Army Rejects Gillani Claims - Gillani sacks Defence Secretary

[BATMAN]

Politicians have always undermined Pakistan and its institutions.

Army has responded rightfully in his defence.

Gilani and Ghadari has hijacked Pakistan and destroyed all institutions, while army is the last functioning institution.

Pakistan's security threats are far bigger than any state of the world.

 

[Rahil khan]

Army knows, Supreme Court knows, all the Pakistanis know that what the hell Government is trying to do....They have already completed their four years and last year is an year of elections......So what Government has to show us.......Hajj Scandal? NRO scandal? Rental power? Gas Shortage? Unemployment? Terrorism? Memo gate issue? These are all the gifts of this fake democracy....But army will never get intimidated by such foolish and stupid actions....They will stand behind the Supreme Court... Let Judiciary grab there neck on 16th of January....Let Mr. Zardari be sent back to his cave where his originally belongs .... and now we should prepare for the elections... Let me get this straight....There is no chance of another military coup......

 

[lionheartsalahudin]

.

wow did u know that Nato is not one country and Most members are developed states no where near as bankrupt as Pakistan is.

.

Do u know that Indians economy and land mass is way Bigger then we are again thanx to the Military men.



Do u know that's more then Americans spend on there military GDP wise.





I guess you have Inside knowledge

.

440 billion dosent even cover the salaries of Military personals



Again all destroyed By generals but i am sure you cant see that part



Stick around no one on this forum holds back when it comes to corruption of Pakistani politicians and generals

first of my oppologise to forum admins for leading a bit off topic but this guy is attacking the army.

have to respond on the amount he allocated that is spent on the army.well lets not forget all this political types are so noble men pml-ns and ppp's that they rarely say no to the salaries and allownces paid to them by parliament am refering to mna's and mpa's ,salaries and allowences.

here is a picture of our national assemly's salary and allowences expences


16
FEB
Salary of Pakistan’s MNAs (Member Of National Assembly)
Posted by admin



Salary & Govt. Concessions for a Member of NATIONAL ASSEMBLY (MNA)

Monthly Salary : Rs. 120,000 to 200,000

Expense for Constitution per month : Rs.100,000
Office expenditure per month : Rs.140,000
Traveling concession (Rs. 8 per km) : Rs.48,000 (For a visit to ISLAMABAD & return): 6000 km


Daily BETA during Assembly meets : Rs.500
Charge for 1st class (A/C) in train : Free (For any number of times all over PAKISTAN )
Charge for Business Class in flights: Free for 40 trips / year (With wife or P.A.)
Rent for Govt.. hostel any where: Free
Electricity costs at home : Free up to 50,000 units
Local phone call charge : Free up to 1,70,000 calls
TOTAL expense for a MNA per year : Rs. 32,000,000
TOTAL expense for 5 years : Rs. 1,60,000,000
For 534 MNA, the expense for 5 years;
Rs. 85 , 440,000,000 (more than 800 Korores)

And they are elected by THE PEOPLE OF PAKISTAN, through a democratic process of this world, not intruded into the assembly on their own or by any qualification. This is how all our tax money is been swallowed and price hike on our regular commodities… Think of the great democracy we have?

Salary of Pakistan’s MNAs (Member Of National Assembly) | Pakistan News With Pakistan Ideology

and thats only for national assemblly ,let alone provincial and local bodies,and all they do is administrative tasks plus mostly 99 percent of administrative officals and electives are financially well off,but haven't seen or heard giving up their salaries and allowneces for there whole term for people ,NO! sir they love money even if it bleeds our nation dry.so patriots they are

army is much different then these lazy a** politicans they are on the borders defending our nationputing their lives at stake and at the same time the burdening task of keeping an eye on these political traitors who always try to sell out our national security.and how dare u ask or even question abt their salaries ,first look into ur own league and ppp can they sacrifice as much as the army has over the years.

anyways,every one vote for pti,pakistan zindabad,isi forever

 

[livingdead]

The pakistani fascination with democracy continues.
I will probably repeat the above like in many thread in coming days, but I have heard exactly same arguments before.
Army is good, they are not corrupt like these guys-oh sh*t we should have democracy army is bad - no army is good better than...........

 

[Omar1984]

PA has also been completely in cahoots with USA whenever it has ruled. Musharraf was their staunchest ally in the WoT.

Well at least Musharraf built the economy and made so many developments in Pakistan, and there were less bomb blasts in Pakistan when he was leading Pakistan. What has Zardari given to Pakistan?

