Abu Zolfiqar
Rest in Peace
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2009
- Messages
- 22,555
- Reaction score
- 22
- Country
- Location
COAS Gen. Kayani Visits Soldiers @ Gayari Sector, Siachen (not sure if these were posted already)
Chief of Army Staff | General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani.
- Thread starter fatman17
- Start date
- Status
fatman17
PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 32,563
- Reaction score
- 98
- Country
- Location
Owning the war
It has become a political commonplace to say that Pakistan is fighting the wrong war, and that it is doing so at the behest of the United States. It is also claimed that once Pakistan stops siding with the wrong party, all will be well. This is particularly the mantra of Imran Khan and his Tehrik-e-Insaf which is challenging the Pakistan Muslim League (Nawaz) in the forthcoming general elections. The PMLN also appears to be soft on the Taliban, recommending dialogue with the terrorist outfit. Maulana Fazlurrahman's Jamiat-e-Ulema-e-Islam has even put together a grand Jirga to seek peace with an enemy - or pseudo-enemy - which has the upper hand.
These politicians' apologists say that since they want to campaign freely all over the country, contest elections and bring out their voters without fear of violent reprisal, they have no other choice, in the face of the state's failure to fight terrorism. The political parties that have a more unequivocal stance regarding terrorism, namely the PPP, MQM and the Awami National Party are paying the price for their convictions. Hundreds of their activists and some of their leading figures, have been done to death.
The Pakistan Army is fighting the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan in the Tribal Areas, not because America has ordered it to do so, but because the TTP has killed innocent civilians, including women, targeted respected leaders like Bashir Bilour and Qazi Hussain Ahmad, and massacred thousands of soldiers. Since infiltrating Karachi, the TTP has also left a trail of blood in that city, bombing and killing with impunity and handing down punishments through their own courts. On many an occasion, starting in General Musharraf's era, the Army has gone through the exercise of seeking peace. It has concluded peace deals with the TTP and saw them routinely broken.
In a recent address at General Headquarters in Rawalpindi, the Chief of Army Staff, General Ashfaq Kayani has declared that the war against the TTP is "Pakistan's own war". He asked the assembled audience whether waging war on "those who do not accept Pakistan's institutions or the writ of the state; those who massacre soldiers and innocent civilians" is not Pakistan's war. It is good that the general is speaking realistically, but this realization has been years in the making.
We have resisted for years the truth of that which has dawned on us of late, straining our relationship with allies, neighbours and the Western world in general. The biggest bone of contention between Washington and Pakistan has been the safe havens of our Tribal Areas from where terrorists of all hue and many a nationality operate. The Pakistan Army has resisted the challenges of punitive action from America, risking the breakdown of the relationship, and stuck to its definition of "good" and "bad" Taliban.
According to this logic, the "good Taliban" are the Haqqanis who have safe haven in North Waziristan, who fight in Afghanistan and whom the Army has not ousted from Pakistan's sovereign territory. The "bad" Taliban are the TTP who wage war on Pakistan and Pakistanis. Many commentators at home and abroad have been crying themselves hoarse for years that these distinctions are spurious.
Turning our backs on North Waziristan and letting the festering sore be, has not only wrought havoc on Afghanistan, it has also wrecked the peace of Pakistan. The TTP flourishes in North Waziristan, along with the Haqqani Network and various offshoots of Al-Qaeda, training international terrorists and planning and executing attacks on the Pakistani heartland. The irreducible fact is that the Taliban want an Islamic order of their choice, the sort they imposed on Afghanistan from 1996 to 2001. The fact also is that the vast majority of Pakistanis would find life very difficult under such a regime, and all our institutions as they are presently constituted would have to be radically altered or they would have to bite the dust. This includes the military, judiciary, civil services, parliament and all other modern organs of economy and society.
Fighting terrorists in Khyber, Swat, Bajaur, Mohmand and Orakzai, and looking the other way in North Waziristan has caused irreparable damage to Pakistan. The country has paid a huge price for maintaining this specious distinction - its economy is bankrupt, its isolation is near complete, the state is increasingly dysfunctional and the peace and prosperity that Pakistanis crave is becoming more elusive each day.
General Kayani's remarks should be welcomed but the malady that afflicts the country is so pervasive that all stakeholders must come together to seek solutions. Terrorism has to be fought, and the time for parleys comes after the terrorists have come to the conclusion that they cannot achieve total victory. Those who most refer to the "political solution" of the Irish problem in the UK often forget that. If civilian political leaders are to take "ownership of Pakistan's own war", they must have the freedom to fashion the foreign and domestic policies that will allow the country to become a normal state, at peace with itself and the world.
