BALLISTICS MISSILE DEFENCE SYSTEM - Patriot Type or Airborne Laser

[XYON]

Should Pakistan have a ballistic missile defense system to counter primarily the threat from Indian Ballistic missiles? The flying time of the missiles across the border presents a unique technological quagmire on which type of a ballistic missile defense would be feasible if at all?

Technology currently gives us two options, one is a Patriot Missile type point-point interceptor and the other is an aircraft based laser system or Directed Energy Systems which intercepts the missile much earlier and while airborne. Such laser systems have been advanced developed by the Americans called THEL or Tactical High Energy Laser (see L-3 Brashear Directed Energy) and by the Israeli's (mainly to counter land launched projectiles).

It is rumored that Pakistan has developed a very advanced ballistic missile defense system. How true that is? who knows?

 

[TOPGUN]

Well bro i dont if we have developed one yet or working on one !! but i totaly agree with u and all for it we should have one very soon with tension raising the need for system like that is very much needed ! good post epool.

 

[sohailbutt]

there r many systems which can take down enemy ballistic missiles, some of the best are offered by Lockheed Martin, check this link:

Ballistic Missile Defense | Lockheed Martin

In my view, Pakistan has a greater threat from enemy's airforce rather than their missiles, we need to further strengthen our air defence especially defences in AJK and in and around Lahore and Sialkot area, and also Karachi, Hyderabad and now we have threats emerging from our western border with Afghanistan so i think some batteries need to be installed there as well, and we need greater PAF presence in these areas as well.

Ballistic Missile defence in my view is a luxury right now, we donot need it, wut we need is effective defence from enemy's airforce and cruise missiles (brahmos) especially in Karachi, Gwadar and Hydrebad.

believe me if one ballistic missile is fired, that would start a total nuclear war and we would not like to see that happenin

Anyway, mates US is not gonna give us their Ballistic missile defence systems they wuld love to give them to India, reasons very well known

But we have many other European, Chinese or even Russian options open if we need them.

 

[XYON]

there r many systems which can take down enemy ballistic missiles, some of the best are offered by Lockheed Martin, check this link:

Ballistic Missile Defense | Lockheed Martin

In my view, Pakistan has a greater threat from enemy's airforce rather than their missiles, we need to further strengthen our air defence especially defences in AJK and in and around Lahore and Sialkot area, and also Karachi, Hyderabad and now we have threats emerging from our western border with Afghanistan so i think some batteries need to be installed there as well, and we need greater PAF presence in these areas as well.

Ballistic Missile defence in my view is a luxury right now, we donot need it, wut we need is effective defence from enemy's airforce and cruise missiles (brahmos) especially in Karachi, Gwadar and Hydrebad.

believe me if one ballistic missile is fired, that would start a total nuclear war and we would not like to see that happenin

Anyway, mates US is not gonna give us their Ballistic missile defence systems they wuld love to give them to India, reasons very well known

But we have many other European, Chinese or even Russian options open if we need them.

I disagree.

BMD is not a luxury. Any future war with India will have three phases as far as Pakistan is concerned. The 1st Phase will be conventional strikes in air, land and Naval modes. Pakistan will not exhaust its conventional capability to its sheer limit, rather it will prefer going to 2nd Phase which is a limited yield missile strike on main Indian cities and air bases. Naturally, Indians will retaliate with same or even more yield weapons on our cities. Therefore, after the 1st and the 2nd phase above, the 3rd phase will consist of second strike capability. Already SPD has catered for the 3rd Phase by having elaborate underground command and control bunkers all over Pakistan.

BMD will be required by Pakistan to counter the brunt of the Indian barrage of nuke missiles such as the Agni and Prithvi's in order to enhance the effectiveness of the 3rd Phase second strike capability.

Personally I am in favor of airborne directed energy systems which could be integrated on a used cargo Boeing platform (727, 707) or an Airbus (A350) and when we have a threat of Indian missile strikes these platforms could be airborne to cover the corridors from where the Indian missiles are likely to enter Pakistan territory. Naturally Indians will not fire these missiles from the border and will have some depth which will give our ERIEYES enough lead time for detection and likely laser interception.

Any investment in BMD today will bear remarkable defensive results tomorrow. Pakistan geo-strategic location requires an out-of-the-box solution and I think that the airborne laser will do the job just fine.

