China downplays Japan's construction of India's first bullet train project

[$@rJen]

Why would China help a rival?

Its a idiotic Question!! If you can't then why the F did you enter into a competition ??? Heights of Stupidity !!

 

[Sanchez]

I don't think Chinese capital should be going in to invest on India infrastructures that is the fatal weakness of Indian economy. Let's solve the border problem first.

 

[Aepsilons]

Dude, do not compare Chinese and Japanese economy or technological Might..It is like comparing Apples to pine apples.. As china Build their HSR trains in the 21st century, Japan had Pioneered in this Stream atleast some 30 years back before china did.. So pls keep the national feeling aside and discuss the topic on hand.. Topic is about Japanese Bagging the order for HSR in Delhi..


Dude, Japanese economy has reached saturation point.. After saturation point rise or dip in economy will be only marginal and marginal variances will be the result of a healthy economy.. Chinese are growing at 7% because they have scope to grow, where as Japan is already a grown up one.. Çhina and India are still on the growing trend, to reach saturation point for them, it will take a long time... May be another decade for Chinese and two decades for India..
Stop comparing Japanese and Chinese again, for heaven's sake..

Valid point.

 

[Rasengan]

Valid point.

China should concentrate in developing the HSR system for its strategic partners in Africa and Europe, instead of wasting precious time with India, where red tape is a big issue.

 

[Ryuzaki]

China should concentrate in developing the HSR system for its strategic partners in Africa and Europe, instead of wasting precious time with India, where red tape is a big issue.

I think China should build HSR for its sweeter than honey friend Pakistan.

 

[Blue Marlin]

But we won.

You won Indonesia (5 billion), but we won India (9billion) and Philippines (2 billion). Combined Japan secured 11 billion worth of deals in railways systems.

LOL

well i think it's safe to say it was not about who was cheaper, but who was doing to benefit them (politically). same applies to the Philippines. both countries are known to be against china for a few reasons, where it maybe aksia chin or the south china sea. Indonesia has no outstanding issues with either japan or china and went with the the cheapest option and with the best financial terms. india can afford not to pick the cheapest option.

 

[SrNair]

China will not be interested in helping India build a HSR. We will love to see a competitor being weak. Japanese HSR export is a failure in Taiwan as the HSR management goes bankrupt. We will love to see the same thing happen in India

China HSR is the way to go, low cost, high efficient and cost effective. Meaning the HSR will be a win win situtation for both consumer and operator. There's reason why China HSR is able to win Turkey, Macedonia, UK, Indonesia, Russia and Sweden contract. Japanese HSR is just like Sony Bravia TV, over price and yet do not offer better quality and better function. It is bound to fail.

My Sonia Bravia is working magnificently and I love Japanese products .
You can hit your head in a wall.But Japanese will be always Japanese and second to none in qualily field.

India is only a 2.2 trillion economy and the red tape is notorious. We are happy you won. Good luck

There are still plenty of good market in Europe waiting for China to make a clean sweep in HSR. Our future export is bright

Growing around 7.5% annually
Japanese knows what they are doing.

 

[DoTell]

Look, Japan wants to be seen as a winner and India wants to be seen a fair host. I say let them have it. Because there is a such a thing as a lose-lose business. There is no question the Japanese option is the more expansive one. How else can you explain why Indonesia picked us??? And why the Taiwanese HSR built by the Japanese went bankrupt?

I believe China used a very smart strategy in this whole process. We knew our chances were near zero but we still entertained them with a reasonable offer. We just did not go at it as hard as we did in Indonesia. We refused to lower our offer further because that'd force Japan to lower their offers as well. No matter how hard we try the Indians will still give it to Japan. By keeping our ground, we make Indian pay for their short sighted decisions with their own money, a lot of it. In the meantime, our participation itself gives enough pressure to Japan so that they can't take as much profit as they'd like.

In the long run, China will continue to expand our HSR business to other countries. India will realize how much more they paid for choosing Japan. The Japanese will be in for a rude wakening once their work started in the most chaotic countries in the world. They'll ask themselves if it's really worth it doing that job for peanuts.

So calm down everyone, China has the strength to play this game. We shall see.

 

[Rasengan]

I think China should build HSR for its sweeter than honey friend Pakistan.

Instead of writing cesspit nonsense from the rear end of a baboon please concentrate on the topic. China is building a Metro Train System in Lahore as the project has already started on phase 1. Pakistan requires a further investment of $12 billion on revamping its current railway structure, which a number of Chinese Companies are interested to invest. By December the full feasibility and choice of route will be decided on the train route from Kashgar to Gwadar. Pakistan at the moment does not need a HSR. Why should China feel disappointed in losing a contract in bureaucratic India, when already agreements have been signed in the United Kingdom (£14 billion), Indonesia ($5 billion), United States ($5 billion) and the entire African market is waiting for them. Always remember the amount of red tape and the problem of land acquisition in India will need to be resolved first before you jump up in joy.