TFT
It has become a political commonplace to say that Pakistan is fighting the wrong war, and that it is doing so at the behest of the United States. It is also claimed that once Pakistan stops siding with the wrong party, all will be well. This is particularly the mantra of Imran Khan and his Tehrik-e-Insaf which is challenging the Pakistan Muslim League (Nawaz) in the forthcoming general elections. The PMLN also appears to be soft on the Taliban, recommending dialogue with the terrorist outfit. Maulana Fazlurrahman's Jamiat-e-Ulema-e-Islam has even put together a grand Jirga to seek peace with an enemy - or pseudo-enemy - which has the upper hand.
These politicians' apologists say that since they want to campaign freely all over the country, contest elections and bring out their voters without fear of violent reprisal, they have no other choice, in the face of the state's failure to fight terrorism. The political parties that have a more unequivocal stance regarding terrorism, namely the PPP, MQM and the Awami National Party are paying the price for their convictions. Hundreds of their activists and some of their leading figures, have been done to death.
The Pakistan Army is fighting the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan in the Tribal Areas, not because America has ordered it to do so, but because the TTP has killed innocent civilians, including women, targeted respected leaders like Bashir Bilour and Qazi Hussain Ahmad, and massacred thousands of soldiers. Since infiltrating Karachi, the TTP has also left a trail of blood in that city, bombing and killing with impunity and handing down punishments through their own courts. On many an occasion, starting in General Musharraf's era, the Army has gone through the exercise of seeking peace. It has concluded peace deals with the TTP and saw them routinely broken.
In a recent address at General Headquarters in Rawalpindi, the Chief of Army Staff, General Ashfaq Kayani has declared that the war against the TTP is "Pakistan's own war". He asked the assembled audience whether waging war on "those who do not accept Pakistan's institutions or the writ of the state; those who massacre soldiers and innocent civilians" is not Pakistan's war. It is good that the general is speaking realistically, but this realization has been years in the making.
We have resisted for years the truth of that which has dawned on us of late, straining our relationship with allies, neighbours and the Western world in general. The biggest bone of contention between Washington and Pakistan has been the safe havens of our Tribal Areas from where terrorists of all hue and many a nationality operate. The Pakistan Army has resisted the challenges of punitive action from America, risking the breakdown of the relationship, and stuck to its definition of "good" and "bad" Taliban.
According to this logic, the "good Taliban" are the Haqqanis who have safe haven in North Waziristan, who fight in Afghanistan and whom the Army has not ousted from Pakistan's sovereign territory. The "bad" Taliban are the TTP who wage war on Pakistan and Pakistanis. Many commentators at home and abroad have been crying themselves hoarse for years that these distinctions are spurious.
Turning our backs on North Waziristan and letting the festering sore be, has not only wrought havoc on Afghanistan, it has also wrecked the peace of Pakistan. The TTP flourishes in North Waziristan, along with the Haqqani Network and various offshoots of Al-Qaeda, training international terrorists and planning and executing attacks on the Pakistani heartland. The irreducible fact is that the Taliban want an Islamic order of their choice, the sort they imposed on Afghanistan from 1996 to 2001. The fact also is that the vast majority of Pakistanis would find life very difficult under such a regime, and all our institutions as they are presently constituted would have to be radically altered or they would have to bite the dust. This includes the military, judiciary, civil services, parliament and all other modern organs of economy and society.
Fighting terrorists in Khyber, Swat, Bajaur, Mohmand and Orakzai, and looking the other way in North Waziristan has caused irreparable damage to Pakistan. The country has paid a huge price for maintaining this specious distinction - its economy is bankrupt, its isolation is near complete, the state is increasingly dysfunctional and the peace and prosperity that Pakistanis crave is becoming more elusive each day.
General Kayani's remarks should be welcomed but the malady that afflicts the country is so pervasive that all stakeholders must come together to seek solutions. Terrorism has to be fought, and the time for parleys comes after the terrorists have come to the conclusion that they cannot achieve total victory. Those who most refer to the "political solution" of the Irish problem in the UK often forget that. If civilian political leaders are to take "ownership of Pakistan's own war", they must have the freedom to fashion the foreign and domestic policies that will allow the country to become a normal state, at peace with itself and the world.