 

[sohailbutt]

but epool the point is will US give us this weaponary even if we pay them in full???

n remember laser technology is best used when the missile is in boost stage, just take the case where india launches missiles from its eastern borders with Bangladesh or anywhere else, then our AWACS would only detect it in midcourse or terminal stage by then only interceptors like PAC-3 would come in handy.

Also my friend, even US has not perfected the interception technology where ICBM's leave decoy's, many interceptors get confused there and raises a serious question mark at the present moment about their effectiveness.

Yes, i totally agree with ur view that we need interceptors and some real serious one's, like PAC-3, airborne Laser or MEADS but at the present time our economy is in a huge problem, we will inshallah have them when things get normal and when our economy grows much stronger, inshallah in my view in the coming 5 years, hope to see many purchases of these interceptors

 

[XYON]

Butt G - First, I have not implied purchase of this tech from US or any western nation. We have the capability, expertise and tools to develop this in-house in Pakistan. Some head-way is already being made in this case. The tech difference between what US makes and what we can make is the same difference between the F-22 Raptor and JF-17! The requirement of the US vs that of Pakistan makes all the difference (size, weight, speed of the missile for which the BMD is being developed). Our BMD is India-specific so it can make-do with a fewer features as required by the US BMD system for larger platforms (such as the Russian multi-head ICBM and or IRBM)

Second, we do not need 5 years! Our tech boys could do (if not already done) the entire BMD in a very short period of time. Assistance from China is readily available in this case and China can also be the benefactor and joint customer (like the JF-17 program) of the BMD.

Keep your eyes open and ears peeled, you never know when the good news of such a hi-tech development comes across for our nation. And this ain't wishful thinking!

 

[Jihad]

Butt G - First, I have not implied purchase of this tech from US or any western nation. We have the capability, expertise and tools to develop this in-house in Pakistan. Some head-way is already being made in this case. The tech difference between what US makes and what we can make is the same difference between the F-22 Raptor and JF-17! The requirement of the US vs that of Pakistan makes all the difference (size, weight, speed of the missile for which the BMD is being developed). Our BMD is India-specific so it can make-do with a fewer features as required by the US BMD system for larger platforms (such as the Russian multi-head ICBM and or IRBM)

Second, we do not need 5 years! Our tech boys could do (if not already done) the entire BMD in a very short period of time. Assistance from China is readily available in this case and China can also be the benefactor and joint customer (like the JF-17 program) of the BMD.

Keep your eyes open and ears peeled, you never know when the good news of such a hi-tech development comes across for our nation. And this ain't wishful thinking!

I love the way you put these things into thought.
God bless our scientists, and as you call them, our tech boys.

 

[Super Falcon]

sir we need a anti bullastic missile system because india has it too.

 

[Super Falcon]

currently PA has this system in their inventory.











The RBS 70 short-range anti-aircraft missile is operational with the Swedish armed forces and has also been exported to 13 countries worldwide, including Australia, Argentina, Bahrain, Brazil, United Arab Emirates, Indonesia, Iran, Ireland, Norway, Pakistan, Singapore and Tunisia.

"The RBS 70 short-range anti-aircraft missile is operational with the Swedish armed forces."The RBS 70 system entered service in 1977 with the mk 1 missile. Current production model is the mk 2. The Bolide missile is a further development of the mk 2 with a new sustainer rocket motor, which increases missile speed and manoeuvrability. Bolide was ordered by Australia in 2003 with a follow-on order in April 2004.

In November 2004, RBS 70 was ordered by the Latvian Air Force. Deliveries are set for 2006-07.

Also in November 2004, a number of RBS 70 systems were handed over by Norway to Lithuania, free of charge. In December 2004, the Czech Republic placed an order for RBS 70 with the Bolide missile.

In January 2007, Finland placed an order for the RBS 70 missile system. Deliveries are scheduled to begin at the end of 2008.

The RBS 70 missile can be operated independently in stand-alone mode or can be configured with several firing units linked with a surveillance radar to form an anti-aircraft battery. The truck-mounted Giraffe land mobile radar developed by Ericsson (now Saab Microwave Systems) can be linked to nine RBS 70 firing posts, The firing posts, typically 4km apart, protect an area of 175km². The target data, including range, bearing and velocity is transmitted to each designated missile firing post.

