Ataturk's Legacy vs Caliphate and implications for Pakistan

[Killuminati]

We accepted and payed Ottaman Empire's massive debt to Brits after Republic established , what do you mean by never acknowledged?

What if we didnt pay?

 

[hussain0216]

Why are you getting bent of shape, attaturk will not attain paradise and will most likely burn in the fires of hell

Even liberal secular muslims know this, on what basis would a man like him attain jannat


So no we why should anyone follow a dammed man



Strength will indeed return to the muslim world, islam has already warned us about the hypocrites

The neo liberal scum here are as close to the hypocrites mentioned in the quran as any

 

[INDIC]

We accepted and payed Ottaman Empire's massive debt to Brits after Republic established , what do you mean by never acknowledged?

How Turkey sustained herself after 1918 and prevented chaos like Germany.

 

[AtillaHun]

We accepted and payed Ottaman Empire's massive debt to Brits after Republic established , what do you mean by never acknowledged?

No i think it was split up into all the countries , im 80% sure. Please read treaty of laussane

 

[Alienoz_TR]

Why are you getting bent of shape, attaturk will not attain paradise and will most likely burn in the fires of hell

Even liberal secular muslims know this, on what basis would a man like him attain jannat


So no we why should anyone follow a dammed man


Strength will indeed return to the muslim world, islam has already warned us about the hypocrites

The neo liberal scum here are as close to the hypocrites mentioned in the quran as any

You are free to think anyway you like. I am not gonna judge you. He, Ataturk personally means nothing to you. Lets consider him non-Muslim, he didnt do any good for Muslim world. I may accept such claim.

On the other hand, He commanded an army that pushed back British-French-Indian-Australian-New Zeland-etc. army in Gallipoli 1915.

He twice commanded an army which defeated Greek forces in 1921 and 1922, taking back Izmir from Greeks and Istanbul from British.

He took back Antioch in 1938/39.

Last century did not bring any better Turkish strategician/general to replace his legacy.

Btw his nickname was Grey Wolf. Some called him Blond Wolf.

 

[hussain0216]

Pity grey wolf is burning in hell then, he sealed his own fate and condemned himself

He suffers due to his own actions

 

[AtillaHun]

Pity grey wolf is burning in hell then, he sealed his own fate and condemned himself

He suffers due to his own actions

British wolfs are also burning in hell . ''British hussain''

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

i wouldnt blame Ataturk at all.....after all he himself was a distinguished officer in the Ottoman Army

blame the wahhabis for siding with the britishers


and i do agree with Faujhistorians analysis.....it was either cling onto a dying mindset (and lose and be conquered) or work hard for a Turkish Republic state


I think Ataturk was a great leader and I wish we had leaders like him, to be honest.

 

[Armstrong]

i wouldnt blame Ataturk at all.....after all he himself was a distinguished officer in the Ottoman Army

blame the wahhabis for siding with the britishers


and i do agree with Faujhistorians analysis.....it was either cling onto a dying mindset (and lose and be conquered) or work hard for a Turkish Republic state


I think Ataturk was a great leader and I wish we had leaders like him, to be honest.

Oh come on yaar...why lynch us Wahabis for every ill in the world ? Its a religious movement not a political one ! If the Arabs revolted what had Abdul Wahab got to do with it ?

 

[Alienoz_TR]

Oh come on yaar...why lynch us Wahabis for every ill in the world ? Its a religious movement not a political one ! If the Arabs revolted what had Abdul Wahab got to do with it ?

Arabs have the right to govern themselves. No Turk feel grudge against their wish to be independent. Every nation revolted against Ottomans, from Greeks to Arabs. The age of monarchy ended with them.

 

[Armstrong]

Arabs have the right to govern themselves. No Turk feel grudge against their wish to be independent. Every nation revolted against Ottomans, from Greeks to Arabs. The age of monarchy ended with them.