TFT
muse
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2006
- Messages
- 13,006
- Reaction score
- 0
Coming from that Qaidiani Hinjew mouthpiece TFT - this prescription will be most unwelcome -- The evil media is once again portraying the struggle of the real Muslims and their demand for the imposition of Real islam, in a negative light.
Foo-ji entrepreneurs who put on such a good show for the foreigners at the Youm e Shuhada ceremonies, highlighting Bearded men in Turbans (Real Muslims - they have beards does the duffer Kiyani have a beard?) as Enemies - but the foreigners are not buying it -- and now TFT wants army to relinquish control and allow crooked politicians to fashion domestic and foreign policy - bad nuz for Foo-ji on all fronts - hain ji? Bilkul ji Bilkul!
air marshal
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2005
- Messages
- 11,056
- Reaction score
- 2
Chief of Army Staff, General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani casting his vote at NA-54 Polling Station in Rawalpindi on Saturday. (11-5-2013).
fatman17
PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 32,563
- Reaction score
- 98
- Country
- Location
Sunday, May 19, 2013
Army ‘throws weight’ behind Nawaz Sharif
* Sources say COAS, PML-N chief discuss internal, external security issues
* Political intelligentsia considers meeting ‘plow ahead’ for Nawaz from army to hold PM’s office
By Kashif Hussain
LAHORE: Chief of Army Staff (COAS) General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani and British High Commissioner Adam Thomson called on PML-N president and expected prime minister for the next parliamentary tenure Nawaz Sharif separately at his residence in Raiwind Farms on Saturday.
According to PML-N sources, General Kayani held a three-and-a-half-hour-long discussion with Nawaz in a very pleasant atmosphere and both exchanged views on internal and external security issues confronting the country, especially the Karachi situation, terror attacks in different parts of the country and drone attacks in the Tribal Areas.
Sources said that former chief minister Shahbaz Sharif was also present in the meeting.
The political intelligentsia is giving high importance to this meeting and considering it a ‘plow ahead’ for Nawaz Sharif from the Pakistan Army to hold the office of the prime minister for the third time. The political intelligentsia while lifting their eyebrows on this long meeting between General Kayani and Sharifs has expressed hope that things would go smooth in the future.
It is pertinent to mention here that before the meeting, British High Commissioner Adam Thomson also held a meeting with the PML-N chief, in the presence of Shahbaz Sharif and Senator Ishaq Dar, in Raiwind.
PML-N sources confirmed that the British high commissioner not only greeted Nawaz and his party for winning the general election but also assured to continue UK’s advocacy of democracy in Pakistan. They said that matters of mutual interest and bilateral relations were discussed in the meeting.
The sources said that during the meeting, Nawaz Sharif told the British high commissioner that the PML-N government in its third term would like to concentrate on trade rather than getting any aid from foreign countries to overcome the economic crisis. He also hoped that the UK would continue its support to the Pakistani government in this regard.
Sources said that in the meeting, Adam Thomson had assured PML-N leaders that his government would make all efforts to boost the relations between both the countries in the future. The sources said that the British ambassador also welcomed the economic reforms in Pakistan for the betterment of the common man.
Army ‘throws weight’ behind Nawaz Sharif
* Sources say COAS, PML-N chief discuss internal, external security issues
* Political intelligentsia considers meeting ‘plow ahead’ for Nawaz from army to hold PM’s office
By Kashif Hussain
LAHORE: Chief of Army Staff (COAS) General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani and British High Commissioner Adam Thomson called on PML-N president and expected prime minister for the next parliamentary tenure Nawaz Sharif separately at his residence in Raiwind Farms on Saturday.
According to PML-N sources, General Kayani held a three-and-a-half-hour-long discussion with Nawaz in a very pleasant atmosphere and both exchanged views on internal and external security issues confronting the country, especially the Karachi situation, terror attacks in different parts of the country and drone attacks in the Tribal Areas.
Sources said that former chief minister Shahbaz Sharif was also present in the meeting.
The political intelligentsia is giving high importance to this meeting and considering it a ‘plow ahead’ for Nawaz Sharif from the Pakistan Army to hold the office of the prime minister for the third time. The political intelligentsia while lifting their eyebrows on this long meeting between General Kayani and Sharifs has expressed hope that things would go smooth in the future.
