China-India Geopolitics: News & Discussions

[Raphael]

http://blogs.rediff.com/mkbhadrakumar/2017/06/09/india-should-expect-a-china-japan-reset/

The Modi government, which began its diplomatic activities three years ago by eulogizing the prospect of an Asian Century, has lost the plot. The Asian Century is forging ahead for sure, but sans India. Japan, which was regarded by PM Modi as India’s ideal partner in the Asian Century, is seeking a collaborative partnership with China. This is the indication available from a major international conference hosted in Tokyo on June 5-6 under the rubric ‘Future of Asia’.

The theme of the conference was “Globalism at a crossroads: Asia’s next move” and the sub-plot that inevitably took the centre-stage of the demi-official event was all about Japan and China setting aside their historical distrust and current rivalry to lead Asia in tandem towards greater integration. In his keynote speech at the conference, Singapore’s powerful Emeritus Senior Minister, Goh Chok Tong urged: “If Japan-China relations can move towards greater trust and cooperation, there will be a mutually-reinforcing effect on the other key bilateral relationships in the region.”

Goh said there is a need to build greater interdependence among Asian countries and China and Japan should take the lead as Asia’s top two economies. Interestingly, Goh lauded the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP), Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP) and China’s Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) as fine examples of how Asia can build interdependence, champion free trade and further the integration process.
India did not figure in Goh’s road map, since TPP excludes India, while India is a reluctant participant in the RCEP (unlike the rest of Asia which is raring to go) and India outright boycotted the BRI forum in Beijing last month. However, it was the inaugural address at the Tokyo meet on Monday by the Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe that should make Delhi sit up.

Abe announced that Japan is ready to cooperate with China’s Belt and Road Initiative, which he lauded for its “potential to connect East and West as well as the diverse regions found in between.” Abe spelt out certain conditions – OBOR should be in harmony with “a free and fair Trans-Pacific economic zone”; infrastructure development should be based on procurement that is transparent and fair; projects should be economically viable and should not harm the debtor nations’ finances. But he made it clear that Tokyo is “ready to extend cooperation.”

The Japan-China relations seem to be heading for a makeover. A new momentum has been steadily building up in the recent weeks. For a start, Toshihiro Nikai, secretary-general of Abe’s Liberal Democratic Party who is known for his pro-China stance, attended the BRI forum in Beijing last month and was received by President Xi Jinping. Xinhua reported that Xi took note that Japan has “clearly affirmed the (Belt and Road) initiative”. (Nikai handed over a “personal letter” from Abe.) A fortnight later, China’s State Councillor Yang Jiechi visited Tokyo and met Abe to follow up on the “important guiding opinions on Sino-Japanese relationship” that Xi had earlier conveyed through Nikai.
All in all, Beijing has been quick on its feet to warmly respond to Abe’s path-breaking speech in Tokyo on Monday. The Foreign Ministry spokesperson said:

• We have noted the statement by Prime Minister Abe. In the course of developing the Belt and Road, China is committed to establishing a set of fair, reasonable and transparent rules for international trade and investment together with countries along the routes… The Belt and Road is an important international public goods, and an open and inclusive development platform, creating benefits for countries around the world including Japan. All parties are equal in terms of participating in, contributing to and benefiting from the Belt and Road. We believe that this initiative can serve as a new platform and test field for mutually beneficial cooperation and common development of China and Japan, and welcome Japan’s discussion with us on conducting cooperation within the Belt and Road framework… Chinese side attaches importance to and stands ready to improve its relationship with Japan… We have noted the remarks of Japan and hope that the Japanese side can translate their remarks and wishes about improving relations with China into concrete policies and actions.

Clearly, Japan realizes that China finds itself in a stronger position today as compared to the period prior to the victory of Donald Trump as US president. On the other hand, China too assesses that its lead role in globalization and free trade invest in it a special responsibility to be accommodative and to explore a constructive engagement with Japan. Of course, Japan’s rethink on OBOR factors in the US intention to join the China-led Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank, the participation of a senior White House official in the BRI forum meet in Beijing last month, and the follow-up by the American embassy in Beijing to constitute a “working group” to discuss BRI.

Curiously, Japan’s scepticism over the BRI is similar to India’s but its approach is radically different. Abe did the right thing by deputing Nikai as his special envoy to attend the BRI forum meet with the expectation that he could build on the overture – potentially leading to a summit meeting with Xi. As things stand, a Sino-Japanese summit seems to be within the realms of possibility. Whereas, India turned down the Chinese invitation. If for Delhi, the boycott of the Beijing meet highlighted its “muscular diplomacy”, Tokyo was pragmatic and kept in view the “big picture” of the imperatives of a reset of ties with China.


