BAF hopes to achieve Air Superiority with new fighter jets from China

[Armstrong]

That's exactly what I am saying.. Yeah! I double checked it and the actual cost is $210M that gives you $13.13M per unit. For $20M you would also get Mig-29S brand new.

Yaaraa post a credible source to confirm that figure for us because if its true than this appears to be beyond ridiculous !

 

[Mig-35]

I want to appeal! I DO so know what a Storm Trooper is. But if this one is doing what I think he is doing, Zabaniya needs to add more bromide to his stew.

No!! The trooper is not doing what you think it is doing....

 

[Joe Shearer]

No!! The trooper is not doing what you think it is doing....

Hmphm. That's what you say. I say 14 days confined to quarters, and extra drill to work that excess energy out of his system.

 

[Armstrong]

Don't know the specifics but my understanding is that it is not as simple as buying the planes.... You need the whole technical and maintenance setup around it. We have these for the F7 although not for the migs for which we still rely on foreign help. BGIs represented reduced total cost of ownership in the long run....

Are they able to defend our skies are another matter..... On the whole in my uneducated in military matters opinion is they are not a great purchase....I believe in military matters you develop/buy things in line with your threat perception.... I do not see how BGIs do that....

Nah mate, the F-7s are a pretty decent dogfighter & is still relevant as a decent interceptor. In fact, unless I'm mistaken, I do have a vivid recollection reading right here on this forum comments to the effect, by some of the more knowledgeable guys, that the PGs performance was, in certain aspects of dogfighting, only marginally worse-off than that of some of the earlier model F-16s which in turn were even better dogfighters than later model F-16s. Additionally because the BVR only combat hasn't quite panned out as it was supposed to & I've read some eminent posters & they in turn quoting many an analysts & ex-air force men (including a USAF Colonel) that the age of the WVR is still very, very much relevant, having a platform like an F-7 might not be such a bad buy.

What I have qualms over is, that if the figures posted by Mig-35, are indeed correct & the BGIs due cost an astounding $15 million a unit, what the hell is exactly in them ? The F-7 nose cone is too small to host a radar that can provide anything beyond borderline BVR capability just like our PGs, there doesn't appear to be significant increases in the hard points, EM equipment, RCS reduction or engine performance. What in god's name did those $15 million go into, if its true that is ?

 

[Zabaniyah]

Zabaniya, what is your avatar up to? It is a very disturbing image. Also very distracting.

Dancing storm trooper. Dirty dancing

 

[Luftwaffe]

That's exactly what I am saying.. Yeah! I double checked it and the actual cost is $210M that gives you $13.13M per unit. For $20M you would also get Mig-29S brand new.

No Russian Air Force is willing to sell second hand Mig-29s out of it's Inventory, they sold second hand but upgraded mig-29s to Vietnam and Now if BAF accepts, you people will get modest upgraded second hand Mig-29s. Lebanon are also offered second hand mig-29s as gifts free of charge. For the purpose of Information $20M mig-29 would require equal amount for spares and other equipment life time costs that makes your mig-29 atleast $40M a piece but the maintainence is so high i would put it at $48-50M over the life time..

 

[mb444]

From what I read they cost $15m a piece and to be delivered with sd-10 bvr missiles .....

No idea if that's good or not .....

 

[eastwatch]

As far as I know by reading some informative article BGI costed us less than US$10 million (or around $9 million) each unit at friendship price. So, we spent about $160 million to buy 16 BGIs. Although people predict or talk about F-7MBs to be replaced by these BGIs, but it is inconcievable to me. Why on earth BAF will retire 7 A-5s as well as 16 MBs with the arrival of only 16 BGIs?

So, only the A-5s will be replaced this time. My understanding is 12 F-7MBs & 4 FT-7MBs will be retired at a later time when the 4.5G planes are inducted. BAF is not that rich to throw away 16 units of MBs at the same time without any reason. We are a Dholai Khal country, we know how to keep on using these planes. BAF has already retired 39 jet planes so far and 7 A-5s will be retired soon.

The Russian YAK-130 training planes will arrive for the training of 4.5G pilots. I have read that these training planes can train pilots of any made 4.5G jets of the world. Let us wait and see when the givt declares the induction of the promised two three sq. of 4.5G planes. Like any other airforce BAF should also mix its planes with highs and lows, and this is what it is doing.

 

[Zabaniyah]

^^^And weapons, ammo, spares, infrastructure, etc. comes free?

 

[eastwatch]

Nah mate, the F-7s are a pretty decent dogfighter & is still relevant as a decent interceptor. In fact, unless I'm mistaken, I do have a vivid recollection reading right here on this forum comments to the effect, by some of the more knowledgeable guys, that the PGs performance was, in certain aspects of dogfighting, only marginally worse-off than that of some of the earlier model F-16s which in turn were even better dogfighters than later model F-16s. Additionally because the BVR only combat hasn't quite panned out as it was supposed to & I've read some eminent posters & they in turn quoting many an analysts & ex-air force men (including a USAF Colonel) that the age of the WVR is still very, very much relevant, having a platform like an F-7 might not be such a bad buy.

