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China Suspends U.S. Military Ties on Taiwan Arms Sale

First do that to Taiwan and then think about us ?

Oh I remember the last time you tried that more than 10000 Chinese Soldiers never came home.

:cheers:

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haha, there are many chinese、Yankee lost life in korea.But a shameless PM asked USA to negotiate at once,just for their impuissant army.

in korea,england like a clown.:D
 
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haha, there are many chinese、Yankee lost life in korea.But a shameless PM asked USA to negotiate at once,just for their impuissant army.

in korea,england like a clown.:D

We are not talking about UK and Korea you moron? The thread is about PLA impotence vs Taiwan.

Ok Young Lady ? Now back to the topic.

:coffee:
 
by the way, the topic should have been final, long ago...
so please,
if you really want to discussion "US-TW arms sales impact on China's national security" then start a new thread... since this is a "defense forum"
 
do you read?

This is the topic:
China Suspends U.S. Military Ties on Taiwan Arms Sale

Much better than you ?

The Chinese mpotence to deal with arms sale to Taiwan is more related to this discussion than UK vs Korea posted by your Moron brother whom you are trying hard to bail out. Correct him first.

Regards
 
Much better than you ?

The Chinese mpotence to deal with arms sale to Taiwan is more related to this discussion than UK vs Korea posted by your Moron brother whom you are trying hard to bail out. Correct him first.

Regards

yea he had also been off the topic, i have told him in previous post in Chinese and english. to post in a more civilize manner.
I am not against you for discussion but please make it more relevant to the thread itself [China Suspends U.S. Military Ties], by your understand, you will have to discussion every corner of China, which is just not possible.

The debate on this thread really is not about Taiwan, but how do Chinese PRC gov and US gov interact, and is there any possibilities of military actions. if yes, from where, who would how would they triggers it. Or is China going to support US enemies in terms of arms trade. And where will Taiwan military position itself(since there are two groups support either side)if tension between US and CN get worse. And of course there is a possibility of Chinese PRC giving up the fight, but what will it lose. etc etc

The whole thread is just off, its hard to believe it went all the way here without considering these questions... it just doesn't fit the category of this forum.
 
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yea he had also been off the topic, i have told him in previous post in Chinese and english. to post in a more civilize manner.
I am not against you for discussion but please make it more relevant to the thread itself [China Suspends U.S. Military Ties], by your understand, you will have to discussion every corner of China, which is just not possible.

The debate on this thread really is not about Taiwan, but how do Chinese PRC gov and US gov interact, and is there any possibilities of military actions. if yes, from where, who would how would they triggers it. Or is China going to support US enemies in terms of arms trade. And where will Taiwan military position itself(since there are two groups support either side)if tension between US and CN get worse. And of course there is a possibility of Chinese PRC giving up the fight, but what will it lose. etc etc

The whole thread is just off, its hard to believe it went all the way here without considering these questions... it just doesn't fit the category of this forum.

Fair enough if you wish to debate lets get to the military aspect of the supply.

Mr He said China was "strongly indignant" about the £4 billion package of weapons, which includes 114 Patriot anti-missile missiles, 60 Blackhawk helicopters and two minesweepers, which was submitted to the US Congress for approval on Friday

Now lets analyse each of the weapons

1. Patriot Technology is the best and there is no doubt in a conventional war fare scenario they will be used to protect important field formations from a first strike from China. The other spin off is that Missile Tech of Taiwan will get a real boost. I see in 10 years Taiwan having its own version of Iron Dome which will worry China no end.

2. A lot of internet warriors here talk about a mass saturation attack by missiles overwhelm the Patriot System. Such a mass attack can never take place as preparations for such a attack for several locations in China would be easily found out by Int systems.

3. The 60 Black Hawk helicopters are a very significant for logistic support but I doubt they have any significance effect on Taiwan's defensive capabilities.

3. The two mine hunters again are probably to keep the channels clean till the US Ships arrive.

All in all nothing to worry and hence China's reaction is muted since they have

1. Cut of barely existing Military Ties

2. Will follow up with sanctions against the companies who make such weapons.

Regards

They
 
Fair enough if you wish to debate lets get to the military aspect of the supply.