 

[jhungary]

A necessary cost, i suppose. Japan will make INDIA its base for industry in South Asia as we begin to redirect our heavy manufacturing there. To increase and guarantee Japanese production efficiency, we will help and augment the Governmetn of India's mandate to improve infrastructure. To make money you need to spend. India is worth it.



I am not kissing any gluteus maximus (and gluteus minimi) , but speaking pragmatically and in truth. India is a massive market; Japan is reaping profits there. LOL!

Can't handle the truth? Step out of the kitchen.

Think the actual phase is.

Can't Handle the Heat? Then get out of the Kitchen.

 

[Blue Marlin]

Think the actual phase is.

Can't Handle the Heat? Then get out of the Kitchen.

never seen you troll before, well theres a first for every thing.

 

[jhungary]

never seen you troll before, well theres a first for every thing.

lol......

He did indeed used a wrong phase.........It's like a hybrid quote which mixed A Few Good Man with Brunt....

This is just a friendly reminder

 

[Blue Marlin]

lol......

He did indeed used a wrong phase.........It's like a hybrid quote which mixed A Few Good Man with Brunt....

This is just a friendly reminder

ok
i think china is not to bothered about japan getting such a contract as they knew it was not going to get the job. anyway and that it can ofset the loss elsewhere where politics cant interfere and where money becomese near enough the deciding factor. i think its known by now that china has greater financal incentives then japan. indoneasia was a good example of this. first payments after 5 years and at a interest rate of less than 1% and was cheaper at $5.5 billion whilst japan was $6.25 billion.

whats your say?

 

[jhungary]

ok
i think china is not to bothered about japan getting such a contract as they knew it was not going to get the job. anyway and that it can ofset the loss elsewhere where politics cant interfere and where money becomese near enough the deciding factor. i think its known by now that china has greater financal incentives then japan. indoneasia was a good example of this. first payments after 5 years and at a interest rate of less than 1% and was cheaper at $5.5 billion whilst japan was $6.25 billion.

whats your say?

As I said, trading and economy is largely stand outside of Political Difference. Think of it this way, while most people in US think China is a threat and most people in China think US is a threat, if trade and financial activities were depended largely on political difference, then by no mean US and China can rack up a large trade bilaterally. And you won't see many Chinese product selling in the US.

The Project (I will to admit upfront I did not follow the story closely) if I were not mistaken, was chosen because Japan have a cheaper solution to the HSR in Mumbai-Ahmedabad Sector, IIRC the Japanese offer is 14.6 billions for the sector while the Chinese offer is upward to 20 billions.

Financial incentive (such as repayment) is one of the issue regarding contract. Indeed for the Chinese proposal, the Chinese propose a 50% loan on the project with low interest repayment scheme for the next 10 years. Where the Japanese were offered 8.1 Billions in loan and probably market rate repayment.

Problem is, depend on how you see it, incentive not always works especially if the country you are loan to could afford such a loan. And if you look at it this way, the different between the Chinese and Japanese proposal is nearly 6 billions dollars. And then you need to look at 3 different problems

1.) Would the incentive Chinese offer worth the 5.4 billions cost offset?

2.) Would India be able to repay the Japanese loan on a market rate?

3.) How about quality of the project?

In this case, India have make a decision in favor of the Japanese, and at first glance, the Japanese plan were indeed better (there are no way the incentive can make up the 5.4 billions different between the Japanese Offer and Chinese Offer) and I don't think India would be unable to pay the loan without the Chinese incentive and lastly, even if the offer is the same, I too would have gone for Japanese Stocks, I have seen the Rolling Stock Chinese Build for Sydney rail, and I travel in it EVERYDAY. and let me tell you this, I would prefer the older K-Set build by the British/Australia. You can see the finish is not great with the Chinese Train, Air-Con not working most of the time and the seat not really comfortable in design.

I would have to say, Chinese proposal got beaten by the Japanese Proposal fair and square, if Chinese were to bid on the further project in India, they would probably need to put on a better proposal in order to win contract, these term may works in country without much spare money to spend but not going to work if you want to bid contract in Singapore or Taiwan alike.

 

[Tiqiu]

Can't say about other animals but at least the pet dogs in India are safe as no Chinese is coming here. Can't say the same about other countries.

Been there 3 times, didn't see any lovely pet dogs but countless manure-eating street dogs,strolling around like those people surrounding them. Even those Koreans said they'd rather starve to death than eat them.