Calm dissection of Delhi riots from a non-Hindutva perspective

[Joe Shearer]

There was an interesting disc (referencing history and the "psyche carryover/renewal" ) in the usual other place between cookie and I on this topic you can peruse bit later if you'd like too.

??

Would really like to catch up.

There was an interesting disc (referencing history and the "psyche carryover/renewal" ) in the usual other place between cookie and I on this topic you can peruse bit later if you'd like too.

However, I will take a little bit of time to go through the previous posts. I think it only fair that all the comments and remarks leading to what I replied should be read; they are relevant, and demand attention.

 

[Nilgiri]

??

Would really like to catch up.

discord convo we (cookie and I and cpl others) had in general about a day ago

However, I will take a little bit of time to go through the previous posts. I think it only fair that all the comments and remarks leading to what I replied are relevant, and demand attention.

Yes of course, once you are done here (and even feel like it, its sobering stuff).

 

[Joe Shearer]

discord convo we (cookie and I and cpl others) had in general about a day ago



Yes of course, once you are done here.

Oh, I'm done for the day. It's my post-operation fatigue that restricts me.

 

[Psychic]

that clearly shows Hindus being 15% of WEST PAKISTAN in 1941

In 1941 --- years before partition.

And How many Muslim refugees did Pakistan receive? 6 million
That was some 17percent of the total population of Indian Punjab and other regions which was expelled. Next time, try to mention those poor Muslims as well while you mourn poor Hindus and Sikhs who lived in areas (before 47) which became Pakistan.

@Sine Nomine

Above map gives a fair idea of ---

 

[Sine Nomine]

In 1941 --- years before partition.

And How many Muslim refugees did Pakistan receive? 6 million
That was some 17percent of the total population of Indian Punjab and other regions which was expelled. Next time, try to mention those poor Muslims as well while you mourn poor Hindus and Sikhs who lived in areas (before 47) which became Pakistan.

@Sine Nomine

View attachment 610699
Above map gives a fair idea of ---

Events of Feb 19&20 have taken huge toll on their thinking capacity.His logic is moronic.When myths about violance against Hindus and their low numbers as compared to 1951, have been debunked now they have brought this new strawmen argument.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Events of Feb 19&20 have taken huge toll on their thinking capacity.His logic is moronic.When myths about violance against Hindus and their low numbers as compared to 1951, have been debunked now they have brought this new strawmen argument.

It's not even "straw man". It's simple misunderstanding of mathematics.

 

[Cookie Monster]

I write this as someone who saw through Modi long before anyone in either country recognised him as a threat.

You are broadly right, but only broadly. Unfortunately, you display the usual Pakistani trend of taking an apocalyptic view of India's present and future, irrespective of when in time you take the view: it is invariant, and it doesn't matter whether you are looking at 1950, 1960, 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000, 2010, or, now, 2020. The expressions of concern that I hear now ring hollow against the background of the pitched hostility at all times in the past; it never let up, what difference does it make if it is couched in terms of the end of days now? It was always pitched like that, among 'green' bhakts, although there has always been a counter-narrative in Pakistan, a stream of thought that Indian liberals of my sort clung on to in spite of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Coming to the details, if you have managed to hold on till now, the Modi formula was not and never will be universal. 'You can fool all the people some of the time....' and so on. It is visibly not universal even now. If you will not take the trouble of wading through the gallons of nausea-inducing garbage in the air-waves - and who can blame you? - you will never get to understand the limited support initially, or even that it was in fact limited, or the subsequent growing disillusionment. Unfortunately, even the most thoughtful Pakistani is apt to first fall prey to feelings of righteous indignation, and then, and only then, to look at the evidence - by which time it is too late.

I haven't seen the discussion to this point, and this comment is to be seen in the mouth of an observer who has been focussed on what is happening on the ground, and has not really been looking at the discussions on PDF. You will forgive me for for any broad-brush strokes that I may have fallen prey to.

I'm not trying to be as u say a "green bhakt" here. I understand(and am willing to take into account) that I could be wrong. U see I only get my news through the media...I'm not all knowing. Some news can be fake...other news might have bias...and even the most unbiased and truthfully reported news can be incomplete. So it could very well be a possibility that u have a much much better understanding of what's happening on the ground(since u live there). I'm just saying based on all the news that come out(what Modi says, his actions, his policies, etc.) that I kinda saw it coming...
...that he managed to successfully fool the ppl...and hence was reelected again. As for doom and gloom(regarding all these protests and killings)...I guess only time will tell on how that plays out. I'm just basing that on human nature...it is hard to scrub off hate...it's much easier to live in an "us vs them" world...so that the problems can be blamed on someone else.

 

[Psychic]

I'm not trying to be as u say a "green bhakt" here.

"Green bhakht" is yet another term used by hypocrite congress majoritarians to give a sense of "oh it happens on both sides". How many pogroms against minorities did the so called green bakhts conduct in Pakistan after 1947 as opposed to the actual khaki chadda bakhts? Bakhts are only bakhts, there is no green bakht; and there is no moral equivalent of actual bakhts on the other side in existence. Indian liberals are by and large watan parast(my country is always right types) hindu majoritarians concealing their true face behind the mask of secularism.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I'm not trying to be as u say a "green bhakt" here. I understand(and am willing to take into account) that I could be wrong. U see I only get my news through the media...I'm not all knowing. Some news can be fake...other news might have bias...and even the most unbiased and truthfully reported news can be incomplete. So it could very well be a possibility that u have a much much better understanding of what's happening on the ground(since u live there).

To be perfectly honest, I believe (and assert very often with a blustery self-confidence) that I have a better understanding of what's happening on the ground. Perhaps that should be written as 'a better understanding of what recently happened on the ground.....'

You will find Indians on this forum itself who will tell you that I am talking through the back of my neck.

I'm just saying based on all the news that come out(what Modi says, his actions, his policies, etc.) that I kinda saw it coming...
...that he managed to successfully fool the ppl...and hence was reelected again. As for doom and gloom(regarding all these protests and killings)...I guess only time will tell on how that plays out. I'm just basing that on human nature...it is hard to scrub off hate...it's much easier to live in an "us vs them" world...so that the problems can be blamed on someone else.

Fair enough.
Let us wait and see.
In this, you have the upper hand; I am most unlikely to be able to keep you company beyond a fairly short time!!!