What I have qualms over is, that if the figures posted by Mig-35, are indeed correct & the BGIs due cost an astounding $15 million a unit, what the hell is exactly in them ? The F-7 nose cone is too small to host a radar that can provide anything beyond borderline BVR capability just like our PGs, there doesn't appear to be significant increases in the hard points, EM equipment, RCS reduction or engine performance. What in god's name did those $15 million go into, if its true that is ?

There was a time when F-7s were called poor man's F-16s. In some previous posts I asked and a Chinese poster replied that BGi has now 7 hard points (3 + 3 + 1(below fuselage) instead of only 5hard points for all other variants of F-7. Wiki says BGI is the most advanced among all the variants of F-7 planes. Its climbing rate is 195m/sec and its maximum speed is 2.0 mach.

Its BVR range is somewhere between 40 to 50 km. I just do not know if BVR capability is correct or not with the short nose it has. However, the New Age report speaks of its capability to jamm the enemy plane's radar forcing it to dogfight. Friendship price is $10 million or less.

 

[Armstrong]

There was a time when F-7s were called poor man's F-16s. In some previous posts I asked and a Chinese poster replied that BGi has now 7 hard points (3 + 3 + 1(below fuselage) instead of only 5hard points for all other variants of F-7. Wiki says BGI is the most advanced among all the variants of F-7 planes. Its climbing rate is 195m/sec and its maximum speed is 2.0 mach.

Its BVR range is somewhere between 40 to 50 km. I just do not know if BVR capability is correct or not with the short nose it has. However, the New Age report speaks of its capability to jamm the enemy plane's radar forcing it to dogfight. Friendship price is $10 million or less.

As you know its near impossible to get a price quotation from the company for these birds made available on the internet so I scoured the internet for a definite price tag for the F-7 PGs one source placed it at $3 million per piece whereas most others placed it at around $5 million per piece. Lets consider it as the higher of the two at $5 million per piece.

The PG's maximum climbing rate is also 195 m/sec whereas the F-7P's is 180 m/sec. The maximum speed too for the PGs is Mach 2.0 & the same for the F-7Ps. So in case of the BGIs if the numbers you provided and the stats available to me for the PGs are correct than there is no improvement in these to parameters when the BGI is compared with the PGs.

The PG's carry a Griffo radar with the following stats :
Range : 55+ KM
Look-up : 25+ NM
Look-Down : 20+ NM
Track-While-Scan
+-20 degrees Horigontal Range

F-7 variants, to the best of my knowledge, either had the Type 226 PD Radars with their 15 km range or the Griffo 7s (export versions). If the Chinese have come up with some newer radar variants....I dunno but that nose cone ain't big enough to support anything that I know of that would give it real BVR capability ! But lets assume that it does - What in god's name is in that radar to warrant a $5 million jump & that too at, as you say, 'friendship price' ?

About the ability to Jam the enemy planes radar to force it to dogfight ! I hope its true but right now I don't know of a single Chinese Aircraft that has that ability not even most Western Aircrafts have that ability, in fact, apart from the Rafaels I can't think of anyone & even in that case I dunno how much is the truth & how much is just hearsay.

God knows whats in those birds to warrant such a price tag !

 

[Luftwaffe]

Although people predict or talk about F-7MBs to be replaced by these BGIs, but it is inconcievable to me. Why on earth BAF will retire 7 A-5s as well as 16 MBs with the arrival of only 16 BGIs?

So, only the A-5s will be replaced this time. My understanding is 12 F-7MBs & 4 FT-7MBs will be retired at a later time when the 4.5G planes are inducted. BAF is not that rich to throw away 16 units of MBs at the same time without any reason. We are a Dholai Khal country, we know how to keep on using these planes. BAF has already retired 39 jet planes so far and 7 A-5s will be retired soon.

BAF [7 in Inventory] A-5C Fantans were purchased in 80s These Airframes are around 25 Years old The most accurate forcast is All 7 A-5s will be retired by 2015 And [10 in Inventory] F-7/FT-7MB are scheduled to retire when BGIs reach full Squadron strength so expect 2014 could be the right time.

The Russian YAK-130 training planes will arrive for the training of 4.5G pilots. I have read that these training planes can train pilots of any made 4.5G jets of the world. Let us wait and see when the givt declares the induction of the promised two three sq. of 4.5G planes. Like any other airforce BAF should also mix its planes with highs and lows, and this is what it is doing.

Part of the Report:
(I did read the article translation as posted by someone on Russian MRCA in Bangladesh Section)
"In the Medium Term Budget Framework (MTBF), it was revealed that the Air Force would replace 16 fighter planes and 16 training planes."

This means 16 F-7/FT-7MBs will be replaced as soon all BGIs are induced and operational.

AFAIK regarding 16 Training planes it seems 6 remaining FT-6 and 7 remaining L-39 will be replaced in favor of YAK-130/133. Note that YAK-130/133 can carry out light fighter duties as well.

 

[bdslph]

it can be achieved in future not now we must have more good planes like Su27 su30 Mig29 armed UAV

not with F7 series and what we have now A5

 

[rahathminhaj]

let me clear everyone's confusion about the price, "not to forget we are good in CORRUPTION", our politicians will never help armed forces without their own advantage.

 

[bdslph]

it is sad to see the F7 are high price and there is not much different from other F7 models of new ones and there is off course corruption which is favorite part in our country