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Who could have seen this coming, even two years ago? For us India has fast become our most critical and abhorrent rival, perhaps on par with the US. It has overtaken Japan on our levels of antipathy - now we regard Japan as like Australia, a country whose politics are venal and base, and whom we should keep at arms length, but whom we can nonetheless do business with.

I think the reverse is true for Indians too, that Pakistan has become a sideshow and China has become the main target.

 

[arbit]

Who could have seen this coming, even two years ago? For us India has fast become our most critical and abhorrent rival, perhaps on par with the US. It has overtaken Japan on our levels of antipathy - now we regard Japan as like Australia, a country whose politics are venal and base, and whom we should keep at arms length, but whom we can nonetheless do business with.

I think the reverse is true for Indians too, that Pakistan has become a sideshow and China has become the main target.

Thats an interesting thought process for sure! Japanese were particularly brutal in their reign over china. The stories are - wait for it- legendary! Yet you imply that India, the land from which Buddhism spread far and wide and was the dominant religion in china for a considerable period of time, the land from which two peoples shared cordial relations for more than a thousand years will be abhorred at the same level as others!
Arrogance perhaps OR effects of PDF?!

We consider china as a threat we don't really hate china. On the other hand, we don't consider pakistan as a threat, they are a subject of our contempt. You by the way are welcome to develop enmity with us, if you are so keen.

 

[Naara-e-Mastana]

As i said before Japanese are sane people they wont mess with their Neighbor .
. because
1) China is a superpower and any conflict will be bloody for japan.

2) usa lost the trust of asian countries after scs episode (which are depending on them )

3) China will be their neighbor and while usa will dump them in a second if their interest lost .

4)north korea is threatening them every now and then .

5) russia & China have a nexus & both are super powers & Japan's neighbor .why would Japan mess with their two neighboring superpowers ?( just because of american backing ? The country which is thousands miles away from japan and have a record of dumping their allies) .

 

[sinait]

Yet you imply that India, the land from which Buddhism spread far and wide and was the dominant religion in china for a considerable period of time, the land from which two peoples shared cordial relations for more than a thousand years will be abhorred at the same level as others!

There is no India or Hinduism 2500 years ago. The Buddha is said to be a Shakyan, born in Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal. We don't know who are the people populating the area the Buddha attained Enlightenment. Most probably they are East Asian or Tibeto-Burman as Buddhism is largely practiced by these people.
Buddhism spread from Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal, by a Shakyan, the race of the Buddha.
Unfortunately Shakya was invaded and its inhabitants massacred.
Shakya is not India, so kindly refrain from stating the BS that Buddhism spread from India or from Indians.
.

 

[GURU DUTT]

There is no India or Hinduism 2500 years ago. The Buddha is said to be a Shakyan, born in Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal. We don't know who are the people populating the area the Buddha attained Enlightenment. Most probably they are East Asian or Tibeto-Burman as Buddhism is largely practiced by these people.
Buddhism spread from Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal, by a Shakyan, the race of the Buddha.
Unfortunately Shakya was invaded and its inhabitants massacred.
Shakya is not India, so kindly refrain from stating the BS that Buddhism spread from India or from Indians.
.

wise guy bhudda was bor as sidhart to a so called hindu king get your facts right ,,,, but there is no such thing as Hindu its sanatan dharm people living on east side of river indus/sindhu were called Hindus by the persians and later we were called hindus try doing some research

 

[Mukunda Murthi Rao]

There is no India or Hinduism 2500 years ago. The Buddha is said to be a Shakyan, born in Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal. We don't know who are the people populating the area the Buddha attained Enlightenment. Most probably they are East Asian or Tibeto-Burman as Buddhism is largely practiced by these people.
Buddhism spread from Lumbini, inside modern day Nepal, by a Shakyan, the race of the Buddha.
Unfortunately Shakya was invaded and its inhabitants massacred.
Shakya is not India, so kindly refrain from stating the BS that Buddhism spread from India or from Indians.
.

last i heard, bodh gaya is in india

 

[sinait]

wise guy bhudda was bor as sidhart to a so called hindu king get your facts right ,,,, but there is no such thing as Hindu its sanatan dharm people living on east side of river indus/sindhu were called Hindus by the persians and later we were called hindus try doing some research

Show us the birth certificate, Wise Guy.
Show us also The Buddha was born to a Hindu King,
i.e if there is such a thing as a Hindu 2600 years ago.
.