Mr He said China was "strongly indignant" about the £4 billion package of weapons, which includes 114 Patriot anti-missile missiles, 60 Blackhawk helicopters and two minesweepers, which was submitted to the US Congress for approval on Friday

Now lets analyse each of the weapons

1. Patriot Technology is the best and there is no doubt in a conventional war fare scenario they will be used to protect important field formations from a first strike from China. The other spin off is that Missile Tech of Taiwan will get a real boost. I see in 10 years Taiwan having its own version of Iron Dome which will worry China no end.

2. A lot of internet warriors here talk about a mass saturation attack by missiles overwhelm the Patriot System. Such a mass attack can never take place as preparations for such a attack for several locations in China would be easily found out by Int systems.

3. The 60 Black Hawk helicopters are a very significant for logistic support but I doubt they have any significance effect on Taiwan's defensive capabilities.

3. The two mine hunters again are probably to keep the channels clean till the US Ships arrive.

All in all nothing to worry and hence China's reaction is muted since they have

1. Cut of barely existing Military Ties

2. Will follow up with sanctions against the companies who make such weapons.

Regards

They


Since its impossible to foresee such attack, and meanwhile I do not believe such action would be taken. I believe there are possibility that this was maybe barely a show, as half an hour ago a news from another member, telling me that, there is a very high chances that the PRC and US Gov actually pre-arranged this "show", which mean they had negotiated. The reaction has to been taken in order to reduce bounce back from the overall Chinese population . Negotiated matter seems to be related to Iran. although i was provided with no source, but seems possible to me.

That's all i can comment on this issue.
I am not here to fight against what ever reasonable comments, I may even accept them if they are reasonable
Of course, conclusion can only be made after dozens of different reasonable views.
I am here just to give a few comments and read a few comments
That's all. I do not need to conclude it to anyone, and is not necessary to, especially its just rude trying to force another being buying into ones views and comments.
 
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How China's anger could hurt ties with the U.S.
Mon, Feb 1 02:41 PM

China has threatened to punish the United States for plans to sell some $6.4 billion of arms to Taiwan, the disputed island that Beijing calls its own.

Here is how China's anger could be felt:

MILITARY TIES

China has said it will curtail military contacts with the United States, returning to a freeze imposed in 2008 after the Bush administration flagged the arms sale to Taiwan.

China's official Xinhua news agency said a planned visit by U.S. Defence Secretary Robert Gates later this year will be shelved, as will talks between the Chinese People's Liberation Army Chief of General Staff, Chen Bingde, and the Chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff, Mike Mullen. Mutual visits by Chinese and U.S. navy ships will also be affected, said the report.

Defence contacts between China and the United States have, however, always been limited and so there will be scant effect on U.S. operations. Some analysts have also said Beijing might stage more missile tests to demonstrate its anger.

COMMERCIAL SANCTIONS

China has said that U.S. companies involved in selling arms to Taiwan will face "corresponding sanctions", breaking with Beijing's long-standing reluctance to use formal sanctions in international disputes.

The vague warning did not specify when any sanctions would take effect, but companies that could be affected include Sikorsky Aircraft Corp, a unit of United Technologies Corp; Lockheed Martin Corp; Raytheon Co; and McDonnell Douglas, a unit of Boeing Co.

Beijing could face challenges that any such sanctions violate commitments to open trade it has made as a member of the World Trade Organisation. In response, it could argue the sanctions are a legitimate act to protect national security.

Even without official penalties, China can informally punish foreign governments and businesses through adverse decisions on tenders, contracts and regulatory disputes.

ECONOMIC AND CURRENCY TIES

China is the world's third-biggest economy, behind Japan and the United States, and holds foreign exchange reserves worth $2.4 trillion. Economists have estimated about two-thirds of those reserves are invested in U.S. dollar-denominated assets.

While China is the single biggest holder of U.S. Treasuries -- owning at least $776.4 billion of U.S. government debt at the end of June 2009, according to statistics -- there have been no signs Beijing will use broader trade penalties or its dollar holdings to punish Washington.

