What's new

Building a new ‘Mandar’ in Riyasat-e-Madina is against the spirit of Islam: Ch Pervaiz Elahi

I have posted that on previous pages and I was labelled as a filthy mullah, TTP, daesh, lej, estremist, fundo and all that...

Wow, now isn't this a form of takfir? I guess 1.7 billion Muslims are all now members of TTP for believing in the most obvious and fundamental, in fact THE fundamental belief of Islam, ie TAWHEED.
 
.
Wow, now isn't this a form of takfir? I guess 1.7 billion Muslims are all now members of TTP for believing in the most obvious and fundamental, in fact THE fundamental belief of Islam, ie TAWHEED.
These people themselves alter Islamic principles in order to conform to Western sensibilities. When you point out that it is kuffar to do so, you are immediately given those labels.
 
.
Hindu pays taxes too. They should be allowed to get land from government if they can't afford to make.
 
. . . .
are these punishment are Islamic or adopted from old Arab culture? Arab were practicing these punishments before Islam?

Arabs has no structural Society in pre Islamic days, it was Powerful who make the laws for poor and weak, while no rules or regulations applies to them, Punishments of Stealing and murder ( Qisas ) are from Quran/Sunnah . Don't you know about the famous Hadith of Prophet ? He said , By Allah if Muhammad's Daughter ( Fatima RA ) has steal I will cut off her hand(s) . No one is above the Law in Islam, if a crime is committed and witnessed than its Punishment will get implemented ( Or i should say it must ) if not than the sin will be punished in the After life .
 
. .
It would need serious study by Islamic scholars (in islamic majority countries) to begin with...and then concerted application (say well past the Jews, which I believe is the context here) using it as a credible primary basis.

Only place I have seen something of this nature being done (in islamic majority without going secular/western route) on first principles in good faith basis is Indonesia (but it was not done through medina constitution way or islam-derived way...rather a real-politik way similar to the drive Ataturk did in Turkey)....though I believe in Indonesia case atheism/agnosticism is not legally accepted which I find odd.

Whereas most other Islam-majority countries simply go with the legal body found in Sharia (which names Jews and Christians as fellow monotheists in the same religious lineage aka people of the book...but leaves questions of interpretation for all other beliefs and non-beliefs)....or they have western+secular law alongside it in some way....or in case of Turkey entirely go the western route.

Maybe @saiyan0321 can give us brief summary of the medina constitution relevance/strength to a nation-state today...and if he feels there are viable routes to found a modern constitution on it's basis...that would say work soundly in the real pluralistic+secular world yet still hold strong religious credibility and affinity for islamic-majority populations.

Like what is the current debate w.r.t medina constitution and sharia given there is much more jurisprudence legacy and precedence of the latter being applied...and thus the likely bulwark it occupies naturally in islamic world for this topic that simply cannot be circumvented to a new appraisal/innovation of say the medina constitution from first principles. If this is the case, then I think its mostly conceptual exercise given this kind of thing would have to be treated seriously (and strived+applied) by large muslim populations to begin with.....before others really take notice for study and analysis.

Right now I don't see that happening (a new innovative alternative), since you have a good working compromise already with common/civil western law....and you can add personal law sharia to muslims on top if the society feels it acceptable (or say the rulers feel thats the best option).....or the other route: simply go sharia law fully.

Both these have weight of rulings and precedence in volumes...its large inertia...hard to develop and sustain something new.

Indonesia had bad blood feud with atheisme, as communist party in Indonesia promoting atheisme at the most highest level. In the past they promoted to be against clerics influences (who coincidentally most of them happened to be landlord, either he is Haji, Pandita Brahmin or servant of Jesus) all Faith including Buddhism and Hindu. In Bali itself, tens of thousands communist sympathizer being killed by angry Hindhu mobs during the aftermath of failed coup in 1965. That's why it is hard for atheisme to find root in this country as they will be Linked to the Communist party.
 
. . . . .
I write this in good faith, and please accept it in that spirit.

The term is a hybrid as you have rightly spotted; in the context of Pakistan, I understand that it refers to the desire to re-create the harmonious civic life at Madina, based on the constitutional situation of Madina after the invitation of Hazrat Mohammad to be the arbitrator and adjudicator in Madina. When he arrived, his first task was to stop the constant feuding among the eight tribes of Yathrib (and also the Jewish groups, also eight in number), and his solution was to draft a 'constitution' that laid down very clearly the rules under which the inhabitants, meaning the original eight tribes and the incoming Quraish from Mecca, along with the named Jewish tribes, were to live in harmony with each other.

Effectively, it gave the legal foundation for a multi-religious Islamic state.

In constitution-making, it has not received sufficient importance from western scholars, but it was an extremely effective instrument for building a peaceful and harmonious civic life between different communities living in the same city.

If you have not read about it already, you can take a first look at it in Wikipedia.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Medina

Some of the existing experts on PDF will surely be able to take you to further more developed texts and authorities. What I found most interesting was the clear definition of the situation of non-Muslims:
  1. The security of God is equal for all groups,
  2. Non-Muslim members have the same political and cultural rights as Muslims. They have autonomy and freedom of religion.
  3. Non-Muslims take up arms against the enemy of the nation and share the cost of war. There is to be no treachery between the two.
  4. Non-Muslims are not obliged to take part in the Muslims' religious wars.
I hope this helps.

No it does not helps, actually it proves the term Riyasat Medina was coined for ignorant public, by hypocrites.
Give me reference from any reputed university from Egypt /Saudi Arabia, while all references form your Wikipedia are from UK or referred to some unknown individuals, who's book no one has ever read.

Until today, my impression of the term was that it refer to time period of 8 years, which Mohammad saw spent in Medina, which was a mix religion society, where Mohammad saw was an immigrant /guest of those who had become Muslims. That setup could hardly be called a state. Actually there was no state as long Mohammad saw lived. It's actually an insult to term Mohammad as ruler of state of Medina.
If there was any close resemblance to any state, than it was the Khilafat that was founded after death of Mohammad saw. Where day to day policies were made in harmony with Islamic principles, where in humanity, peace and tranquility were prime factors.
How non Muslims were treated in Khilafat is perhaps not the subject.
 
Last edited:
.
Further to my earlier comment in support, I have to say as someone living in the UK, I’d be a hypocrite for opposing this construction while I live here. Not only do I enjoy religious freedom here, the mosques built here are funded by the community, funds can come freely from abroad (Saudi or Qatar) and the government allows it, and even the government often pays contributions to some projects and community services. This doesn’t include the numerous cultural and community centres. In times even churches open their doors to our worshippers for prayer.

So I fully support the government in this, nothing wrong with giving Hindu community something, they pay taxes too and are as Pakistani as anyone else.
 
Last edited:
.

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom