Comparitve analysis of anthropometric parameters among Various groups in Karachi

[Progressive1]

Karachi has all groups of Pakistan

some observations

Sindhis are tallest at 172.9cm
than Pashtuns at 171.3cm
than Punjabis at 170cm
urdu people 169.8cm
Balochs are shortest put i guess it could be sample bias because of few samples


Some encouraging things are that height is not that short by third world standards

also Lean Body mass (LBM)of pakistanis is actually quite good and better than many richer countries , lean body mass shows athletic potential and comes from high proten diet like meat and eggs. I think this correlate well with the fact the how many natural fast bowlers pakistan produce.

BMI though normal is on higher side , I think its because of lot of oil in our food

@Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8
@Indus Pakistan

and other who are interested


complete paper

View of Comparative Analysis of the Anthropometric Parameters Among the Ethnic Groups of Karachi

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

critical data

On a different note----Shoaib Akhtar represents probably peak Subcontinental genetics (if we keep those on the Western side of the Indus out of the equation for argument's sake)

 

[Progressive1]

critical data

On a different note----Shoaib Akhtar represents probably peak Subcontinental genetics (if we keep those on the Western side of the Indus out of the equation for argument's sake)

people in south asia are grossly minimizing their look potential , yeah there are certain things that change over generations of high living standards and we cant do much about it in one life time , but certain things are pretty much in our control

Lean physique with body fat below 15 percent and high lean muscle

debloating of face for pronouced features , avoiding sugar intake.

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

people in south asia are grossly minimizing their look potential , yeah there are certain things that change over generations of high living standards and we cant do much about it in one life time , but certain things are pretty much in our control

Lean physique with body fat below 15 percent and high lean muscle

debloating of face for pronouced features , avoiding sugar intake.

Regarding looks and phenotype I have some comments to make...I understand it is not so cut and dried..and I can understand @Indus Pakistan 's frustration when his carefully considered words are tossed to the wayside...I have had some time to think on the India Pakistan phenotypical difference and I have more or less refined my previous ideas..Here in Germany you do get your fair share of Pakistani time to time..When I was in Uni, I had also befriended quite a few Pakistani students...and these days while standing in the aisle in supermarkets or while waiting for trains on platforms, you kind of figure out within the first second itself whether the approaching group of boys are Indians or Pakistanis if they have some what of a South Asian silhouette or gait..The Pakistanis are invariably taller, straighter hair, more aquiline nose , thinner lips, more defined jaw, less stocky and more ectomorph/mesomorph mix (within limits, not like Germans) while Indians are more stocky, shorter, more waivier hair, blunter nose, almost no jawline more ectomorph/endomorph mix....This besides the skin colour thing


I think as far as neighbouting countries and change in phenotype goes there are only few places in the Old World (Eurasia+Africa) that capture the rapid phenotype change between India and Pakistan...and then it dawned on me :

Historically there is one place that captures rather well the looks gradient between India and Pakistan, and It would be Sudan and Egypt

85% of Indians (to be honest it is closer to 90% but not as high as 95%) look very different from Pakistanis, and its time both countries accepted that fact


The egypt-Sudan Map

This is a colonial era work should be taken with a pinch of salt but gives a general direction

If religion was not used as the sole criteria for identity in South Asia for the past 120 years, then these would be the more "natural/alternative nations" of South Asia


Funnily enough it is still 7 nations though, while in our present perumutation and combination it is;

1) Maldives

2) Sri Lanka

3) India

4) Bangladesh

5) Pakistan

6) Bhutan

7) Nepal

As if the hand of God compels us to break ourselves up into 6-7 self-governing political entities...there is only so much integration a region can withstand before chunks spilt off to make it more sustainable and manageable

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Most of my thinking on South Asia was formed during the reading I did in 1970s/80s. Long before internet. Most of the books were by British writers from 1850s-1950 period. Over time I chewed through dozens of these tomes which often had exquisite plates with maps, drawings and old style photographs. These books were really impressive works and would cost hundred of pounds today. Often many were only for referance use.

Over the years of course I have had time to modulate my thinking but the base remains. The good think about these referance books is they are for our purposes shorn of any bias or agenda. Meaning they look at South Asia from a European eye thus not afflicted by the prejudices or agendas we South Asians hold today. To them we are all South Asian.

Of course this is not to say the books are free from prejudic or agenda. They are but from a European and colonial perspective. Thus I find these books treasure trove of information that modern books written by Pakistani's or Indian's lack.

The map you have posted here is great example. With the caveat that people do move but nobody can deny that the classification given in that map is very good. A good example of agenda is how India has invented this "Hindi" belt which has carved out a huge region around the Ganga basin and made a artificial group. But this has been done for political reasons.

And nobody can deny that the term Ary-Dravidian is apt. If you look at a average person from Patna they will look like a Sikh but with a aboriginal twist thrown in. This of course comes from the tribals who formed bulk of the population in jungles of Ganga basin before civilization arrived. Even today in isolated jungles of Jharkand etc you can see the orginal Indians living a very basic life. Pure examples of such tribals in the Indian population is small but 100s of millions in the Ganga basin carry some genetic inheritance from the aborginal population of the region. This is obvious to any fool.

You can see this influence on the face of the late Indian PM Narasimha Rao. The effect of this strain is even visible in Pakistan although the incidence is lower with Sindh and Karachi being most common because of population movements. So potent is this strain that I have even seen signs of this on faces of some Afghans. I suspect at some level people from Afghanistan to Burma to Sri Lanka carry this aboriginal Indian influence even if it is trace amounts.

But India is the pool of this strain.