Yes and so ended the last Muslim Empire on Earth ! It would have been better if the Ottoman Empire was purged of her decadence, corruption and nepotism instead of being scrapped altogether as a bad dream ! Imagine what a democratic Ottoman Empire with the Sultan having the same position as the Queen of England and all powers devolved to the Parliament, would have looked like ! A Muslim Superpower of our own to stand up for the rest of us ! An entity that embodied the very best traditions of Islamic Scholarship and did what we haven't been able to for the past 70-80 years - Bring about a Renaissance in the Muslim World and show the world through practical, working models the alternative paradigm that we claim Islam provides us ! Ahhh...wouldn't that be something worth fighting for ? Too bad...we the Muslims ourselves, like always, were our biggest enemies and we turned on each other before any foreign enemy could !

 

[Patriot]

Ataturk was a true patriotic leader.I wish such a leader is born in Pakistan.If Turkey hadn't been modernized by Ataturk then today Turkey would be like other poor Muslims states which would be exploited by Gulf/Arab States .I think mods should ban these members who are abusing Ataturk he is founder of Turkey and no one should abuse him.How would Pakistanis feel if Turks start abusing M Jinnah?

 

[Alienoz_TR]

Yes and so ended the last Muslim Empire on Earth ! It would have been better if the Ottoman Empire was purged of her decadence, corruption and nepotism instead of being scrapped altogether as a bad dream ! Imagine what a democratic Ottoman Empire with the Sultan having the same position as the Queen of England and all powers devolved to the Parliament, would have looked like ! A Muslim Superpower of our own to stand up for the rest of us ! An entity that embodied the very best traditions of Islamic Scholarship and did what we haven't been able to for the past 70-80 years - Bring about a Renaissance in the Muslim World and show the world through practical, working models the alternative paradigm that we claim Islam provides us ! Ahhh...wouldn't that be something worth fighting for ? Too bad...we the Muslims ourselves, like always, were our biggest enemies and we turned on each other before any foreign enemy could !

I was not educated/brought up to imagine a Turkey/Ottoman State where constitutional monarchy with a symbolic Sultan exists. That's beyond my imagination.

It was a revolution, some may even have thought Bolshevik style execution of royal family. At the end they were deported. And revolution changed the figures and the minds.

Children used to say: "My Padishah, may you live long"
Children now say: "My father/ancestor (Ata), we are on your path"

 

[FaujHistorian]

..... Imagine what a democratic Ottoman Empire with the Sultan having the same position as the Queen of England and all powers devolved to the Parliament,..... !

All noble thoughts. Dare I say.

However Sultan was no Queen, not in intellect, nor in vision, nor in power.

But more importantly, the "would be" subjects of this Sultani-Queen were no match against the dynamic British society that was excelling in everything science, arts, literature, philosophy and you name it.

Muslims on the other hand were pithoos (blind followers) of Mullees just like today.

So your hopes and dreams are based on air-castles my friend. But you are not alone.

Indian Muslims from Bihar and UP, the dirt poorest of the poor among Indians always dreamt of some Khalifa Hazrat Falooda. Perhaps this was the only way for them low-lifers to have an out of body experience for 5 minutes away from bhook, nung, abject poverty.

the same Indian Muslim came to Karachi under Liaqat Ali's Quota system and started Islamo-fascism that goes on until today albiet under the name of Mohajir fascism. I have heard so many of my elders talk about Khilafah Lifafah that I had to do some research as to why they are stuck in a world that even Turks the real inheritors of Khilafa are not willing to live in. Why?

peace

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Ataturk was a true patriotic leader.I wish such a leader is born in Pakistan.If Turkey hadn't been modernized by Ataturk then today Turkey would be like other poor Muslims states which would be exploited by Gulf/Arab States .I think mods should ban these members who are abusing Ataturk he is founder of Turkey and no one should abuse him.How would Pakistanis feel if Turks start abusing M Jinnah?

I agree 100% with you. I also wish we had/get a great leader like Ataturk.