China Civil Aviation, AVIC (MA600) & COMAC (ARJ21/C919/C929)

[LKJ86]

The 34th ARJ21 is handed over to the customer on September 28, 2020.

Via @上海飞机制造有限公司 from Weixin

 

[LKJ86]

Via @航空工业气动院 from Weixin

 

[LKJ86]

Via @航空工业哈飞 from Weixin

 

[LKJ86]

Video: https://weibo.com/tv/show/1034:4555871569772552?from=old_pc_videoshow

 

[letsrock]

when will c919 enter service ?

 

[LKJ86]

ARJ21-700

Via @前站起飞 from Weibo

 

[lcloo]

when will c919 enter service ?

It is estimated 2022 if all goes well but I would expect some hiccups from Donald Trump if he is reelected, citing again on "national securities", to ban export of US components including the jet engine, the aim is to stop COMAC compete with Boeing.

COMAC is expected to have plan B with alternate suppliers from Europe and China's domestic companies. Though this would mean more testing and validations for alternative components and delay for a few more years.

 

[UKBengali]

It is estimated 2022 if all goes well but I would expect some hiccups from Donald Trump if he is reelected, citing again on "national securities", to ban export of US components including the jet engine, the aim is to stop COMAC compete with Boeing.

COMAC is expected to have plan B with alternate suppliers from Europe and China's domestic companies. Though this would mean more testing and validations for alternative components and delay for a few more years.

There is no alternative supplier from Europe as all the engines in this category have US lead partners with GE and P&W.

China may have to go it alone and so it could be till 2030 when it finally goes into service with a Chinese engine.

 

[letsrock]

It is estimated 2022 if all goes well but I would expect some hiccups from Donald Trump if he is reelected, citing again on "national securities", to ban export of US components including the jet engine, the aim is to stop COMAC compete with Boeing.

COMAC is expected to have plan B with alternate suppliers from Europe and China's domestic companies. Though this would mean more testing and validations for alternative components and delay for a few more years.

Any idea why chinese competency in building military engines, landing gear, tires etc is not flowing in to civilian aircraft industry yet

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

It is estimated 2022 if all goes well but I would expect some hiccups from Donald Trump if he is reelected, citing again on "national securities", to ban export of US components including the jet engine, the aim is to stop COMAC compete with Boeing.

COMAC is expected to have plan B with alternate suppliers from Europe and China's domestic companies. Though this would mean more testing and validations for alternative components and delay for a few more years.

Better think thrice.
Unless Trump is really stupid.

China own indigenous CJ-1000AX high bypass turbofan completed its test run successfully way back in 2018.

According to Boeing estimation, China will needs to purchase over 8000 airliners by 2030.

 

[lcloo]

Any idea why chinese competency in building military engines, landing gear, tires etc is not flowing in to civilian aircraft industry yet

Military engines are not as fuel efficient as civilian engines since they are made for different specs. Fuel cost is a major factor that affects profitability of airline companies.

Not sure about landing gear and tyres, may be due to costs because it would be cheaper to buy off the shelf product rather than built your own at higher cost due to economy of scale. Again, cost is important in civilian airline operation, airline operators will avoid expensive maintenance costs like replacing worn out tyres and landing gears.

Most important is airline operators will always like to go for proven time tested passenger jets. And if COMAC will to use all Chinese made components, it will be less attractive to airliners because they will have to retrain their pilots and engineers, which again will be additional expenses.

In short, cost factor carries a lot of weight affecting sales of the aircraft. And sales and profit is everything in civilian jet industry.

 

[Bilal9]

Oh yes! I forgot that some Airbus A320s were rolled out from a plant in China. Is it just assembling or manufacturing is involved also?

Anyways... cool stuff

The assembly plant for local A320's (and variants like A319 and A321) has been in Tianjin for many years, probably a decade.

The MA60 was developed in to the MA600, and then completely re-designed with new nose/cockpit and engines to a new MA700 which will fly soon (delayed by COVID).

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

Military engines are not as fuel efficient as civilian engines since they are made for different specs. Fuel cost is a major factor that affects profitability of airline companies.

Not sure about landing gear and tyres, may be due to costs because it would be cheaper to buy off the shelf product rather than built your own at higher cost due to economy of scale. Again, cost is important in civilian airline operation, airline operators will avoid expensive maintenance costs like replacing worn out tyres and landing gears.

Most important is airline operators will always like to go for proven time tested passenger jets. And if COMAC will to use all Chinese made components, it will be less attractive to airliners because they will have to retrain their pilots and engineers, which again will be additional expenses.

In short, cost factor carries a lot of weight affecting sales of the aircraft. And sales and profit is everything in civilian jet industry.

It has everything to do with obtaining airworthiness or safety certifications from FAA, ICAO, JAC or EASA.

If they used European or USA component it will make the process easier and faster otherwise they will just delayed the approval.

In China, they will need CAA Certification. CAA certification is in fact more stringent than FAA. That is why all the Boeing 737 Max is grounded in China.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

The assembly plant for local A320's (and variants like A319 and A321) has been in Tianjin for many years, probably a decade.

The MA60 was developed in to the MA600, and then completely re-designed with new nose/cockpit and engines to a new MA700 which will fly soon (delayed by COVID).

Previously Chinese airliners and helicopters were powered by Pratt & Whitney turboprop and turboshaft engines.

But Canada has to sfop supplying these engines due to export objection by USA over its technologies to stop China from using them in their military.

I see a similarities in the ban of semiconductors to Huawei and SMIC today.
Yes. It will staggered China for awhile and after that, USA has completely lost control.

Soon it will be an all Made in China own IPR or US technology free suite.

India Tejas which use the GE-404 turbofan face a similar risks of embargo.

 

[samsara]

ARJ21-700
View attachment 670010
Via @FLY·TOGA from Weibo

China Express Airlines is a Guizhou-based airline providing domestic services since Mar-2007. The carrier operates services from its hub at Chongqing Airport, as well as secondary hubs at Guiyang Airport, Dalian Airport, Hohhot Airport and Xi'an Airport.

IATA: G5
ICAO: HXA
Main hub: Chongqing Jiangbei International Airport
Source

MA60
View attachment 670353View attachment 670354
Via @中国航空报 from Weixin

Lao Skyway (formerly Lao Air) is a small domestic carrier based at Vientiane Wattay International Airport. Founded in 2002, Lao Skyway operates a growing number of scheduled domestic services throughout Laos as well as providing charter and helicopter services. The carrier operates a diverse fleet of aircraft including Dornier 228s, Chinese MA-60s, DHC Twin Otters, Cessna Caravans as well as rotary wing equipment. Lao Skyway launched commercial service operations in Apr-2007.

IATA: LK
ICAO: LLL
Main hub: Vientiane Wattay International Airport
Source