the fact that this language programme is for primary school kids i.e. not a solution for the near future. Terrorist attacks are happening today, extremist groups are shooting down shias today, clashes are taking place at ashoura today. For the near future hence the only solution I see is that we need greater control over extremist mullahs and ensure any one who preaches hate is punished and made an example of. But do i see this happening? Unfortunately no.

 

[cyphercide]

That is because Kuran is not Bible.

Bible got overwritten many times in history. Many sects came out with different interpretations, and even the radical ones have successfully survived - Quakers, Amish, Mormons etc just a handful of examples. Whereas, Kuran is supposed to be the same book, letter by letter, with strictly the same interpretation for all the followers. A slight deviation, and interpreter shall be considered a non-Muslim/Heretic/Apostate, and consequences can be bloody.

Therein lies the rub. Why must there be any consequences at all? To claim that every Muslim is on the same page when it comes to his/her faith is a bit exaggerated.

All religions represent debunked superstitions and heavily rely on liberal interpretations to survive . Islam is no different than the "edited" bible when it comes to dealing with facts or scientific scrutiny.

So you see, translation of such words by an authority who has not studied both the languages and both the cultures thoroughly can create confusion and such confusion can create violent problems such as the Wahhabs and the Talibs.

Didn't you just claim that all Muslims stick to the same interpretation when it comes to the Qur'an? How are the Wahhabis(aren't they Arabs in the first place? Fluency in the language and culture didn't play out so well, eh?) or the Taliban any different than the common Muslim? Who's to say that their viewpoint on Islam isn't the correct one as prescribed by Muhammad? By their standards, you would be the apostate trying to water down the Islamic way of life.

 

[HRK]

may be you should said something like yup needs to be changed it is wrong etc. but nope you have to go there lol. and yea I agree sati WAS wrong. We outlawed it can you say the same about your kuran?

Mr. Troll if you have no knowledge don't speak off topic ....

 

[liall]

Mr. Troll if you have no knowledge don't speak off topic ....

I just said that Quran says you can beat your wife and rules regarding how to do it. DENY me if it is not there. Oh it is there Oh you can not deny me oh to you it is off topic well what ever then.

 

[Dubious]

I understand your point but still believe it is very optimistic to believe that it will decrease the number of people with extremist beliefs. Even if for arguments sake it does help reduce extremism, that still doesn't take away the fact that this language programme is for primary school kids i.e. not a solution for the near future. Terrorist attacks are happening today, extremist groups are shooting down shias today, clashes are taking place at ashoura today. For the near future hence the only solution I see is that we need greater control over extremist mullahs and ensure any one who preaches hate is punished and made an example of. But do i see this happening? Unfortunately no.

1st terrorist attacks are happening to sunni too...I dont know why when sunnis are targeted the news writes deobandis or brailvis why not just sunnis or sufis?

2ndly, here in Europe all manners and everything is thought at primary level because of the believe that if a child sees or learns good basics they will build on it as long as the environment is feeding good stuff...

Plus it is easier to get a primary school kid and teach them something then to tackle with a "made up my mind" teenager who will not listen to new ideas easily...

Well, as for punishing Mullah...Only way to punish such a jahil is expose he is a liar...but unfortunately such scums are given enough security to live like a prince!

I remember in some Masjids in UK (at least 3 of the ones I have prayed at) the Imam is chosen on the basis of which uncle has lived in the neighbourhood the longest not based on who has the most knowledge or which uncle is the oldest so as not to offend him...such attitude needs to be changed...Education over age should be preferred....This way you wont have people passing down the same wrong they heard from their forefathers...

 

[Dubious]

I just said that Quran says you can beat your wife and rules regarding how to do it. DENY me if it is not there. Oh it is there Oh you can not deny me oh to you it is off topic well what ever then.

1st mockery isnt going to get you anywhere....

Quran 4:34 as the "translation says":

Men are in charge of women by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth. So righteous women are devoutly obedient, guarding in [the husband's] absence what Allah would have them guard. But those [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them. But if they obey you [once more], seek no means against them. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted and Grand.

Tafsir:
“Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). Regarding the woman who is guilty of lewd, or indecent behavior, admonish her (if she continues in this indecency then), stop sharing her bed (if she still continues doing this lewd behavior, then), [set forth for her the clear meaning of either straighten up or else we are finished and when she returns to proper behavior take up sharing the bed with her again], but if she returns in obedience (to proper behavior and conduct) then seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.”

2ndly, there are rules like you said and its not hitting like the beating Asian men give their wives its a show of disagreement like when someone hits the table...you are allowed to hit your wive if she is not loyal to you in anyway...At this point any man will feel like hitting in anger (dont deny)...The hitting allowed is

1) there is beat then there is hit ....

2) hit is like a tap with a miswak stick ...

3) not to leave a mark (not sure if any of you have hit someone without leaving a mark)...

and I can also give you the ruling from scholar's point of view:

Muslim scholars say that the word "beating" is used in the verse, but it does not mean "physical abuse". They hold the view that it is no more than a light touch by siwak, or toothbrush.Some Muslims, such as Islamic feminist groups, argue that Muslim men use the text as an excuse for domestic violence.

However, some have translated "beat" as "separate", as Arabic in its nature is a multi-meaning language, and as such no word has a fixed sole meaning..

The word in question is Daraba (to set forth, to make a clear statement or proclamation)

And then we have a scholar going: "Finally, it is important to keep in mind anytime we discover something in the answers to actually be better than what we already have, we should be committed to change our position and accept that which is true over that which is false and take that which is better for that which is inferior." -Untitled Document

The word Daraba has more then one meaning and depends on the context....many translators use hit / beat or separate that is why I read the translations provided by more than 1 person ....This is my weakness I dont have much command of the Arabic language and I replace it by reading more than 1 translation however, not many do this hence teaching the Arabic language can avoid such confusions!

I have provided 1 link which I am not sure you will read but it has a detailed explanation of this 1 verse!

 

[Sugarcane]

1st mockery isnt going to get you anywhere....







2ndly, there are rules like you said and its not hitting like the beating Asian men give their wives its a show of disagreement like when someone hits the table...you are allowed to hit your wive if she is not loyal to you in anyway...At this point any man will feel like hitting in anger (dont deny)...The hitting allowed is

1) there is beat then there is hit ....

2) hit is like a tap with a miswak stick ...

3) not to leave a mark (not sure if any of you have hit someone without leaving a mark)...

and I can also give you the ruling from scholar's point of view:

Muslim scholars say that the word "beating" is used in the verse, but it does not mean "physical abuse". They hold the view that it is no more than a light touch by siwak, or toothbrush.Some Muslims, such as Islamic feminist groups, argue that Muslim men use the text as an excuse for domestic violence.

However, some have translated "beat" as "separate", as Arabic in its nature is a multi-meaning language, and as such no word has a fixed sole meaning..
The word in question is Daraba (to set forth, to make a clear statement or proclamation)

And then we have a scholar going: "Finally, it is important to keep in mind anytime we discover something in the answers to actually be better than what we already have, we should be committed to change our position and accept that which is true over that which is false and take that which is better for that which is inferior." -Untitled Document

The word Daraba has more then one meaning and depends on the context....many translators use hit / beat or separate that is why I read the translations provided by more than 1 person ....This is my weakness I dont have much command of the Arabic language and I replace it by reading more than 1 translation however, not many do this hence teaching the Arabic language can avoid such confusions!

I have provided 1 link which I am not sure you will read but it has a detailed explanation of this 1 verse!

Why you are wasting your time, they are here to ridicule. Let them do it and feel good. .