China's high risk India gamble

[CardSharp]

India we're coming to get you Muahahahaha

... really I don't get it.

You all seem to condemn the India media for sensationalizing the pretty insignificant incidents

Even a small slight can have major consequences on relations, because our media is not state controlled, and yes things will get hyped up.

Yet you're all buying into the version of events that the media presents. Needling, pinpricks etc etc. I'm sorry this all seems too imaginary and paranoid to me. What you may call keeping India in a low state equilibrium, I call international diplomacy. You don't see any intelligent China sources complain about US attempts at containing a rising China.

 

[RobbieS]

I


This has been a historic mistake - these relationships will always matter - they matter because they give leverage to others, and they deny you leverage

I disagree. And that was what my whole point was about. Increase your rivals' stakes in your well being so that there is no third-party leverage left. If India can be the second biggest trading partner of China (in the next 5-10 years?) and at the same time resolve its border disputes China will be forced to fore go any leverage via BD, SL etc. It simply wont want to spoil its relationship with India.

I'm not sure I'm convinced or rather I'm not as persuaded as you are that Indian diplomacy has succeeded in dehypenating India/Pakistan when it comes to US policy - The US has it's own imperatives, with regard to China, it needs India has a possible bugaboo and look, are those F16's really for terrorists? really?

My biggest proof is the Indo-US Nuclear deal. 12 years ago the US put sanctions on both India and Pakistan. Where do India and Pakistan stand now? Pakistan cried itself hoarse for an equal footing but none other than Bush himself clarified the difference in situation. I am sure you'd have read more about that than me. Agreed, Pak got a similar deal from China and may even get one from the US 5 years on, but the time-lag proves the de-hyphenation.

I know the F-16s arent meant for terrorists and the US knows that too. But they had to provide something for all the support for WoT. After $ biilions of damages, thousands of lives lost and a lost sovereignty, if Pak is happy with its block 52s, I dont consider that as a victory.

Now I do agree that the dehypenating bit is certainly a goal or an ambition - What do you think it will take to dehyphenate SinoPak ? Will it take territorial adjustments? Will it take excusing that Dalai Lama? Will it take improving relations with Pakistan?

If your answer to these is yes, then what beef do you have,? isn't this what I have been saying?

I believe you mean what can India to enable de-hyphenating Indo-Pak for China. And my answer to your questions above is no.

India has given a lot in case of the Tibet cause. It officially recognizes Tibet as a part of China. India isnt raising the issue of Aksai Chin either. So politically, India doesnt need to do anything more than just solving the border issues. Beyond that its all economic. We are competitors in many markets but beyond that there's a lot of scope for a close relationship.

 

[Paan Singh]

The indians talk about dehypenating and all boiling all over AfPak?? Kiya yeh khula tazad nahe??? hahahah

War or even skirmishes between India and China would be in best favour of USA as it would re-establish it as stable economy and reduce the clout of CHina and India..The biggest loser would still be India. Never trust the American war machine!

india is not fool that it will sit in u.s hands and fight with china.we have to fight alone if needed.india is just preparing to get u.s,israeli ammunition.and india have learned a lot from u.s occupation and slavery in this region.so india not going to repeat it on its own.

 

[RobbieS]

India we're coming to get you Muahahahaha

... really I don't get it.

You all seem to condemn the India media for sensationalizing the pretty insignificant incidents


Yet you're all buying into the version of events that the media presents. Needling, pinpricks etc etc. I'm sorry this all seems too imaginary and paranoid to me. What you may call keeping India in a low state equilibrium, I call international diplomacy. You don't see any intelligent China sources complain about US attempts at containing a rising China.

Cardsharp, we have discussed this before, Indian media is idiotic at times. Especially the Hindi and vernacular language ones. I feel like slapping each of the news anchors on these channels.

But I still see the visa-denial issue as avoidable. If only China had the fore-sight to warn India about not sending a General from J&K.

 

[CardSharp]

Cardsharp, we have discussed this before, Indian media is idiotic at times. Especially the Hindi and vernacular language ones. I feel like slapping each of the news anchors on these channels.

But I still see the visa-denial issue as avoidable. If only China had the fore-sight to warn India about not sending a General from J&K.

The chicken or the egg, Robbie my friend. Being as information poor as we are on subjects like this, we can't rule out that India knew the choice of a general from JK is controversial.

 

[RobbieS]

The chicken or the egg, Robbie my friend. Being as information poor as we are on subjects like this, we can't rule out that India knew the choice of a general from JK is controversial.

Point taken. I see what you mean. I wont rule that out. Perhaps India wanted to test China.

Anyways, as I replied to Muse, wrt China, India needs to de-hyphenate itself from Pak. Trade, economy, cultural, defence-whichever way possible. China is going to be the next superpower and India has to have a mutually exclusive relation with it.

 

[CardSharp]

Point taken. I see what you mean. I wont rule that out. Perhaps India wanted to test China.

Anyways, as I replied to Muse, wrt China, India needs to de-hyphenate itself from Pak. Trade, economy, cultural, defence-whichever way possible. China is going to be the next superpower and India has to have a mutually exclusive relation with it.

Yeah love-hate triangles are always going make for more drama. Maybe it will become possible to decouple India-China relationship from Pakistan after the Pak-Ind relationship improves. Won't be holding my breath though

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Cardsharp, we have discussed this before, Indian media is idiotic at times. Especially the Hindi and vernacular language ones. I feel like slapping each of the news anchors on these channels.

But I still see the visa-denial issue as avoidable. If only China had the fore-sight to warn India about not sending a General from J&K.

Yes Hindi news channels are only 'masala ' sellers..but i dont share the same openino when it comes to english news (cnn ibn,ndtv etc)channels..they are much more responsible

 

[lemurian]

India we're coming to get you Muahahahaha

... really I don't get it.

You all seem to condemn the India media for sensationalizing the pretty insignificant incidents


Yet you're all buying into the version of events that the media presents. Needling, pinpricks etc etc. I'm sorry this all seems too imaginary and paranoid to me. What you may call keeping India in a low state equilibrium, I call international diplomacy. You don't see any intelligent China sources complain about US attempts at containing a rising China.

The "pinpricks" comment was made by our PM. For whatever reason. What the media did was to sensationalize it. Rest of your comment, i totally agree with..

 

[siegecrossbow]

Kudos to everyone here for keeping things on topic and civil. I wish this is the way that all future discussions go!