Babur vs Krishnadevaraya in 16th century

[ghaja]

Who could win a battle between the 2 most powerful rulers of early 16th century India?
Both rulers ruled during the same period in the early 16th century. Babur (1483-1530) was the founder of the Mughal Empire of north India and Krishnadevaraya (1471-1529) was the greatest ruler of the Vijayanagar Empire in southern India.

Babur

Krishnadevaraya

 

[AUz]

Babur...he was more viscous and had that 'barbarian' instinct....

 

[Yabgu]

Mighty Turkic ruler Babür.

He left the legacy of Babürname. Needs to be read.

 

[Icewolf]

Krishnadev-whatever seemed more like a paper tiger to Babur's eyes. So definently Babur.

 

[danger007]

Krishnadev-whatever seemed more like a paper tiger to Babur's eyes. So definently Babur.

If you don't have knowledge then be like that... don't open faulty ..... Krishna devarayala is very power full indeed... can't say like that... who can win....

 

[Jazzbot]

And we'll conclude on what basis? Pointless thread..

 

[Jaggu]

Probably Babur. He defeated the greatest kings in India at the time. He beat the whole Pathan army at the first battle of Panipat and if that wasn't enough he then went on to defeat the combined Rajput army in the battle of Khanwa which also included thousands of Lodi soldiers. In both of these epic battles Babur was outnumbered.

 

[Dandpatta]

Simple - BABUR !!!

 

[INDIC]

I believe it would have been impossible for Babur to defeat Krishnadeva Raya, his kingdom flourished in most extreme conditions.

 

[Vinod2070]

If you don't have knowledge then be like that... don't open faulty ..... Krishna devarayala is very power full indeed... can't say like that... who can win....

Well, we know even less about the Yemenese tribal history.

But then we don't claim to do that either.

Babur to me was a primitive barbarian, making minarets of skulls in several places.

The first skull minarets (like the other fil.th from the primitive barbaric place he came from) he made were of Pushtuns. This is what he mentions about the Pakistani Pushtuns (Afghans in those times):

Against the all round assault, they could not even fight; a hundred or two were taken, some were brought in alive but of most, the heads only were brought. We had been told that when Afghans are powerless to resist, they go before their foe with grass between their teeth, this being as much as to say, " I am your cow." Here we saw this custom ; Afghans unable to make resistance, came before us with grass between their teeth. Those our men had brought in as prisoners were ordered to be beheaded and a pillar of their heads was set up in our camp.

I don't give a flying f*** if he was "brave", to me he was just a primitive barbarian from a primitive barbaric place.

 

[GR!FF!N]

First,Babur's advantage in any battle was his cannon..sometimes mounted and guarded these cannons worked for himm..in the battle of Panipat against Lodi,his success was simply luck..

in both battle,it was sound of cannon that made war elephants stampede their own man and in both cases,the abandon of ally caused them to loose the battle..

Krishnadevaraya had a huge army...example..only in the campaign against Raichur, it is said that 703,000 foot soldiers, 32,600 cavalry and 551 elephants were used..

with this kind of brute force,he captured whole Deccan...

I'd say,both Babur and Krishnadevaraya would won in their home turf...

 

[Water Car Engineer]

Babur would have superior artillery I would guess.

 

[SwatCat]

Krishna Devaraya has a well organized and battle hardened army

The army of Raya consists of

The numerical strength of the Vijayanagaram army is disputed. Nikolo Cante reported a figure of 90,000 men during the reign of Rayala but Fernao Nuniz claimed it to be around 100,000, consisting of 70,000 foot soldiers, 32,000 cavalry and 550 war elephants. Rayawacha countered that the force contained 500,000 foot soldiers, 60,000 cavalry and 1,200 war elephants.

Where as Babur army faced

It is estimated that Babur's forces numbered around 15,000 men and had between 20 to 24 pieces of field artillery. Babur estimated Lodi had around 100,000 men, though that number included camp followers, while the fighting force was around 30,000 to 40,000 men in total, along with at least 1000 war elephants.[1]

Clearly shows that Krishna Devaraya has a very strong cavalry force along with War elephants compared to Ibrahim Lodi.

Terrain plays a vital role in the battle.

if we take into account of a plain terrain Krishnadevaraya with his cavalry can defeat Babur. He can charge against Babur's artillery and destroy.If it is a Jungle or Mountainous the numerical superiority of Raya forces will win him the battle.

 

[krash]

Well, we know even less about the Yemenese tribal history.

But then we don't claim to do that either.

Babur to me was a primitive barbarian, making minarets of skulls in several places.

The first skull minarets (like the other fil.th from the primitive barbaric place he came from) he made were of Pushtuns. This is what he mentions about the Pakistani Pushtuns (Afghans in those times):

Against the all round assault, they could not even fight; a hundred or two were taken, some were brought in alive but of most, the heads only were brought. We had been told that when Afghans are powerless to resist, they go before their foe with grass between their teeth, this being as much as to say, " I am your cow." Here we saw this custom ; Afghans unable to make resistance, came before us with grass between their teeth. Those our men had brought in as prisoners were ordered to be beheaded and a pillar of their heads was set up in our camp.

I don't give a flying f*** if he was "brave", to me he was just a primitive barbarian from a primitive barbaric place.

And he gave you and us the Mogul empire and dynasty. You know, the one we're both so proud to show to the world......flip side my friend, flip side.

 

[Sashan]

Babur had less than 25,000 soldiers while fighting Lodi whereas Krishnadevaraya used more than 700,000 soldiers in one of the campaigns against Deccan sultanates - siege of Raichur. Babur had about 25 Cannons (the earliest instance of use of Field artillery) against Lodi who did not have any Cannons and though he had 100,000 men and few hundred elephants as well, the Cannons frightened the elephants while providing decisive advantage in the battlefield for Babur.

Krishnadevaraya used Cannons as well in the Siege of Raichur while Ismail Adil Shah had 200 Cannons.

So here is the comparison

Babur with 12000 men and about 25 cannons vs Lodi with 100,000 men and 1000 elephants - Decisive victory Babur

Krishnadevaraya with 700,000 men, 27,000 cavalry, 500 elephants, some cannons(don't know the nos but the technology was provided by Portuguese) - Adilshah - 200 heavy cannons and few hundred smaller cannons(technology from Ottoman gun makers) - he had in 400 to 500 cannons in total captured by Krishnadevaraya when he won the war.


So it is a straight forward inference - Cannons proved an advantage for Babur with Lodi

Conclusion

But with Krishnadevaraya's 7 times larger force compared to Lodi, Babur with smaller no of men with no Cannon advantage wouldn't have been able to do anything. Babur's army would have been slaughtered in the battle.