Brothers in Arms : Why an Indian stands with Israel I wouldn’t write to you today, if I didn’t feel

[noksss]

@XiNiX

 

[Chanakyaa]

this article i printed out and used it as toilet paper just to let you know.

Begani Shadi me Abdulaa Diwana !!!

 

[Friei Indien]

As usual Bla from Pakistanis....... Like Janon pointed out we both India and Pakistan are victims of Islamic terrorism and that's what unites us..More Muslims in Pakistan are killed in recent years by fellow pakistanis than in India, First you need to preach that to yourself

pakistan is not a victim of islamic terrorism, it is 'islamic terrorism'.

 

[Zarvan]

Dear Friends in Israel,

View attachment 108758​

I wouldn’t write to you today, if I didn’t feel compelled to do so. But first, I have a confession to make; I didn’t always stand up for you – when at times I should have. Growing up in India in the 90s, like most in my generation I did share sympathies for you, but never gave it much of a thought.

Things changed during my college years and subsequent years of employment in International organizations. I conveniently went along with the dominant narrative of the ‘Arab–Israeli conflict’.

It was in the winter of 2012 that I was – for the first time – forced to reconsider my position after witnessing an anti-Semitic tirade (in Germany of all the places) that began ‘harmlessly’ with a condemnation of Israel’s ‘disproportionate use of force’. The incident made me realize that the nature of the debate on Israel has very little to do with the ground realty in the Middle East. On other occasions my polite attempts to bring facts to the discussions made things only worse. Since then I have witnessed more blatant anti-Semitism in elite circles in Europe than I have seen in immigrant suburbs of Paris or Berlin.

After seeing the futility of debates, I opted to just write about it occasionally. I do get my share of ‘hate mails’ and I take them as part of the deal. Like most people expressing their solidarity with Israel on the web, I too have been flooded with graphic images and verbal abuse in recent days. I have been repeatedly asked the same question: Why does an Indian support Israel (I am leaving out the customary expletives)?

I have chosen not to respond to these messages. Instead I have decided to share my reasons with you.

Firstly, as an Indian I feel deep gratitude based on History. You came to our aid militarily many times; like in the 14-day India-Pakistan war in 1971 and then again in the Kargil War of 1999. Your help came despite India’s consistent ‘unfavorable’ stand in UN and other international fora. On the other hand it took India 44 years to recognize Israel.

However, since 1992 our bilateral relations have flourished. Today Israel is India’s biggest partner in defense trade after Russia. India-Israel overall bilateral trade has grown from the base figure of $200 million to over $6 billion.

But that’s not the whole story. Israeli agriculture technology is helping farmers in rural India to improve their harvest and dairy output. Israeli water and irrigation technology is enabling farmers to get better yields with limited water resources and providing Indian cities with clean drinking water. Israel is partnering with India in an ambitious plan to clean major rivers that serve as life-line to Indian metropolitans. Recently Israel has even initiated a program to enable Indian women entrepreneurs to acquire right skill-sets and exposure to break new grounds in Corporate India.

My real admiration – like that of many other Indians – is not merely based on what you do, but based on who you are.

Your scientific temper, your zeal for learning, and your quest for innovation are some of the values that Indians in my generation would like to emulate.
After surviving the most vicious genocide in human history, you opted to create a nation based on democratic values, freedom, equality for people of all faiths and ethnicities. Today, over a million Arabs enjoy equal citizenship rights in Israel and religious freedom never seen before in Middle East. Arab Israelis are active in all fields of society and hold high places in academics, civil & military administration, politics, and cultural life of Israel.

Though you are not infallible, you are open to self-criticism as a society – a rare commodity in the region. Despite being a tiny country in size, you have successfully absorbed waves of immigration and continue to evolve as a society.

You received Jews of Indian origin with open arms. Today they form an 80,000 strong community. They have excelled in all walks of life, served gallantly in times of war, and brought glory to your country in sports. Those who try to raise the charge of Apartheid against you, knowingly ignore the plight of tens of thousands of Indian workers in Arab Gulf States working in sub-human conditions.

