Blast in Westridge, Rawalpindi

[Hulk]

your consullate serves no productive purpose there.....i would advise the indians to close them down

Afghanistan isnt exactly a safe place for indian

thx for your Advice, I have sent this message to SM Krishna and awaiting his response.

 

[Hulk]

Just an addition, all the people warning India about death toll must remember that IA or India is not afraid of deathtoll when it comes to National Interest. Also finances are not spared. True, it takes time for something to get started, but once started India does not go back. Siachin is a good example of India and IA's resolve in upholding national interest inspite of challenging circumstance and heavy expenditure. Also talibs are not new to us, IA has faced these people in their previous avataars in Kashmir.

Adding to this Talibans are effective in Afghanistan and Pakistan because they have mass support their. They will be not even 50% effective against India. Unless you mean to say Taliban's are better fighter then PA.

Now can we get back to topic.

 

[Bhaarat]

your soviet friends dropped everything and ran, once the body bags started piling up manifold.

Well, the opposite side was supported by another super-power US. Also Soviets never broadened the theatre to Pakistan unlike US/NATO which talk about extending it to quetta through drones.

Afghans have the heart to fight because they have nothing to lose. And they have the time to do so.

This time everyone: Russia, China, India, Iran and US want Afghanistan to stay stable. Losing Afghanistan is not an option for any of them. Only Pakistan wants US to get away. Only Afghans are no match to collective resolve of world powers and its neighbours. Also, the common Afghanis are against the foreign rule and not supportive of talibani rule. India enjoys a favourable image and hence may not be seen as an occupier force unlike the present NATO/US.

moot....they cant occupy what they cant control.

Thats the reason for 30k surge. And if Indian forces join, more boots on ground, then they can control.

Good luck, kiddo.

Thanx Sahib.

I wonder what indian army has that combined foreign forces from industrialized countries dont have.

Safe Logistics, favourable image due to exemplary civic building work, same sub-continental features, hence less resentment, respect for Afghani culture...etc..etc.

BTW, India's COIN abilities are the best. US comes to practice mountain warfare with IA, did you know that?

use those experts to liberate india from the naxalites, who have presence in 70% of the country (20 out of 28 states). Seems they are spreading their influence and engaging in mass sabotage and kidnap operations

Well, Indian forces dont fight their own people unlike PA. Naxalites, though extremists are still Indians.

and then what happened? Besides, Moghul empire was in decline and there was in-fighting; so u cant give saardar too much credit.

Ranjith Singh could perhaps have been the next emperor of India but for the arrival of British. Anyway, he showed that Afghanistan can be conquered and subjugated.

Taleban were in utter disarray and didnt last too long when foreign forces from all the way across the world stepped their foot in. 8 years later, taleban are stronger --not weaker.

strange realities, eh?

Yep, they were in disarray, but US let the momentum go away with another war.

Back yard??? LOLZ

you dont even have a border with land-locked Afghanistan. Your only land route to Central Asia is via Pakistan. Now you're suddenly thinking you have enough tokens to counter Chinese and American influence. China and Pakistan are the ones which will gain the most from this, if they play their cards right thanks to location

Actually, according to the official map of India, India does share border with Afghanistan, it is just that you have occupied that part of Kashmir. So, it is our backyard. US itself is giving us a window of opportuninty but one their terms, if we play the game right, then we will get it on our terms. As for Chinese, they are in a fix as far as Afghanistan is concerned.
And Pakistan, you are the war theatre, boss.

You want to gain by shooing away the yankees and then going back to your erstwhile arrangement of occupying Afghanistan through Talibs. All your calculations are based on the american retreat(if ever it happens).

Afghanistan ideally should be an independent country. But given our enmity with india, we cannot allow india to support anti-Pakistan elements in india. It's really plain and simple.

We share a porous border with Afghanistan, and there are people who see no difference between Afghanistan side and Pakistan side.

Ideally, there should be two states. One for the Pashtuns and one for the Tajiks. The pashtuns can have both sides of durand.

It seems that Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are working in order to weed out certain elements who can be brought to the negotiating table after a little bit of fine-tuning and diplomacy

Good taliban, eh? All the best! One has to confess that KSA does have levers to control, but would it be success is to be seen.

even people like Karzai are desiring this...and being the "leader" (i emphasize the quotation marks) he is in the position to make his demands heard.

And we are in a position to make Karzai listen to us. We have supported them even before the NATO/US came in.

foreign forces will have no choice but to withdraw. Because this is history ironically being repeated again.

You are only looking at last 300years of history and everyone failed there. But the last time an Indian tried it, Ranjith Singh, he was an enormous success. Even before that India had for many centuries occupied Afganistan.

 

[Bhaarat]

Adding to this Talibans are effective in Afghanistan and Pakistan because they have mass support their. They will be not even 50% effective against India. Unless you mean to say Taliban's are better fighter then PA.

Now can we get back to topic.

Also, no soldier in IA would have any sympathy towards Talibs.