It is pertinent to mention here that before the meeting, British High Commissioner Adam Thomson also held a meeting with the PML-N chief, in the presence of Shahbaz Sharif and Senator Ishaq Dar, in Raiwind.
PML-N sources confirmed that the British high commissioner not only greeted Nawaz and his party for winning the general election but also assured to continue UK’s advocacy of democracy in Pakistan. They said that matters of mutual interest and bilateral relations were discussed in the meeting.
The sources said that during the meeting, Nawaz Sharif told the British high commissioner that the PML-N government in its third term would like to concentrate on trade rather than getting any aid from foreign countries to overcome the economic crisis. He also hoped that the UK would continue its support to the Pakistani government in this regard.
Sources said that in the meeting, Adam Thomson had assured PML-N leaders that his government would make all efforts to boost the relations between both the countries in the future. The sources said that the British ambassador also welcomed the economic reforms in Pakistan for the betterment of the common man.
fatman17
PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 32,563
- Reaction score
- 98
- Country
- Location
Top Story
Army explains Kayani-Nawaz meeting
Shaheen Sehbai
Sunday, May 19, 2013
DUBAI: The Nawaz-Kayani meeting will go a long way to ensure a smooth functioning of the democratic system, with complete focus on the domestic and regional security situation, a top military official said on Saturday night.
Speaking on condition of anonymity, the official said the meeting was basically arranged to prevent any suspicions and doubts in any quarter that there was any threat to democracy or the newly elected leadership.
General Kayani broke new ground and became the first army chief to call on a prime minister-elect. The visit to Nawaz Sharif, who has not even been sworn in as the country’s prime minister, can be seen as CBM to ensure that there was no tensions and clash of institutions, as some analysts had feared, specially after the statements by the PML-N chief about the retirement of General Kayani and relations with India.
Nawaz Sharif had before the elections spoken to an Indian channel and stated categorically that General Kayani was not expected to come to him for another extension and the senior-most general of the army will become the new army chief. He had also made some surprisingly positive statements about India which many thought may not have gone down well with the Army.
But the Saturday meeting dealt with all these issues and for more than three hours the two leaders tried to read each other’s lips and minds, the senior official said.
It is understood that General Kayani did not raise the issue of his extension at all, as he was obviously not supposed to, but there was a lingering feeling in the meeting that the vast experience and hands-on knowledge of handling critical matters for years must be put to some use.
When I asked a senior military official if this impression was correct, he said the culture of using the knowledge and experience of our talented people was growing but in Pakistan the reality has been that once a person is out of a job he is out of mind and sight.
Yet the official quoted some names of senior diplomats who were experts in foreign affairs and whose private views and suggestions had been sought and used by the defence establishment, off and on.
“This is a good trend which is catching up and this can be relevant for the military officers as well,” the official said, without even hinting that he was making any suggestion or comment about General Kayani’s role after he retires.
Analysts, however, said the Kayani-Nawaz meeting was a good sign that the army and the political class were now coming on the same page on national security issues and “there was an institutional thinking” behind what General Kayani stands for.
When I asked the senior official how the army will make up for the invaluable experience and expertise of General Kayani in handling sensitive issues, he said the institutions are always on the same page as their leaders and there should be no problems in a smooth transfer of batons within the institution while maintaining the same policies and strategies.
The army side is also aware of the criticism coming from some media and political quarters that General Kayani may have crossed some kind of a red line by offering such a major CBM to Nawaz Sharif.
“We want that there should be no fears in the political set-up about threats to the political system, as we saw in the last five years.”
who is the senior most general in the army...?
Army explains Kayani-Nawaz meeting
Shaheen Sehbai
Sunday, May 19, 2013
DUBAI: The Nawaz-Kayani meeting will go a long way to ensure a smooth functioning of the democratic system, with complete focus on the domestic and regional security situation, a top military official said on Saturday night.
Speaking on condition of anonymity, the official said the meeting was basically arranged to prevent any suspicions and doubts in any quarter that there was any threat to democracy or the newly elected leadership.
General Kayani broke new ground and became the first army chief to call on a prime minister-elect. The visit to Nawaz Sharif, who has not even been sworn in as the country’s prime minister, can be seen as CBM to ensure that there was no tensions and clash of institutions, as some analysts had feared, specially after the statements by the PML-N chief about the retirement of General Kayani and relations with India.
Nawaz Sharif had before the elections spoken to an Indian channel and stated categorically that General Kayani was not expected to come to him for another extension and the senior-most general of the army will become the new army chief. He had also made some surprisingly positive statements about India which many thought may not have gone down well with the Army.
