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China may export J-10B fighters with Russian AL31FN-S3 engines to Pakistan

Yeah like the deal of u-boats is alive? Right... lol after making it linger for so many years we finally jumped to Chinese options irrespective of the reasons. Similarly fc-20 aka j10 deal hasn't reached any where after good 6 Years.. during 2010 the then ACM said fc20 deal would be finalized this year but after more than 5 years nothing has been materialized.. had there been something it would have been evident... you can't hide anything for so long... one way or the other it has to appear one day...

Lol and btw if paf officials are not to be believed than who is to be believed.. a fan boy who badly wants to see j-10 in paf just because he likes the aircraft. Besides it has been stated on various ocassions that the performance of j-10 is inferior to f16 c/d and at par with older variants... so why would one want to buy something that is inferior to what he can get second hand at way lower price from market without any hassle of maintenance and infrastructure because of commonality of platforms and because they have mastered that aircraft over the years
Hats off what a nice reply you stole my worlds.

Pak making efforts to get F16 they shall also not be free anf after upgradation costs will be quite match able to Chinese new jets. Further in case of AESA upgrade shall be more costly, due to Indian lobby and US influence we may not be able to get AESA upgrades for F16s.
our another all weather friend Turkey will do the upgrades not free but as a soft load as Turkey did if before.

As off my sources PAF also negotiating with UAE to get used mirages and F16 because they need new fighters and looking for a buyer. Comments Pls
 
Yeah like the deal of u-boats is alive? Right... lol after making it linger for so many years we finally jumped to Chinese options irrespective of the reasons. Similarly fc-20 aka j10 deal hasn't reached any where after good 6 Years.. during 2010 the then ACM said fc20 deal would be finalized this year but after more than 5 years nothing has been materialized.. had there been something it would have been evident... you can't hide anything for so long... one way or the other it has to appear one day...

Lol and btw if paf officials are not to be believed than who is to be believed.. a fan boy who badly wants to see j-10 in paf just because he likes the aircraft. Besides it has been stated on various ocassions that the performance of j-10 is inferior to f16 c/d and at par with older variants... so why would one want to buy something that is inferior to what he can get second hand at way lower price from market without any hassle of maintenance and infrastructure because of commonality of platforms and because they have mastered that aircraft over the years
I have PAF officials in family I know their lies and you want to believe your choice but J-10 B deal is not dead. You want live in delusions and believe lies nothing can be done about that but J-10 B was never closed it is alive and active. @al_asad_al_mulk
 
I have PAF officials in family I know their lies and you want to believe your choice but J-10 B deal is not dead. You want live in delusions and believe lies nothing can be done about that but J-10 B was never closed it is alive and active. @al_asad_al_mulk
Dear Zarvan i am not in delusions or denials as i am suspecting with respect you are the one. Good to know that you have PAF officials in your family and you would also know you must know Pak Armed forces officials can hide truths but they don't lie. J 10 B or FC-20 deal is very much dead until unless China offer it free or much discounted price.
 
I have PAF officials in family I know their lies and you want to believe your choice but J-10 B deal is not dead. You want live in delusions and believe lies nothing can be done about that but J-10 B was never closed it is alive and active. @al_asad_al_mulk[/Q

as i already said we have many members who have phupha chacha taya etc in military amazingly some of them tell respective members about top secret projects and on contrary there are some members whose phupha chacha and taya lie to them so they automatically come up with opposite conclusions
.. so I won't comment on that since it's quite a fun hearing new story every day.

Just for retrospect j-10 was first offered in 2006 to the then president of pakistan general Musharraf then in 2009 it was said the deal for 40 aircrafts have been signed but later in 2010 it was said by the then ACM that the deal hasn't been signed yet but it will be finalized during same year for 36 aircrafts... then there were rumors of delivering first aircraft in 2012... then in 2013 a report came stating deliveries will start from next year.. then there were rumors that paf will decide the purchase when India will decided the winner of mmrca but then again nothing m.. nada

Now you can connect the dots... but still if you want to believe otherwise up to you... but j10 deal is following the same course of u-boats and fate won't be different either
 
Future Export
Pakistan has negotiated with China for purchase of FC-31 with other military equipment including naval submarines and attack helicopters. Pakistan Air Force is looking to buy 30 to 40 of these aircraft. Pakistani Minister for Defence Production Rana Tanveer Hussain, claimed that the matter was being discussed with Chinese authorities for purchase of J-31. The minister was also quoted as saying that Pakistan was also interested in Chinese attack helicopter CAIC Z-10.
 