 

[CaptainJackSparrow]

When you have so much baggage hampering your relations as China and Japan do, it's next to impossible for a 'reset' or whatever the OP implies to happen, at least in the near future.

 

[sinait]

last i heard, bodh gaya is in india

May I know where is India 2600 years ago.
Last you heard Bodh Gaya is in India, didn't know you were born 2600 years ago.
All I see is Indian hearsay and bragging.
.

 

[Mukunda Murthi Rao]

May I know where is India 2600 years ago.
Last you heard Bodh Gaya is in India, didn't know you were born 2600 years ago.
All I see is Indian hearsay and bragging.
.

So what are you bragging about? I just countered your point on Buddhism coming from nepal not india. You gotta stay focussed

 

[GURU DUTT]

Show us the birth certificate, Wise Guy.
Show us also The Buddha was born to a Hindu King,
i.e if there is such a thing as a Hindu 2600 years ago.
.

so wise guy you want a birth cerificate of a person who was born almost 2500 years ago no wonder you are a thundering typhoon super high sky roketing high IQ chinese wise guy i salute you

The Buddhist tradition regards Lumbini, in present-day Nepal to be the birthplace of the Buddha.[78][note 1] He grew up in Kapilavastu.[note 1] The exact site of ancient Kapilavastu is unknown.[79] It may have been either Piprahwa, Uttar Pradesh, in present-day India,[52] or Tilaurakot, in present-day Nepal.[80] Both places belonged to the Sakya territory, and are located only 15 miles apart.[80]

Gautama was born as a Kshatriya,[81][note 9] the son of Śuddhodana, "an elected chief of the Shakya clan",[6] whose capital was Kapilavastu, and who were later annexed by the growing Kingdom of Kosala during the Buddha's lifetime. Gautama was the family name. His mother, Maya (Māyādevī), Suddhodana's wife, was a Koliyan princess. Legend has it that, on the night Siddhartha was conceived, Queen Maya dreamt that a white elephant with six white tusks entered her right side,[83][84] and ten months later[85] Siddhartha was born. As was the Shakya tradition, when his mother Queen Maya became pregnant, she left Kapilavastu for her father's kingdom to give birth. However, her son is said to have been born on the way, at Lumbini, in a garden beneath a sal tree.

The day of the Buddha's birth is widely celebrated in Theravada countries as Vesak.[86] Buddha's Birthday is called Buddha Purnima in Nepal, Bangladesh, and India as he is believed to have been born on a full moon day. Various sources hold that the Buddha's mother died at his birth, a few days or seven days later. The infant was given the name Siddhartha (Pāli: Siddhattha), meaning "he who achieves his aim". During the birth celebrations, the hermit seer Asita journeyed from his mountain abode and announced that the child would either become a great king (chakravartin) or a great sadhu.[87] By traditional account,[which?] this occurred after Siddhartha placed his feet in Asita's hair and Asita examined the birthmarks. Suddhodana held a naming ceremony on the fifth day, and invited eight Brahmin scholars to read the future. All gave a dual prediction that the baby would either become a great king or a great holy man.[87] Kondañña, the youngest, and later to be the first arhat other than the Buddha, was reputed to be the only one who unequivocally predicted that Siddhartha would become a Buddha.[88]

While later tradition and legend characterized Śuddhodana as a hereditary monarch, the descendant of the Suryavansha (Solar dynasty) of Ikṣvāku (Pāli: Okkāka), many scholars think that Śuddhodana was the elected chief of a tribal confederacy.

Early texts suggest that Gautama was not familiar with the dominant religious teachings of his time until he left on his religious quest, which is said to have been motivated by existential concern for the human condition.[89] The state of the Shakya clan was not a monarchy and seems to have been structured either as an oligarchy, or as a form of republic.[90] The more egalitarian gana-sangha form of government, as a political alternative to the strongly hierarchical kingdoms, may have influenced the development of the śramanic Jain and Buddhist sanghas, where monarchies tended toward Vedic Brahmanism.[91]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gautama_Buddha#Conception_and_birth

 

[sinait]

so wise guy you want a birth cerificate of a person who was born almost 2500 years ago no wonder you are a thundering typhoon super high sky roketing high IQ chinese wise guy i salute you

The Buddhist tradition regards Lumbini, in present-day Nepal to be the birthplace of the Buddha.[78][note 1] He grew up in Kapilavastu.[note 1] The exact site of ancient Kapilavastu is unknown.[79] It may have been either Piprahwa, Uttar Pradesh, in present-day India,[52] or Tilaurakot, in present-day Nepal.[80] Both places belonged to the Sakya territory, and are located only 15 miles apart.[80]