 

[Progressive1]

Regarding looks and phenotype I have some comments to make...I understand it is not so cut and dried..and I can understand @Indus Pakistan 's frustration when his carefully considered words are tossed to the wayside...I have had some time to think on the India Pakistan phenotypical difference and I have more or less refined my previous ideas..Here in Germany you do get your fair share of Pakistani time to time..When I was in Uni, I had also befriended quite a few Pakistani students...and these days while standing in the aisle in supermarkets or while waiting for trains on platforms, you kind of figure out within the first second itself whether the approaching group of boys are Indians or Pakistanis if they have some what of a South Asian silhouette or gait..The Pakistanis are invariably taller, straighter hair, more aquiline nose , thinner lips, more defined jaw, less stocky and more ectomorph/mesomorph mix (within limits, not like Germans) while Indians are more stocky, shorter, more waivier hair, blunter nose, almost no jawline more ectomorph/endomorph mix....This besides the skin colour thing


I think as far as neighbouting countries and change in phenotype goes there are only few places in the Old World (Eurasia+Africa) that capture the rapid phenotype change between India and Pakistan...and then it dawned on me :

Historically there is one place that captures rather well the looks gradient between India and Pakistan, and It would be Sudan and Egypt

85% of Indians (to be honest it is closer to 90% but not as high as 95%) look very different from Pakistanis, and its time both countries accepted that fact


The egypt-Sudan Map

This is a colonial era work should be taken with a pinch of salt but gives a general direction

If religion was not used as the sole criteria for identity in South Asia for the past 120 years, then these would be the more "natural/alternative nations" of South Asia


Funnily enough it is still 7 nations though, while in our present perumutation and combination it is;

1) Maldives

2) Sri Lanka

3) India

4) Bangladesh

5) Pakistan

6) Bhutan

7) Nepal

As if the hand of God compels us to break ourselves up into 6-7 self-governing political entities...there is only so much integration a region can withstand before chunks spilt off to make it more sustainable and manageable

i also live in germany from last one year for my masters, many indians here seem to be south indian IT types , like i havent confuse a group of even 3 indians for pakistanis . Though on indivisual level I would say there is an overlap (ca) 20/25%. Also Many pakistanis aborad are from lahore and karachi and cities , if you take people from rural parts of pakistan , difference would be greater.

 

[FuturePAF]

N is too small: very small sample size to draw an accurate conclusion.

 

[Progressive1]

N is too small: very small sample size to draw an accurate conclusion.

For detailed body mass analysis , its enough in case of urdu , sindhis , pathans and punjabis , if it was only height than we can say it is small.

 

[Gangetic]

Most of my thinking on South Asia was formed during the reading I did in 1970s/80s. Long before internet. Most of the books were by British writers from 1850s-1950 period. Over time I chewed through dozens of these tomes which often had exquisite plates with maps, drawings and old style photographs. These books were really impressive works and would cost hundred of pounds today. Often many were only for referance use.

Over the years of course I have had time to modulate my thinking but the base remains. The good think about these referance books is they are for our purposes shorn of any bias or agenda. Meaning they look at South Asia from a European eye thus not afflicted by the prejudices or agendas we South Asians hold today. To them we are all South Asian.

Of course this is not to say the books are free from prejudic or agenda. They are but from a European and colonial perspective. Thus I find these books treasure trove of information that modern books written by Pakistani's or Indian's lack.

The map you have posted here is great example. With the caveat that people do move but nobody can deny that the classification given in that map is very good. A good example of agenda is how India has invented this "Hindi" belt which has carved out a huge region around the Ganga basin and made a artificial group. But this has been done for political reasons.

And nobody can deny that the term Ary-Dravidian is apt. If you look at a average person from Patna they will look like a Sikh but with a aboriginal twist thrown in. This of course comes from the tribals who formed bulk of the population in jungles of Ganga basin before civilization arrived. Even today in isolated jungles of Jharkand etc you can see the orginal Indians living a very basic life. Pure examples of such tribals in the Indian population is small but 100s of millions in the Ganga basin carry some genetic inheritance from the aborginal population of the region. This is obvious to any fool.

View attachment 727941

You can see this influence on the face of the late Indian PM Narasimha Rao. The effect of this strain is even visible in Pakistan although the incidence is lower with Sindh and Karachi being most common because of population movements. So potent is this strain that I have even seen signs of this on faces of some Afghans. I suspect at some level people from Afghanistan to Burma to Sri Lanka carry this aboriginal Indian influence even if it is trace amounts.

But India is the pool of this strain.


View attachment 727943

It's DNA from ancient South Indian hunter-gatherers. In the subcontinent, it's lowest in Afghan Tajiks (around 6-7%), and highest among some Dravidian groups (As high as 55-60%).

 

[Progressive1]

critical data

On a different note----Shoaib Akhtar represents probably peak Subcontinental genetics (if we keep those on the Western side of the Indus out of the equation for argument's sake)

a second thought , shoaib was bit of freak of nature , I woud say young waqar was best representative of a fit south asian.

 

[El Sidd]

a second thought , shoaib was bit of freak of nature , I woud say young waqar was best representative of a fit south asian.

Take Usain Bolts opinion for that if you may.

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

a second thought , shoaib was bit of freak of nature , I woud say young waqar was best representative of a fit south asian.

Shoaib Akhtar was like a South Asian Herschel Walker, Bo Jackson, Paulo Costa,Yoel Romero...even if whole of South Asia graduates to first world nutrition and zero parasitic load, i doubt we will see another specimen like that in our lifetimes....only through CRISPR Cas9 genetic editing will another Shoaib Akhtar be possible in our lifetime..i hope he married a younger woman, so that the next gen of his lineage has the best chance to surprass him