As I said before, indians are happy incompetent corrupt politicians like Zardari and Gilani are leading Pakistan so Pakistan can suffer.

 

[Omar1984]

Coup will ahve serious repercursions for Pakistan. A lot of sanctions will be put on Pakistan. Political stability is the biggest thing for the prosperity of a Nation. I hope sanity prevails.

China doesn't have democracy and no country is sanctioning China. Saudi Arabia doesn't have democracy, and everyone wants to do business with Saudis.

Democracy is not needed to have a prosperous nation.

 

[asad71]

It is interesting to see PA involving itself in political debates and legal fights. If they think the civilians have failed, then PA should just cross the Rubicon.

 

[asad71]

Kyani is amazingly patient for a military commander. A good quality for a political leader with military backing.

 

[janon]

China doesn't have democracy and no country is sanctioning China. Saudi Arabia doesn't have democracy, and everyone wants to do business with Saudis.

Democracy is not needed to have a prosperous nation.

I'll explain the difference in both the cases. The west does have an arms embargo on China since the crushing of the pro democracy movement in 1989. China is a huge economy though, and has a lot to offer the world, so thats about as far as they will go. Pakistan does not have that advantage. Also, China does have a functioning government, although it is not democratically elected. It is a far cry from military rule.

As for Saudi, they sit on top of a lot of oil, and the rest of the world is happy to indulge any regime that gives them that oil, even if the people of the country have no personal freedoms, and do not have the luxury of a government accountable to the people. The interest of their own oil supply trounces their interest for the people of Saudi Arabia or their political freedoms - whether they get a democratic government or not, other countries don't care. Again, the rulers of pakistan (whoever they may be) don't have that to offer to the rest of the world.

No, democracy is not necessary to have a prosperous nation, but I believe that every people have a right to have a government accountable to and elected by them, and that a government can only govern with the consent of the governed - that comes from my beliefs in the foundations of human rights, that governance is not the priviledge of people who have arms and so can control others.

 

[Cheetah786]

first of my oppologise to forum admins for leading a bit off topic but this guy is attacking the army.

have to respond on the amount he allocated that is spent on the army.well lets not forget all this political types are so noble men pml-ns and ppp's that they rarely say no to the salaries and allownces paid to them by parliament am refering to mna's and mpa's ,salaries and allowences.

here is a picture of our national assemly's salary and allowences expences


16
FEB
Salary of Pakistan’s MNAs (Member Of National Assembly)
Posted by admin



Salary & Govt. Concessions for a Member of NATIONAL ASSEMBLY (MNA)

Monthly Salary : Rs. 120,000 to 200,000

Expense for Constitution per month : Rs.100,000
Office expenditure per month : Rs.140,000
Traveling concession (Rs. 8 per km) : Rs.48,000 (For a visit to ISLAMABAD & return): 6000 km


Daily BETA during Assembly meets : Rs.500
Charge for 1st class (A/C) in train : Free (For any number of times all over PAKISTAN )
Charge for Business Class in flights: Free for 40 trips / year (With wife or P.A.)
Rent for Govt.. hostel any where: Free
Electricity costs at home : Free up to 50,000 units
Local phone call charge : Free up to 1,70,000 calls
TOTAL expense for a MNA per year : Rs. 32,000,000
TOTAL expense for 5 years : Rs. 1,60,000,000
For 534 MNA, the expense for 5 years;
Rs. 85 , 440,000,000 (more than 800 Korores)

And they are elected by THE PEOPLE OF PAKISTAN, through a democratic process of this world, not intruded into the assembly on their own or by any qualification. This is how all our tax money is been swallowed and price hike on our regular commodities… Think of the great democracy we have?

Salary of Pakistan’s MNAs (Member Of National Assembly) | Pakistan News With Pakistan Ideology

and thats only for national assemblly ,let alone provincial and local bodies,and all they do is administrative tasks plus mostly 99 percent of administrative officals and electives are financially well off,but haven't seen or heard giving up their salaries and allowneces for there whole term for people ,NO! sir they love money even if it bleeds our nation dry.so patriots they are

army is much different then these lazy a** politicans they are on the borders defending our nationputing their lives at stake and at the same time the burdening task of keeping an eye on these political traitors who always try to sell out our national security.and how dare u ask or even question abt their salaries ,first look into ur own league and ppp can they sacrifice as much as the army has over the years.

anyways,every one vote for pti,pakistan zindabad,isi forever

wow you proved me wrong just one question just what does posting the salaries Of Pakistani Politicians have to do with what i said second while you at it also post the salaries of generals and perks so people can see where the big chunk of the tax payers money is actually going and tell the jawans we cant buy you the best of the equipment that are serving at the front of the lines cause general sahib deposited the money in Swiss account.