Since you proclaimed statehood, you have pleaded for peace, but have been prepared to defend yourself. This perhaps is also your biggest ‘crime’. In the eyes of your detractors, you have stopped playing the part that was scripted for you. Those in your neighborhood who are trying to ‘wipe you off the map’ or ‘push you in to the sea’ are not in much different from those Intellectual elite who want you to lower your defenses or ‘give up your (Jewish) character’ – and disappear.

No society before you has acted so humanly in the face of war, terror and constant aggression – not judging only by the way you treat your own, but by way you treat those who are hell bent on destroying you. You set up field hospitals to treat wounded Syrians; you send your technicians in harm’s way to restore power lines to Gaza; you go out of the way alerting civilians of imminent strikes – even when it means letting the miscreants to flee as well.

Like many of you Israelis, I too firmly believe that the day will come when the hostility against Israel would cease. Arab nations would one day come to realize that they have been the biggest sufferers in their campaign of hatred against Israel, and would instead focus on building their societies and tackling real issues.

Until that day – like millions of Indians today – I will stand with you.

Source : A Letter to the Jewish Nation: Why an Indian stands with Israel | Vijeta Uniyal | The Blogs | The Times of Israel

Submitted by vineet (India), Feb 23, 2012 at 13:59

Indians and Israelis have many common platforms:

1) Indians are pro development, peace loving, pro democracy and intellectual people just like israelis and indians have high praise for Israel for defending itself from the clutches of surrounding muslim nations in a brave and aggressive manner. India is not able to do that with pakistan , bangladesh, afghanistan, china. Indians crave for that aggression and bravery so they love and highly appreciate Israel.

2) In any international dispute the indians have a 100 percent inclination in favour of israel because indians better understand the mentality of muslim nations. although indian government do not openly favour israel due to some international equations and due to large population of muslims here in india.

3) It is for sure that india and muslim nations are not natural allies due to vast differences in culture, society, government,way of thinking etc. Indians find Israel close to their heart because everything including religion has very high degree of similarities.

4) Fourth and most important point ,may be objectionable to few people: Indians are although peace loving but not brave to defend themselves and always searches for a superhero to save them and they find that superhero in Israel. I also believe that israel is really a superhero. we should learn from them. Israel has helped india in difficult times of kargil, terrorist attacks. we should keep in mind that israelis also love indians.

love to israel

A study undertaken on behalf of Israel's foreign ministry by an international market research company found that India is the most pro-Israel country in the world, beating out the United States by two percentage points.

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The study, undertaken as part of the "Branding Israel" project, looked at what it calls the world's 13 most important countries and included 5,215 interviewees. Asked a series of questions, participants graded their sympathy for Israel on a 1-to-10 scale. Some results, given in terms of percentage expressing sympathy to the Jewish State:

58% India
56% United States
52% Russia
52% Mexico
50% China
34% Great Britain
27% France
23% Spain

Comment: The Indian statistic is not the only striking one - note the continent of the countries clustered at the bottom and how much lower their numbers than those of Russia and China. Just as the U.S government should rethink its military alliances, so might Israelis take a fresh look at the globe. (April 3, 2009)

And The Jews do Love India :

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Arabs will realize one thing only that they have to soon take out Israel once and for all otherwise they would be thrown out first than will Israel no peace with Israel can ever take place

 

[Kaniska]

I wonder what the 200 million Indian Muslims feel about this as we all know this "support" comes from hatred for Muslims and nothing else. Alienate your Indian Muslims who in my experience have been really patriotic to India, for Israel.

Then i will ask those Indian Muslim the exact questions, safely of my nation is more important or safety of Palestine? Based on their answer, i will treat them as a traitor or a patriotic. We should make it very simple...to arrive at a conclusion...When Kargil episode was happening, Palenstine people must have supported like as usual way to Pakistan....Then those Indian Muslim and also many Indian secular Hindus too who are standing by Palenstine should answer wheather they care about India or Palstine cause...

 

[gau8av]

"brothers in arms" is taking it a bit far but we are definitely a friendly nation to Israel. India doesn't really figure in middle eastern geopolitics apart from providing insignificant support at the UN, but we have good collaborations in a number of other sectors so that's good.

I like em, they're a good bunch, not easy for them surrounded on all sides by countries where most people would rather see them wiped off the map even if their leaders sign peace deals under US pressure.

also, I'm adding Bibi in my list of badass leaders, when it comes to national interests, dunia gai maa chudane.. he and Putin get shit done.

don't want trouble for India but I hope Modi is cut from the same cloth.