Doing that, or even hinting at it, would jeopardise the value of China's own assets and alarm investors. Beijing appears too focused on shoring up economic growth to risk such steps.

Trading in offshore one-year dollar/yuan non-deliverable forwards on Monday indicated investors foresee a slightly slower appreciation for China's yuan, with Beijing less willing to heed Washington's calls for a currency rise.

INTERNATIONAL COOPERATION

China has said cooperation with the United States over regional and international problems will be hurt by the dispute, but the Chinese Foreign Ministry did not spell out what issues could be affected.

The government is likely to show its anger in oblique ways, such as delaying talks or downgrading representation at them, rather than through substantive policy reversals.

Washington has looked for stronger Chinese support over several international worries, chiefly the nuclear ambitions of Iran and North Korea.

China is a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council, and so has the power to veto any proposed resolutions. Its rising influence and status as the world's biggest developing country also give it clout over issues such as climate change and international financial reforms.

BILATERAL DIPLOMACY

China's Foreign Ministry has cancelled one scheduled meeting between senior Chinese and U.S. officials, a vice-minister level meeting on strategic security, arms control and nuclear non-proliferation.

Other bilateral talks are also likely to be curtailed or downgraded. They could include a dialogue on human rights that President Barack Obama and President Hu Jintao agreed to during their summit in November.

It is less clear whether China will show its anger by delaying, shifting or downgrading regular Joint Commission on Commerce and Trade (JCCT) talks scheduled for later in the year, or the higher-level Strategic and Economic Dialogue due to be held in Beijing around mid-year.

Washington officials were recently in Beijing to discuss preparations for those two meetings, and Chinese President Hu is expected to visit the United States later this year.

PUBLIC OPINION

Chinese media and Internet sites have sounded public anger about the proposed arms sales and the dispute will stoke anti-American sentiment.

In a 2008 poll of Chinese public views of the United States by the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, 46 percent of respondents said the Taiwan issue was the biggest problem in China-U.S. relations -- by far the most popular response.

Public anger over the arms sales has already produced calls for boycotts of American companies and products. Similar protests against French, Japanese and U.S. companies in past years have erupted and then quickly petered out with little lasting effect on their sales in China.
 
The barking poodle Taiwan kicked PLA backside the last time it crossed the Taiwan straits. So PRC is so impotent that its only knee jerk reaction is halt something non-existent.

:woot:

:yahoo:

Impotence?

UK is more impotent than China!


Now International security depends on 4 : USA, China, Taiwan, Iran

UK is just a minion of USA.


If USA support Taiwan, why not China cannot support Iran (at least in UNSC).
 
The barking poodle Taiwan kicked PLA backside the last time it crossed the Taiwan straits. So PRC is so impotent that its only knee jerk reaction is halt something non-existent.

:woot:

:yahoo:

Hi

PLA has never attempted to cross the Taiwan Strait. I think you are referring to the attempted takeover of Kinmen:

Battle of Kuningtou - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

which is only 2 km from mainland at it's closest. It is a relatively small battle by civil war terms. It reflects more on the PLA's lack of transports rather than their offensive ability.
 
Since its impossible to foresee such attack, and meanwhile I do not believe such action would be taken.

THEN NOR SHOULD U PROTEST. WAIT 10 YEARS TILL THESE PATRIOTS BECOME OLD AND INEFFECTIVE.


That's all i can comment on this issue.
I am not here to fight against what ever reasonable comments, I may even accept them if they are reasonable

NOR AM I BUT NOR ARE U READY TO CHALLENGE UR BROS WHO SAY CPC IS FAIRER THAN THE ELECTED GOVT. OF TAIWAN ?

NOR DO YOU CHALLENGE GREY BOY WHO SAYS 90 % TAIWANESE LOVE MAINLAND CHINA AND HENCE GREY BOY SHOULD HAVE NO PROBLEMS WITH SOMEONE SELLING THEM A FEW MISSILES SO THAT THEY CAN SLEEP IN PEACE.


Of course, conclusion can only be made after dozens of different reasonable views.

HOW MANY TIMES HAVE U CHALLENGED THE VIEWS OF A GUY WITH CHINESE FLAG HERE WHEN HE CALLS PEOPLE PIRATES. THE MOST I HAVE SEEN IS A MILD PLEA IN CHINESE FOR WHICH HE HAS THANKED U. FIRST TIME I HAVE SEEN SOMEONE BEING REBUKED THANKING HIS REBUKER.

I am here just to give a few comments and read a few comments
That's all. I do not need to conclude it to anyone, and is not necessary to, especially its just rude trying to force another being buying into ones views and comments.

I INVITED YOU TO OPENING of A MILITARY DEBATE ON THE CAPABILITIES OF THE EQUIPMENT AS REQUESTED BY YOU AND WAS READY TO CARRY IT FORWARD WITH DATA ON KILL RATIO, CEP ETC, BUT YOU HAVE GIVEN A POLITICIANS SPEECH IN REPLY NOT WORTHY OF A DEFENCE FORUM.

Regards
 
Impotence?

UK is more impotent than China!


Now International security depends on 4 : USA, China, Taiwan, Iran

UK is just a minion of USA.


If USA support Taiwan, why not China cannot support Iran (at least in UNSC).

Good to see your finally been paid your salary ( What is the NGO called?) so you can post some horse manure.

Lets list

UK vis vis China and Pakistan sucesses from 1900 as we can get a perspective.

Saved the world including China from saying Gesundheit and Sayonara in WWII alongwith USA who you revile.

Only nation after USA to fight and win a battle more than 5000 miles away (Falkland)

Now your Masters China

Losses

Taiwan - Lost the battle and 10000 men.
Vietnam - Lost the battle again.
Russia - Lost the battle again.
India - Probably won it but still Tawang remains with India ?

Victories

Tiananmen - Well done.
Tibet - Well done.
Xinjiang - Well done.

Now to China's best friend Pakistan which u represent

1971 - Result Bangladesh.

1980 - Recognising taliban- result TTP bombing you back.

1999 - Kargil - Result 3000 NA soldiers dead as per BB and NS



We are still better of than you. First take over taiwan and then come and have a beer with us.

:cheers:
 
I INVITED YOU TO OPENING of A MILITARY DEBATE ON THE CAPABILITIES OF THE EQUIPMENT AS REQUESTED BY YOU AND WAS READY TO CARRY IT FORWARD WITH DATA ON KILL RATIO, CEP ETC, BUT YOU HAVE GIVEN A POLITICIANS SPEECH IN REPLY NOT WORTHY OF A DEFENCE FORUM.

Regards

Gee, done, I see no common sense in you.
I believe my post previous post has been polite enough.
I do not challenge "REASONABLE" comments...

You try printing all these replies, from the thread, ask anyone from other nationalities other than Indians... and see how they think...
its just unimaginable one could have such rude attitude with no respect towards other, and giving bunch of unbelievable comments.

even if you ask an American, in most case I bet they would also consider you and a lot you guys nuts.

from your previous reply on military view, it shows that you don't even see the main point from the topic, you are just look for a fight, Taiwan has never really been a big issue, although it played a role, but it really about China and US relations, what are the intention of US selling arms to Taiwan, trigger civil war?
and don't tell me Taiwan is a independent country since it never was, no matter how you think.

~ I am done here with you, I have no interest of continuing this with such maniac like you.
 
Gee, done, I see no common sense in you.
I believe my post previous post has been polite enough.
I do not challenge "REASONABLE" comments...

You try printing all these replies, from the thread, ask anyone from other nationalities other than Indians... and see how they think...
its just unimaginable one could have such rude attitude with no respect towards other, and giving bunch of unbelievable comments.

even if you ask an American, in most case I bet they would also consider you and a lot you guys nuts.

from your previous reply on military view, it shows that you don't even see the main point from the topic, you are just look for a fight, Taiwan has never really been a big issue, although it played a role, but it really about China and US relations, what are the intention of US selling arms to Taiwan, trigger civil war?
and don't tell me Taiwan is a independent country since it never was, no matter how you think.

~ I am done here with you, I have no interest of continuing this with such maniac like you.

Did you not suggest in a previous post, lets us debate militarily ? Patriot vs Dong Feng ?

If not than peace be with you.

:cheers:
 
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