But the Saturday meeting dealt with all these issues and for more than three hours the two leaders tried to read each other’s lips and minds, the senior official said.
It is understood that General Kayani did not raise the issue of his extension at all, as he was obviously not supposed to, but there was a lingering feeling in the meeting that the vast experience and hands-on knowledge of handling critical matters for years must be put to some use.
When I asked a senior military official if this impression was correct, he said the culture of using the knowledge and experience of our talented people was growing but in Pakistan the reality has been that once a person is out of a job he is out of mind and sight.
Yet the official quoted some names of senior diplomats who were experts in foreign affairs and whose private views and suggestions had been sought and used by the defence establishment, off and on.
“This is a good trend which is catching up and this can be relevant for the military officers as well,” the official said, without even hinting that he was making any suggestion or comment about General Kayani’s role after he retires.
Analysts, however, said the Kayani-Nawaz meeting was a good sign that the army and the political class were now coming on the same page on national security issues and “there was an institutional thinking” behind what General Kayani stands for.
When I asked the senior official how the army will make up for the invaluable experience and expertise of General Kayani in handling sensitive issues, he said the institutions are always on the same page as their leaders and there should be no problems in a smooth transfer of batons within the institution while maintaining the same policies and strategies.
The army side is also aware of the criticism coming from some media and political quarters that General Kayani may have crossed some kind of a red line by offering such a major CBM to Nawaz Sharif.
“We want that there should be no fears in the political set-up about threats to the political system, as we saw in the last five years.”
who is the senior most general in the army...?
truthseeker2010
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2010
- Messages
- 5,168
- Reaction score
- -8
^^^ LTG Khalid Nawaz Khan (commander X corp) ? but he is due for retirement on 4 oct 2013.
Hyperion
RETIRED TTA
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2012
- Messages
- 12,564
- Reaction score
- 26
- Country
- Location
I bet he is voting for Ganja Bradran. Btw, who won in NA-54? It must've been one of the most rigged station, as one of the biggest crooks cast vote there. 
Pak Sar Zameen PatwariAbad
Kishware haseen ArmyAbad
Pak Sar Zameen PatwariAbad
Kishware haseen ArmyAbad
Chief of Army Staff, General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani casting his vote at NA-54 Polling Station in Rawalpindi on Saturday. (11-5-2013).
fatman17
PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 32,563
- Reaction score
- 98
- Country
- Location
give us at least 3 names in order of seniority. anyways the next CoAS designate would be nominated in August somewhere so he will be considered.
truthseeker2010
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2010
- Messages
- 5,168
- Reaction score
- -8
Lt Gen Khalid Nawaz Khan, Commander, X Corps, Rawalpindi. Due to retire on 4 October 2013.
Lt Gen Muhammad Alam Khattak, Commander, XII Corps, Quetta. Due to retire on 4 October 2013.
Lt Gen Muhammad Haroon Aslam, Chief of Logistics Staff , Due to retire on 9 April 2014.
Amaa'n
STAFF
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2012
- Messages
- 10,660
- Reaction score
- 149
- Country
- Location
Whatelse can you expect; Nooras won in NA-54I bet he is voting for Ganja Bradran. Btw, who won in NA-54? It must've been one of the most rigged station, as one of the biggest crooks cast vote there.
Pak Sar Zameen PatwariAbad
Kishware haseen ArmyAbad
fatman17
PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 32,563
- Reaction score
- 98
- Country
- Location
so if we are to believe what NS has said, then one of these 3 Lt.Gen's will be the next CoAS.
truthseeker2010
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2010
- Messages
- 5,168
- Reaction score
- -8
I bet he is voting for Ganja Bradran. Btw, who won in NA-54? It must've been one of the most rigged station, as one of the biggest crooks cast vote there.
Pak Sar Zameen PatwariAbad
Kishware haseen ArmyAbad
Malik Ibrar Ahmed from Noon League
truthseeker2010
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2010
- Messages
- 5,168
- Reaction score
- -8
lets make it more interesting if we add the next three that includes Tariq khan and the recently appointed CGS Rashad Mahmud. So would'nt that make a more worthy race to the top spot. Also Sir isn't the experience on important posts which are CGS, DGMO, DGISI, X corp, prerequisites for COAS. So it will be interesting to see how NS tackles this... we know how he picked his last chief and the rest is all history......
- Status