 

[chickenmasala]

^agree. i am pretty neutral to israel, in the end they are still a foreign nation. better to stay out of their problems

 

[xyxmt]

I wonder what the 200 million Indian Muslims feel about this as we all know this "support" comes from hatred for Muslims and nothing else. Alienate your Indian Muslims who in my experience have been really patriotic to India, for Israel.

thats our last hope man, we are counting on it

 

[jarves]

this article i printed out and used it as toilet paper just to let you know.

Good.You are a very intelligent and clever person.
PS-Do you have aby affiliations with Pakistan?? Just asking.

 

[kobenhaven]

Indians should go for it to defeat militant Islam.Israel is the best nation to know how to deal with it. islam is screwed up and it will chew everything coming its way.Deal with it with Iron fist else it will eat you. Don't call me with name from United states to Britain to Spain to Kenya to Nigeria to India to Pakistan they are creating havoc.Prove it otherwise if you can.

 

[INDIC]

this article i printed out and used it as toilet paper just to let you know.

You use hard A4 size paper as toilet paper.

 

[Chanakyaa]

"brothers in arms"

Well, what else would you call a Relation second to none ?

You use hard A4 size paper as toilet paper.

Epic !

 

[gau8av]

Well, what would you call a Relation second to none ?

I would say for eg the US and UK are 'brothers in arms', having gone to war together many times etc

with Israel, we collaborate on some, we buy some, we're friendly.. and thankful for the help provided in Kargil etc but I wouldn't call it a "brothers in arms" kind of cozy

what matters for Israel is US support, of which they have plenty, and it's all they need really, in the end, India going 'yay' or 'nay' on Israel related UN matters really doesn't count for much, just diplomatic niceties, or unpleasantness "minority appeasement"

anyway, they're cool and I support them.. warrior nation, which is sad and cool at the same time

 

[Chanakyaa]

I would say for eg the US and UK are 'brothers in arms', having gone to war together many times etc

with Israel, we collaborate on some, we buy some, we're friendly.. and thankful for the help provided in Kargil etc but I wouldn't call it a "brothers in arms" kind of cozy

what matters for Israel is US support, of which they have plenty, and it's all they need really, in the end, India going 'yay' or 'nay' on Israel related UN matters really doesn't count for much, just diplomatic niceties, or unpleasantness "minority appeasement"

anyway, they're cool and I support them.. warrior nation, which is sad and cool at the same time

Thirty-five years ago, in September 1968, when the Research and Analysis Wing was founded with Rameshwar Nath Kao at its helm, then prime minister Indira Gandhi asked him to cultivate Israel's Mossad. She believed relations between the two intelligence agencies was necessary to monitor developments that could threaten India and Israel.

The efficient spymaster he was, Kao established a clandestine relationship with Mossad. In the 1950s, New Delhi had permitted Tel Aviv to establish a consulate in Mumbai. But full-fledged diplomatic relations with Israel were discouraged because India supported the Palestinian cause; having an Israeli embassy in New Delhi, various governments believed, would rupture its relations with the Arab world.

This was where the RAW-Mossad liaison came in. Among the threats the two external intelligence agencies identified were the military relationship between Pakistan and China and North Korea, especially after then Pakistan foreign minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto visited Pyongyang in 1971 to establish a military relationship with North Korea.

Again, Israel was worried by reports that Pakistani army officers were training Libyans and Iranians to handle Chinese and North Korean military equipment.

RAW-Mossad relations were a secret till Morarji Desai became prime minister in 1977. RAW officials had alerted him about the Zia-ul Haq regime's plans to acquire nuclear capability. While French assistance to Pakistan for a plutonium reprocessing plant was well known, the uranium enrichment plant at Kahuta was a secret. After the French stopped helping Islamabad under pressure from the Carter administration, Pakistan was determined to keep the Kahuta plant a secret. Islamabad did not want Washington to prevent its commissioning.

RAW agents were shocked when Desai called Zia and told the Pakistani military dictator: 'General, I know what you are up to in Kahuta. RAW has got me all the details.' The prime minister's indiscretion threatened to expose RAW sources.