Gautama was born as a Kshatriya,[81][note 9] the son of Śuddhodana, "an elected chief of the Shakya clan",[6] whose capital was Kapilavastu, and who were later annexed by the growing Kingdom of Kosala during the Buddha's lifetime. Gautama was the family name. His mother, Maya (Māyādevī), Suddhodana's wife, was a Koliyan princess. Legend has it that, on the night Siddhartha was conceived, Queen Maya dreamt that a white elephant with six white tusks entered her right side,[83][84] and ten months later[85] Siddhartha was born. As was the Shakya tradition, when his mother Queen Maya became pregnant, she left Kapilavastu for her father's kingdom to give birth. However, her son is said to have been born on the way, at Lumbini, in a garden beneath a sal tree.

The day of the Buddha's birth is widely celebrated in Theravada countries as Vesak.[86] Buddha's Birthday is called Buddha Purnima in Nepal, Bangladesh, and India as he is believed to have been born on a full moon day. Various sources hold that the Buddha's mother died at his birth, a few days or seven days later. The infant was given the name Siddhartha (Pāli: Siddhattha), meaning "he who achieves his aim". During the birth celebrations, the hermit seer Asita journeyed from his mountain abode and announced that the child would either become a great king (chakravartin) or a great sadhu.[87] By traditional account,[which?] this occurred after Siddhartha placed his feet in Asita's hair and Asita examined the birthmarks. Suddhodana held a naming ceremony on the fifth day, and invited eight Brahmin scholars to read the future. All gave a dual prediction that the baby would either become a great king or a great holy man.[87] Kondañña, the youngest, and later to be the first arhat other than the Buddha, was reputed to be the only one who unequivocally predicted that Siddhartha would become a Buddha.[88]

While later tradition and legend characterized Śuddhodana as a hereditary monarch, the descendant of the Suryavansha (Solar dynasty) of Ikṣvāku (Pāli: Okkāka), many scholars think that Śuddhodana was the elected chief of a tribal confederacy.

Early texts suggest that Gautama was not familiar with the dominant religious teachings of his time until he left on his religious quest, which is said to have been motivated by existential concern for the human condition.[89] The state of the Shakya clan was not a monarchy and seems to have been structured either as an oligarchy, or as a form of republic.[90] The more egalitarian gana-sangha form of government, as a political alternative to the strongly hierarchical kingdoms, may have influenced the development of the śramanic Jain and Buddhist sanghas, where monarchies tended toward Vedic Brahmanism.[91]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gautama_Buddha#Conception_and_birth

The Chinese do have high IQ, but not me, but my IQ could be higher than yours.
No need to regurgitate what are on the Wiki. There is no proof. All I see is "believed to be", "may have", "suggested". It is up to individuals to believe what they will.
The Buddha has got nothing to do with modern day India, likewise we don't relate the Romans to modern day Italians, or the Babylonians with modern day Iraqis.
You want glory, go work for it. For now India is very famous for rape Capital, and open defecation.
.

 

[GURU DUTT]

The Chinese do have high IQ, but not me, but my IQ could be higher than yours.
No need to regurgitate what are on the Wiki. There is no proof. All I see is "believed to be", "may have", "suggested". It is up to individuals to believe what they will.
The Buddha has got nothing to do with modern day India, likewise we don't relate the Romans to modern day Italians, or the Babylonians with modern day Iraqis.
You want glory, go work for it. For now India is very famous for rape Capital, and open defecation.
.

he he he what a looser

 

[Mangus Ortus Novem]

Sad sight this...

Mr. Modi tried to isolate Pak through BD and AF.. and failed.

Mr. Modi tried to ride on the shoulders of JP and US pivoting party...to isolate China and that is going nowhere.

The indians have been trying to promote their 'counter' to OBOR... well, riding on the shoulders of JP and the US... and we all know how long that indian road is going to go....

Why is it hard for indians to be constructive for a change.. and not get eternally stuck in the proverbial superiority mud?

NE Asian economic union is in the best interests of all 3 advanced Confusian societies... the US has no choice but to effectively leave Asia... that leaves only China as a high functioning state to carry the Asian Century forward.

Mr. Modi had his chance and he blew it by openly trying to subotage OBOR.

He can't blame China for this now...as the PRC tried till the very last moment to bring indians to the fold.

 

[Dark Lord Forever]

First Russia and now Japan too is bowing down to mighty superpower China. Now where will poor India go to bag BHEEKH? Daddy USA? But Trump daddy is now with China too. oh poor india is now left helpless against superpower China. Now get ready to loose intire north east, because Chinese tanks will be comming.