PAF needs three platforms and J-10 B are great option.
i agree with you to an extent. let me put it to you like this. if you as a Pakistan airforce pilot what do they prefer. j10b or f16 block 52 they will choose the f16 block 52hands down. also note some paf pilots have flown the j10b. in in the eyes of the air force it will focus on acquiring second hand f16's which are the same price as a new jf17 and then upgrade them to a blk 52 standard.

where as the j10b is concerned it is a very good competitor. i not able to asses its capabilities against a f16 blk 52+ but i would assume as a minimum it would be on the same level. and paf already has some j10b avionics on its jf-17. i do think the j10b is a good option as Pakistan can co produce them. and produce them quickly as they are familiar with Chinese planes (jf-17) and they are cheaper than a new f16 blk52.also the j10b has no strings/restrictions so no need to worry about having a contractor wondering around your base.

overall i say, buy them in bulk to licence/co-produce. you need at least 7 squadrons .18*7=126

this seems to be a possibility as the jet is cleared for export and Pakistan has already signed for 36 at 1.4 billion. i would expect a large follow on order to obtain a license to build at PAC this is after they finished building all of the jf-17's which is in 2018. or build another facility to build them. i doubt the second option. first is more of a reality.




File picture of the J-10B fighter of the Air Force of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLAAF)

  BEIJING, January 20 (ChinaMil) -- Pictures showed that 14 J-10B fighters painted with the mark of the Air Force of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLAAF) were on the parking apron at the airport of the Chengdu Aircraft Industrial Co., Ltd. under the Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), meaning that this type of modified fighter will possibly be deployed to the aviation troops of the PLAAF, according to a recent report on the website of the Jane's Defense Weekly.

  Zhang Zhaozhong, a military expert at the National Defense University (NDU), said in an interview with reporters from the China Central Television (CCTV) that the J-10B fighter is at least 30 percent better than the J-10A fighter in overall performance.

  In addition, it possesses advantages as compared with the third-generation fighters of China’s neighboring countries and the 3.5-generation fighters deployed in the Asia Pacific Region by the U.S., namely the J-10B fighter possesses advantages and does not lag behind.

  Zhang introduced that the medium-scale 3.5-generation J-10B fighter with a maximum take-off weight of 19 tons, a bomb load between 6 and 8 tons, a combat radius of about 1,000 kilometers and a flight speed between 1 and 1.5 mach, which is a modified model of the J-10A fighter, is equipped with an active phased-array radar and capable of carrying air-to-air missiles.

  The lower nose of the J-10B fighter than that of the J-10A fighter allows pilots have a broader field of vision, and the active phased-array radar with a diameter of about one meter mounted inside the oblate nose part of the fighter, as well as the electronic jammer and searching and tracking device mounted outside the fighter cabin, greatly upgrade the fighter’s electronic information system performance, Zhang said.

  In addition to the capability of carrying short-range dogfight ammunition, the J-10B fighter can carry medium-range interception missiles with a firing range of tens of kilometers, and at the same time, it is capable of attacking ground targets. Therefore, its combat effectiveness is upgraded with an overall performance improvement of over 30 percent as compared with that of the J-10A fighter, Zhang introduced.

  Different from the previous radars which could only inactively receive signals, the active phased-array radar with the electronic scanning capability, installed on the J-10B fighter, is “just like 2,000 eyes equipped with telescopes in a one-square-meter radar area”, being conducive to seize the air space control, Zhang Zhaozhong analyzed.

  Its medium-range interception missiles with a firing range between 70 and 80 kilometers can keep any enemy airplanes far away from its guarding area so as to protect its own safety. Moreover, this type of missile with the tracking and striking capability has a very high hit probability, namely, a target can rarely escape once being locked, Zhang disclosed.