The unfortunate revelation came about the same time that General Moshe Dayan, hero of the 1967 Arab-Israeli war, was secretly visiting Kathmandu for a meeting with Indian representatives. Islamabad believed Dayan's visit was connected with a joint operation by Indian and Israeli intelligence agencies to end Pakistan's nuclear programme.

Apprehensive about an Indo-Israeli air strike on Kahuta, surface-to-air missiles were mounted around the uranium enrichment plant. These fears grew after the Israeli bombardment of Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor in 1981.

Zia decided Islamabad needed to reassure Israel that it had nothing to fear from Pakistan's nuclear plans. Intermediaries -- Americans close to Israel -- established the initial contacts between Islamabad and Tel Aviv. Israel was confidant the US would not allow Pakistan's nuclear capability to threaten Israel. That is why Israeli experts do not mention the threat from Pakistan when they refer to the need for pre-emptive strikes against Iraq, Iran and Libya's nuclear schemes.

By the early 1980s, the US had discovered Pakistan's Kahuta project. By then northwest Pakistan was the staging ground for mujahideen attacks against Soviet troops in Afghanistan and Zia no longer feared US objections to his nuclear agenda. But Pakistani concerns over Israel persisted, hence Zia decided to establish a clandestine relationship between Inter-Services Intelligence and Mossad via officers of the two services posted at their embassies in Washington, DC.

The ISI knew Mossad would be interested in information about the Libyan, Syrian, Jordanian and Saudi Arabian military. Pakistani army officers were often posted on deputation in the Arab world -- in these very countries -- and had access to valuable information, which the ISI offered Mossad.

When young Israeli tourists began visiting the Kashmir valley in the early nineties Pakistan suspected they were Israeli army officers in disguise to help Indian security forces with counter-terrorism operations. The ISI propaganda inspired a series of terrorist attacks on the unsuspecting Israeli tourists. One was slain, another kidnapped.

The Kashmiri Muslim Diaspora in the US feared the attacks would alienate the influential Jewish community who, they felt, could lobby the US government and turn it against Kashmiri organisations clamouring for independence. Soon after, presumably caving into pressure, the terrorists released the kidnapped Israeli. During negotiations for his release, Israeli government officials, including senior intelligence operatives, arrived in Delhi.

The ensuing interaction with Indian officials led to India establishing embassy-level relations with Israel in 1992. The decision was taken by a Congress prime minister -- P V Narasimha Rao -- whose government also began pressing the American Jewish lobby for support in getting the US to declare Pakistan a sponsor of terrorism. The lobbying bore some results.

The US State Department put Pakistan on a 'watch-list' for six months in 1993. The Clinton administration 'persuaded' then Pakistan prime minister Nawaz Sharif to dismiss Lieutenant General Javed Nasir, then director general of the ISI. The Americans were livid that the ISI refused to play ball with the CIA who wanted to buy unused Stinger missiles from the Afghan mujahideen, then in power in Kabul.

After she returned to power towards the end of 1993, Benazir Bhutto intensified the ISI's liaison with Mossad. She too began to cultivate the American Jewish lobby. Benazir is said to have a secret meeting in New York with a senior Israeli emissary, who flew to the US during her visit to Washington, DC in 1995 for talks with Clinton.

From his days as Bhutto's director general of military operations, Pervez Musharraf has been a keen advocate of Pakistan establishing diplomatic relations with the state of Israel.

The new defence relationship between India and Israel -- where the Jewish State has become the second-biggest seller of weapons to India, after Russia -- bother Musharraf no end. Like another military dictator before him, the Pakistan president is also wary that the fear of terrorists gaining control over Islamabad's nuclear arsenal could lead to an Israel-led pre-emptive strike against his country.

Musharraf is the first Pakistani leader to speak publicly about diplomatic relations with Israel. His pragmatic corps commanders share his view that India's defence relationship with Israel need to be countered and are unlikely to oppose such a move. But the generals are wary of the backlash from the streets. Recognising Israel and establishing an Israeli embassy in Islamabad would be unacceptable to the increasingly powerful mullahs who see the United States, Israel and India as enemies of Pakistan and Islam.

 

[JUBA]

I had a good laugh at "brothers in arms".