 

[Spitfighter]

your consullate serves no productive purpose there.....i would advise the indians to close them down

Afghanistan isnt exactly a safe place for indian

Afghanistan is an independent country and if they want to expand their ties with India, they have every right to do so. Pakistan doesn't even have control over FATA, so forget Afghanistan for the moment. Its not our problem if your borders are porous and your citizens don't respect them. I suggest educating them.

What is and isn't safe for India will be decided by the GoI, I'm sure they have very well trained experts and are in no need of your advice.

In a couple of your posts you've implied that Pakistan will 'not allow' India to have a meaningful presence in Afghanistan. Let me take this opportunity to remind you that the Taliban set off bombs in Pakistan everyday. If you think Pakistan can rollback to pre-2001 conditions then think again.

Proxy wars should be the last thing on the agenda for Pakistan. Furthermore, two can play at that game and since we have the misfortune of being neighbors, the war might not necessarily be limited to Afghanistan.

Pakistan does have its own interests to protect in Afghanistan but that doesn't mean it needs to set off bombs. Pakistan cannot strong arm its way in Afghanistan anymore, it will have to compete with India fair and square. India has built roads, hospitals, schools, even the parliament building. Pakistan also has intricate economic relations with Afghanistan that it could use to its benefit.

War isn't the answer to everything, the Afghans have had enough of that. Give them something they could improve their lives with, like we are.

 

[Silent observer]

Bilal Omer: An officer and a gentleman



Monday, December 07, 2009, THE NEWS

It is over. This sounds so final and, in a manner of speaking, it is. The loved one has been laid to rest; those who came from far and near are returning to their homes; friends and acquaintances who did not attend the rituals of death and burial trickle in to offer their condolences, triggering a fresh feeling of pain and grief — sometimes causing the tears to flow and at others just a heaviness of heart.

Close family members try and comfort each other; recalling beautiful moments — memories of childhood come rushing to the surface, the impish smile of the beloved youngest brother — lovingly called ‘Chappie’ because his face chapped easily — which saved him from being punished or reprimanded after getting into mischief; the years of growing up and making the family proud on many occasions; his caring, generous and friendly nature that extended beyond family to friends; acquaintances and even strangers. Though it may sound like a cliche, “Main hoon na” was his response to anyone facing a problem or in need of help.

Major General Bilal Omer Khan, who was martyred in the cowardly attack on worshippers during Friday prayers, was a soldier par excellence, a brave officer who died with his boots on, as they say, even though he was not on a battlefield. He could have run away during the attack on the Parade Lane mosque but he grappled with a terrorist, managing to overpower him and get him down, when the man took out his pistol and shot him then blew himself up. It was this blast, which took this gallant soldiers life but saved that of many. He lived up to the words he repeated often. “We must not be cowed by these terrorists. We must fight.”

The gate of his house wherever he lived was never locked. “Why don’t you lock your gate,” his neighbours and other visitors asked him. “Terrorists will be able to enter easily.”

“Then we will fight them,” he always replied and also exhorted his family to be prepared to do the same. But a question comes to the minds of those who are left to mourn. Why are sensitive areas devoid of proper security in these difficult times?

Known to his friends as ‘Billy’, Bilal, the youngest of his siblings, was born on February 3, 1954 and was commissioned in the Army in 1973 in the 19th Lancers. He was a sport’s loving person; an excellent polo player and was currently the president of the Pakistan Polo Association and Equestrian Federation.

The hundreds of people who gathered to attend his last rites had nothing but praise for this brave son of the soil and the soldiers who lowered his coffin into his last resting abode wept unashamedly, as did others who were present when he was buried with full military honours. Colonel Raja Nadeem, one of his close associates said his friend was a brave and upright man, a friend of friends and recalled: “Once we were in the mountains for hunting and the temperature there was minus 10 degrees centigrade. I was amazed to see Billy making ablution even in the freezing temperature,” he said. Another friend, Brig Sikander said it was a tragic loss. Others said he was an honourable man and you don’t get to meet many of them these days. And so on. The tributes were endless and are still pouring — genuine messages of grief and distress — from all over the country because he left a mark wherever he stayed and on who ever he met. He died true to the words he lived by. Sad to say, the VIP’s who attended his funeral mouthed words of courage and bravery but forgot to condole with his ninety two year old father, who mourned the loss of his son with the words, “It was my time to go.”

Unfortunately such officers are often overlooked and go unrecognised in their lifetime. It seems that honesty, integrity and a commitment to ones oath as an officer are secondary to other priorities, which are given more importance. They say death leaves a heartache no one can heal but love leaves a memory no one can steal and this will remain true for his brothers and sisters; his many nieces and nephews who will miss their ‘Chappie mamoon’ and ‘Bilal chacha’ and of-course his wife and three children, who have lost a loving husband and father. May your soul rest in peace, Bilal, we love you and we will miss you.

— Ishrat Hyatt

May his soul rest in peace, Amen

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

same sub-continental features

They are fair people

 

[Solomon2]

Am back in Pesh. but earlier today I ventured out to the Masjid....I never get emotional, but to see the state of the Masjid was very difficult moment. All the damage, and the smell of blood of martyrs in the air.