RBS 70 MISSILE
The basic RBS 70 comprises the missile in a launch container, a tripod firing stand and an optical sight. It is operable by one, and portable by three persons.

"The RBS 70 anti-aircraft missile has a laser beam detector mounted at the back of the missile."The missile is equipped with a solid propellant booster motor developed by Bofors and a solid propellant sustainer motor by BAE Systems Land Systems (Royal Ordnance) and Imperial Metal Industries. When the operator fires the missile, the booster motor is ignited inside the launch tube and the missile is accelerated out of the tube. The control surfaces and the four fins open into position as the missile leaves the tube. The sustainer motor ignites after the missile has travelled a safe distance from the launch position. The booster is subsequently jettisoned.

RBS 70 NIGHT SIGHT
A Saab Vectronics (now FLIR Systems) close loop cooled COND (Clip-On Night Device) operating in the 8 micron to 12 micron infrared band gives the system day and night capability. COND has a 12 x 8° field of view.

Saab Bofors Dynamics has placed an order with FLIR Systems Inc for a new clip-on night sight for the RBS 70 called BORC. BORC is based on QWIP (Quantum Well Infrared Photodetector) thermal imaging technology.

OPERATION

The RBS 70 has laser beam riding guidance, riding a laser signal being beamed from its own launch station, rather than being guided from the front towards the reflected signal from a laser designated target.

A hostile target can be located visually by the missile operator or the target can be detected by a search radar. When the target is acquired, the operator tracks the target and the Raytheon Cossor IFF880 friend or foe system interrogates the target. If a friendly target is detected, a warning light in the sight is illuminated and the firing sequence is halted. The operator aims the missile towards the target, fires and tracks the target, aiming a laser guidance beam continuously at the target until the moment of impact.

"A hostile target can be located visually by the RBS 70 missile operator or the target can be detected by a search radar."The RBS 70 missile has a laser beam detector mounted at the back of the missile which detects the laser guidance beam. The outputs from the laser beam detectors in the tail of the missile are used by an onboard processor to generate the steering and course correction signals to the missile control fins. The missile's flight is gyroscopically stabilised.

The missile has no seeker head at the front of the missile and the laser beam riding system in the tail of the missile is extremely difficult to jam.

If the missile loses the laser beam or if no guidance signals are received after a predetermined period of time during missile flight the missile switches to self-destruct mode.

The missile is armed with a 1.1kg fragmented warhead fitted with a Saab Bofors laser proximity fuse and an impact fuse.

RBS 70 MK 1+ MISSILE
The RBS 70 mk 1+ missile was developed for the Swedish Army and is fitted with an enhanced capability laser seeker with an expanded field of view. A 30% increase in the engagement envelope results from the 57° field of view (compared to 40° in the mk 1 variant). Where a crossing target is being engaged, the wider field of view allows a wider angle between the missile flight path and the laser guidance beam.

RBS 70 MK 2
The mk 2 missile has a 100% increase in area coverage compared to the mk 1. The mk 2 version incorporates a smaller digital electronic control unit, a larger sustainer motor and a heavier warhead, providing an increased speed of 590m/s and range of 7km, with improved armour penetration characteristics.

The warhead is 50% heavier and incorporates fragmentation pellets and a shaped hollow charge for armour penetration against armoured helicopter targets.

BOLIDE

The Bolide missile is a development of the RBS 70 mk 2. It has a maximum speed of more than Mach 2, faster than the RBS70 which has a speed of Mach 1.6.

"The RSB 70 anti-aircraft missile is armed with a 1.1kg fragmented warhead."The Bolide missile design incorporates a number of new systems including a fibre-optic gyroscope, an adaptable proximity fuse which provides all-target capability and a high kill probability against small and dark targets, new sustainer rocket motor with an improved performance propellant and new electronics. The new sustainer rocket motor gives the missile a shorter time of flight and higher manoeuvrability than the RBS 70.

The new compact reprogrammable electronics suite installed in the missile allows the system to be easily upgraded with new software. The missile is primarily for air defence with a maximum intercept altitude at over 5,000m, but it can also be deployed against surface targets. It has a range of 250m to 8,000m.