  The J-10A fighter is mainly used for territorial air defense, namely intercept and expel the planes which have invaded China’s territory. “While, the J-10B fighter, as a type of multi-purpose fighter, can not only undertake the territorial air defense tasks, but also carry out active attack,” Zhang analyzed.

  As for the question if China-made engine is installed on the J-10B fighter, Zhang Zhaozhong said that it is possible for trail use of China-made “Taihang” engine on the J-10B fighter.

  “Although the performance of the ‘Taihang’ engine is better than that of AF-31F engine imported from Russia, such factors as reliability and service life of the ‘Taihang’ engine have to be determined through many years’ trials. These are gaps which China should still spend a lot time to narrow,” Zhang said.

  But, if the J-10B fighter goes into mass production in the future, it is sure that China’s independently developed engine should be installed on it, Zhang stressed.

  Zhang Zhaozhong also expressed that although the current test flights of China’s J-20 stealth fighter are successful, it will take at least a decade to finish its final design and put it into mass production, and during the period before the J-20 is put to use, the J-10B fighter can make up for the shortcoming of the J-10A fighter, maintaining the combat power of the PLAAF effectively.

  No doubt, the J-10B fighter possesses advantages over such fighters as the Su-30 and the F-15J imported by China’s neighboring countries including India and Japan, and it is even an advanced fighter and not lags behind as compared with the 3.5-generation fighters deployed in China’s neighboring areas by the U.S., added Zhang Zhaozhong.

source :( www.http://english.chinamil.com)
 
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Future Export
Pakistan has negotiated with China for purchase of FC-31 with other military equipment including naval submarines and attack helicopters. Pakistan Air Force is looking to buy 30 to 40 of these aircraft. Pakistani Minister for Defence Production Rana Tanveer Hussain, claimed that the matter was being discussed with Chinese authorities for purchase of J-31. The minister was also quoted as saying that Pakistan was also interested in Chinese attack helicopter CAIC Z-10.
If Wikipedia is your source than GOD help you and @Mani2020 deal was never signed in 2009. The deal is pretty much on and running.
 
If Wikipedia is your source than GOD help you and @Mani2020 deal was never signed in 2009. The deal is pretty much on and running.
@Zarvan ok look this way suppose you are the deciding authority ok to decide the purchase of 40 fighter jets what you look for your personal choice or what exactly our air force need.
1-If we buy J10 B we have to train our pilots ground staff and build infrastructures for maintenance and lot of other stuff, moreover J10 B is not superior to F16 and not much to JF 17.
2-If we buy F16 block 52+ or F16 with mlu upgrade which is superior to J10 B we need nothing to sorry we have trained pilots have trained ground staff have lot of quality weapons and support infrastructures.

So what you decide give me a reasoning reply not personal choice.

@Zarvan PAF is now looking for 4 + generation aircraft we don't have enough money to purchase 4th Gen planes and again 4th + we already have good numbers of F16 and JF 17 so we no need to get more same generation planes. Our air force have history to maintain small number of advanced Jets whenever we get like F16 in 80s. So as per my source they are looking for Chinese FC-31 when available meanwhile they supplemented current stock with F16 and JF 17s.
 
@Zarvan . i never said they came free. and i never said you had payment problems. just complete financing options.
i think pakistan can do with some f16's and j10b's f16 are harder to buy. some countries are less willing to sell to Pakistan. even with Jordan saudi arabia had to persuade jordan to sell the f16's to them. so getting your hands on second hand f16's is going to be difficult. suggestion, go to Greece they have a lot of f16's. and may be willing to sell.

su35 is a dream something that you can only have on a poster on your wall. yes there are reports of Pakistan and russia talking about a potential sale. i think you are forgetting that the Pakistan army is a defensive one not an offensive one. but i think you need a good mixture of the two.

hopefully god-willing your economy will grow and you can procure more weapons quickly and in higher quantities
For the time being F-16's are not available.
The F-16's Greece has are Blk 50/52 and those birds are not cheep.

@Oscar, Sir can you confirm the Greek F-16's are powered by PW ?

As far as getting the J-10 / Su-35 can only take effect once India Signs for the Rafale's.