I sympathize; I was twelve when some of my family's friends were taken hostage by terrorists, and fourteen when one of my neighbors was assassinated by an Iranian agent. It makes a powerful impression...

Enemies of this country will never succeed in their ulterior motives. Everybody in Pindi and all Pakistan is affected by the tragedy but by God enemy will feel our wrath. This is a promise. We keep our promises.

The moral certaintude of Pakistanis may seem to be your greatest strength, but it can also be a great weakness, for historically Pakistani leaders have found it easy to manipulate the masses by controlling or confusing their knowledge. Do you think that if ordinary Pakistanis knew what the PA was up to in East Pakistan the war with its huge civilian casualties would have persisted for so long, or that Bangladesh would have come to be at all?

If I may make a modest suggestion, take a page from Agnostic Muslim's book and stick to legal processes and do everything you can to further them, for IMO a successful prosecution and punishment of the perpetrators will do more to strengthen Pakistan than the most just act of mere vengeance.

 

[Bhaarat]

They are fair people

hmm...how childish can this get?!!

I said same sub-conitnental features, that means Indians are similar to afghans compared to NATO/US soldiers, specially the cultural aspect.

 

[iPhone]

See, It was a whine(when I talked about attack on embassy) that our govt should get moving on sending troops to Afghanistan. I do not really wish ill upon my countrymen, having said that, I think it is inevitable. There is sooner than later going to be an attack on our consulate, then we must take it as an opportunity to grab the moment and send the troops.

You seem to assume that IA will die as soon as they go to Afghanistan. I disagree with you. IA can be more successful than others have been. IA is perhaps the best COIN forces, India also enjoys a very positive image among the general afghan populace, and we are good at killing the scums while decreasing the collateral damage. Also, we have logistics via Chabar and the great roadway we built. So, dont worry about IA. IA would be greatly successful if they ever were given a job in Afghanistan. FYI, it is India that is training Afghani forces right now, not Pakistan, not NATO, not the mighty US, but India. You see, we share a great relation with Afghanis, and they just love us. So, no probs.

I'm not doubting your nation's armed forces ability one bit, I'm just saying there will be casualties on your side regardless of how successful operation they conduct. little or significant but there will be casualty on Indian side, you must agree with that. And my question ones again is are you willing to be part of that casualty? are you willing to die in Afghanistan? or you're going to sit conveniently on the sideline, your living room, watching the war unfold, I'm betting on the later.

the coward didn't wanna answer and ditched the question. lol, it's always entertaining to hear the cowards ask of the sacrifice of their soldiers and people for the sake of their own cowardice self.

 

[Bhaarat]

the coward didn't wanna answer and ditched the question. lol, it's always entertaining to hear the cowards ask of the sacrifice of their soldiers and people for the sake of their own cowardice self.

ah, sorry brave soul missed your gem of a post in the mess. I apologise to you.

Yes, there are bound to be casualities. That is a risk we have to take.

As for me fighting on the front, I would be more an annoyance than help there, I can contribute my country in other ways and rest assured I am doing my best.

 

[SSGPA1]

, for historically Pakistani leaders have found it easy to manipulate the masses by controlling or confusing their knowledge. Do you think that if ordinary Pakistanis knew what the PA was up to in East Pakistan the war with its huge civilian casualties would have persisted for so long, or that Bangladesh would have come to be at all?

You are right about our leaders, I don't support JI, Nawaz Sharif or Imran Khan but I still wanted to see them condemning this act of terrorism. Why, because it would have been a unified voice from all platforms. So far I have not seen that and it adds to the confusion for their supporters.

As far as 1971 is concerned, Pakistanis are very much in sinc with the internet and far better aware of what is happening and thanks to Gen. Musharraf who gave media the freedom to operate and today Pakistanis are far more informed and involved than 1971.

 

[iPhone]

ah, sorry brave soul missed your gem of a post in the mess. I apologise to you.

Yes, there are bound to be casualities. That is a risk we have to take.

As for me fighting on the front, I would be more an annoyance than help there, I can contribute my country in other ways and rest assured I am doing my best.

yes, absolutely your cyber war waging tactical contributions are quiet obvious.

 

[Bhaarat]

yes, absolutely your cyber war waging tactical contributions are quiet obvious.

Enough of it. Do you have any point? If not then you are free to shut up.

 

[Vassnti]

My profound sympathy for those killed and injured and their families.

Those fighting with and supporting the TTP must now realise that there can be no middle ground. They must lay down their arms and surrender or realise they are complicit with the murder of innocent children in a Mosque during prayers. They can salvage a little pride and honor by refusing to support those who would do such a thing or continue to fight the Pak army and admit they are the enemies of Pakistan, Islam and humanity.

AM and Solomon are right that vengence is not the solution and i realise the Pakistan army is a profesional organisation but i must admit i would loose no sleep if a few accidents happened to those found responsible for this tragedy.