Oh did i forget to mention that when these same generals force them self's into power they draw 2 salaries you guessed it the one politicians get plus there own and not to mention they fill up crown corporations with retired army personals that are already drawing a pension plus they get paid to work in the corporation.

some one on this forum posted General mush having billions in bank accounts mind telling us all how a General in Pakistan army came across that kind of money when we dont have money to buy equipment to protect the jawans who are actually fighting in the front lines and rag tag Talibans feel free to kill them as they please.

Mr Patriotic love of the country is to actually call out the culprits not just salute the generals cause they wearing the uniform oh by the way when India took siachin Genral Zia was in power h

 

[lionheartsalahudin]

wow you proved me wrong just one question just what does posting the salaries Of Pakistani Politicians have to do with what i said second while you at it also post the salaries of generals and perks so people can see where the big chunk of the tax payers money is actually going and tell the jawans we cant buy you the best of the equipment that are serving at the front of the lines cause general sahib deposited the money in Swiss account.

Oh did i forget to mention that when these same generals force them self's into power they draw 2 salaries you guessed it the one politicians get plus there own and not to mention they fill up crown corporations with retired army personals that are already drawing a pension plus they get paid to work in the corporation.

some one on this forum posted General mush having billions in bank accounts mind telling us all how a General in Pakistan army came across that kind of money when we dont have money to buy equipment to protect the jawans who are actually fighting in the front lines and rag tag Talibans feel free to kill them as they please.

Mr Patriotic love of the country is to actually call out the culprits not just salute the generals cause they wearing the uniform oh by the way when India took siachin Genral Zia was in power h

my ans was specifically to counter the question u had raised abt portion of budget allocated for defense forces THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NECESSITY AND LUXURY defense is our necessity and that’s army, politicans salaries to already rich and protocols, motorcades etc etc are luxuries.

buying equipment well I don’t think I have to mention it over here , though augusta subs and mirage’s were not the choice of navy or the airforce ,politicians went for it and every one knows why “mr 10 percent”,if civilian gvt’s would have not lead our country to economic disasters,we would’nt have to get aid and purchase military equipment from the same doner that is mostly the condition,does’nt leave us much room to choose from selected items the doner and the very same seller offer.
these civilian gvt’s try to cut down on military funding to curb and control military power still our military manages through its on organized businesses the fauji foundation and supports its own and provides employment and pension funds to the military and civilians alike ,saying that why don’t u politicians create such a corporate body which will benefit u and give employment to pakistani’s oh sorry most of politicians money will raise questions abt their income.
isi has’nt been given single fund since this forsaken gvt came in power they tried to take over it ,then tried to control it to the biding of their foreign masters of the gvt,but isi is more powerfull then this gvt,it is the root that holds the tree of this nation stead fast against all hurricans and storms.

generals they force them selve’s into power as a last resort ,politicians push them to that edge and then complain abt the military,If only these politicians would have come through fair and true vote they would’nt have to be scared of going back to the public and getting fresh mandate,but infact some look towards Saudi’s and some towards usa rather then their own public which would empower them so much that no military would ever intervene if u have majority public support,our politicians look every where except the public,makes me doubt if we are a democracy or a colony of saudi’s or Americans.

mushi went of becuz army backed off from supporting him and they told him no more,or he would have been mubarik or qadafi,or there would have been a tinamen square and none of the loyar movement guys would have been able to do anything ,musharaf was just one wrotten apple ,but 99percent politicians are rotten as hell infact we need to turn them into fertilizers(if u know wat I mean) for our new Pakistan political field .

general zia was the person who kept ameircans on bay from our nuclear programe and got us f-16s (its like geting f-22s today)he bargained hard with the Americans,not like mushi,or nazo,or zardari or even bibi.
though our only hope is to have IMRAN KHAN now ,so every one vote for imran khan
PAKISTAN ZINDABAD!

 

[VelocuR]

Both Zardari and Chief Kiyani must be removed immediately. People don't like Kiyani more than Zardari because he failed to protect Pakistan and drones attacks on his uniform.