I have PAF officials in family I know their lies and you want to believe your choice but J-10 B deal is not dead. You want live in delusions and believe lies nothing can be done about that but J-10 B was never closed it is alive and active. @al_asad_al_mulk
As long as the productions lines are open there is no such thing as dead. Talks continue off and on... The only real emphasis occurs when there is a requirement or some technical advantage.

J10 option is still on the cards but there are many others that are also being developed and the delay in ordering Rafales by India has given PAF some breathing space.

The current issues that PAF needs to solve are the sale percentages and equipment costs and increasing production rate of Jf-17's provided they have reached Agreements with Myanmar / Sri Lanka / Argentina or any other country that might be interested like Malaysia, Indonesia, Iran, Kenya etc,,,
 
For the time being F-16's are not available.
The F-16's Greece has are Blk 50/52 and those birds are not cheep.

@Oscar, Sir can you confirm the Greek F-16's are powered by PW ?

As far as getting the J-10 / Su-35 can only take effect once India Signs for the Rafale's.
as for info on Greeks f16 look at the link you will find that Greece uses GE engines, yes i know Pakistan uses PW. so thats a problem.

F-16 Air Forces - Greece


what you say about the j10,su35 is interesting its been a while since modi signed for 36 of the shelf rafale but still not firmed up on them so i would assume Pakistan is waiting for India to a make move, and then it would make a relevant order. to counter
 
For the time being F-16's are not available.
The F-16's Greece has are Blk 50/52 and those birds are not cheep.

@Oscar, Sir can you confirm the Greek F-16's are powered by PW ?

As far as getting the J-10 / Su-35 can only take effect once India Signs for the Rafale's.


As long as the productions lines are open there is no such thing as dead. Talks continue off and on... The only real emphasis occurs when there is a requirement or some technical advantage.

J10 option is still on the cards but there are many others that are also being developed and the delay in ordering Rafales by India has given PAF some breathing space.

The current issues that PAF needs to solve are the sale percentages and equipment costs and increasing production rate of Jf-17's provided they have reached Agreements with Myanmar / Sri Lanka / Argentina or any other country that might be interested like Malaysia, Indonesia, Iran, Kenya etc,,,
i think you can check of Myanmar of the list they have ordered the jf/17, Pakistan should have not said that the country was asian. if so we would be still guessing. they are only 2 asian countries on the watch list sri-Lanka and Myanmar. a quick false report of sri-lanka buying them confirmed Myanmar ordering them. quick simple logic.

@Zarvan you are right as long as if the production line is open. nothing is dead. things are very much alive. these developments are kept secret and people of a very high ranks only know for such developments. so it would be pointless as a normal officer as you get a false misleading answer. zarvan i would assume you would have contacts in paf by the way you talk. the real answers will be given when they are needed to be given. not when you need them.
 
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what you say about the j10,su35 is interesting its been a while since modi signed for 36 of the shelf rafale but still not firmed up on them so i would assume Pakistan is waiting for India to a make move, and then it would make a relevant order. to counter
What Modi signed was LOI and MOU. Unfortunately these have no legal powers when it comes to actual agreement. Moreover the orders that were placed by France have been reduced hence the aircraft as you have mentioned are being given to Egypt now and in a few months to Qatar. If India places an order of just 36 then this is going to take around 3-5 years before they are delivered.

In this time frame SU-30 MKI and some more M2k's can be bought for half the price.
 
when you say m2k's does that mean a upgrades su30-mki?

if so then i can say that will not happen as india is having problems with the su30. russia even offered india the su30 and still no reply. so the su30 is of the cards. but upgrades will not be though
 
i think you can check of Myanmar of the list they have ordered the jf/17, Pakistan should have not said that the country was asian. if so we would be still guessing. they are only 2 asian countries on the watch list sri-Lanka and Myanmar. a quick false report of sri-lanka buying them confirmed Myanmar ordering them. quick simple logic.

@Zarvan you are right as long as if the production line is open. nothing is dead. things are very much alive. these developments are kept secret and people of a very high ranks only know for such developments. so it would be pointless as a normal officer as you get a false misleading answer. zarvan i would assume you would have contacts in paf by the way you talk. the real answers will be given when they are needed to be given. not when you need them.
Dont be surprised to hear that by saying Asian country PAF official was actually referring to Malaysia / Indonesia.:angel:
 
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