Nargis Sethi is perfect!

Let's take step to control Pakistan Army and its corrupt deal with US. Yesterday drones attack was depressing.

But sir, the farce of Gillani congratulating Americans on eliminating OBL is very much embedded in the public memory.

Well, eliminating OBL is right thing to do under the nose of Pakistan Military, Gilani thrilled to remove obsession of OBL finally.

 

[Thorough Pro]

-- ISPR moments ago, expressed its concern over PM's statement to Chinese media calling COAS and DG ISI's act as illegal and . ISPR said that these allegations are of serious and intense level.


-- PM dismissed Secretary Defence; Lt Gen(r) Naeem Khalid Lodhi

-- Corps Commander meeting called at GHQ, Rawalpindi

Taht A Hole boob pincher called PM needs some body to tell him his place,

 

[Leader]

If there is one phrase that would summarise the events of Wednesday it would be ‘media frenzy’ caused by the new players in Pakistani politics: The ubiquitous news channels, hyper-imaginative TV anchors and the social media. By early evening, rumours of an impending coup had gripped Pakistani imagination; and many people were led to believe that the end of the government was nigh. The source of this storm was an ISPR press release that expressed military’s objection to the contents of Prime Minister Gilani’s interview with a Chinese news agency. The PM had implied that the army and intelligence chiefs had acted unconstitutionally in the memo affair by submitting affidavits directly to the Court. “There can be no allegation more serious than what the honorable prime minister has leveled,” stated the ISPR with reference to Gilani’s remarks. Further, the ISPR announced that this “has very serious ramifications with potentially grievous consequences for the country.”

Shortly thereafter the PM dismissed the Defence Secretary, reportedly close to military leadership, for “gross misconduct and illegal action”. The Secretary apparently had bypassed government channels. Most media discussions based on a wild guessing game suggested that the PM might dismiss the ISI and military chiefs. Concurrently, the posting of a new head for the infamous 111 brigade – the coup instrument – by the military was interpreted as a signal that military establishment would react in case of such an eventuality. Thus the stand off between Islamabad and Rawalpindi was detectable. Sections of local media fuelled the tensions and by the evening most international news sources were ‘breaking’ stories on the heightened civil-military rift in Pakistan. Even the diplomatic missions issued statements making the usual noises about supporting Pakistan’s democracy yet vowing not to interfere in its internal affairs.

The widening rift between Zardari led coalition and the Army is not new. It has intensified with the hearing of a petition filed against the memo (asking for US help to prevent a coup) allegedly authored by Pakistan’s former Ambassador to the US. The recent verdicts of the Supreme Court on forming a judicial commission to probe the memo affair and more importantly the 6-options laid out for the government to implement its 2010 NRO judgment have made the government jittery.

By the late evening, tensions were somewhat defused as PPP’s senior Ministers assured that Gen Kayani would complete his tenure; and the PM talking to media remarked that Kayani had spoken to him before the ISPR press release was issued! Such convenient shifts in positions would seem surreal in any other country but Pakistan’s governance patterns are neither rule based nor predictable.

Observers have noted that President Zardari and the government have been playing a game of chess with the Court. That may now be coming to a closure as the hearing on January 16 will be critical given that one of the options is to initiate judicial proceedingss with implied disqualification of senior officials for not complying with court orders. It seems that the government with regard to the military has adopted a similar strategy.

Also on Wednesday, the Chief Justice reiterated his support for democratic system while talking to a delegation. The Judiciary, media and international opinion are aligned against a coup and the government knows it. After dismissing the Defence Secretary it backtracked from the brink. PM Gilani has done it before as well. After his strong remarks against the military in late December he retreated. Both sides have shown the cards they have: the military has the traditional authority, which it has enjoyed since 1950s; and the civilian government is ready to be ‘martyred’. The judicature has emerged as an arbiter of sorts.

The government would need to make concessions before the Court for its survival. Wednesday’s events suggest that Pakistan has perhaps moved on from 1990s when military takeovers were easier. At the same time, the civil-military faultline has been compounded by the addition of two new power-brokers – the courts and the media. Politicians and the khakis are becoming cognizant of this new reality.

@RazaRumi

Published in The Express Tribune, January 12th, 2012.

 

[Leader]

had it been 90s the Khakis would have never accepted sacking of military cum Secretary defence, but new realities do not favour a coup, and I hope more and more control over army takes place through peaceful surrender by army to the Will of the People and in the interest of the Nation and Country..