Much better Merkava MkIV !!Seriously??How so??Care to explain??
Arjun-II MBT development l Updates & discussion.
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Much better Merkava MkIV !!Seriously??How so??Care to explain??
APS, Battlefield troop carrier + proven combat record.
TeesraIndiotHunter
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Dude, the guy you are replying to is a retard. He thinks india is a stronger military power than China :/
Forget him.
Regarding Arjun II....Pakistan's upgraded Al Khalid-1 tank already matches Arjun II...
When Arjun II came out, indian forums were buzzing and everyone was happy. So one day, I was reading discussions on Arjun II and indians were going "OMG..it has thermal imagers...OMG, it has BMS and it commander can control UAVs from within..it is this and that and blah blah" ...and after reading for a while..I was like "Wait! Al Khalid-I already has all of them..how is Arjun II superior then?" Then I realized that actually, Pakistan might not even need to bring out its Al Khalid II..since Al Khalid-I pretty much matches Arjun II already
So here is a basic comparison between the two tanks...
Note : highlight = Advantage over the other tank
No highlight means can't say if an advantage or not. Since different things have different uses.
Weight
Al Khalid-1 : 48 tons
Merkava IV : 68 tons.
Speed
Al Khalid-1 : 72 km/h
Arjun II : 58 km/h
Main Armament
Al Khalid-1 : 125 mm smooth bore gun
Arjun II : 120 mm rifled gun
Payload Capacity
Al Khalid-1 : 49 rounds
Arjun II : 39 rounds
Engine
Al Khalid-1 : KMDB 6TD-2 6-cylinder diesel 1,200 hp (with upgrade)
Arjun II : 10 cylinder, V-90 turbo charged 1400 hp
Power/Weight ratio (critical for superior accelaration)
Al Khalid-1 : 26 hp/tonne
Arjun II : 20.1 hp/tonne
Armour
Al Khalid-1 : Composite armour, and RHA, with ERA plate coating (right up there. very tough)
Arjun II : Improved kanchan armour, Russian-style ERA (slightly better)
Operational Range
Al Khalid-1 : 500 km
Arjun II : 450 km
Protection
Al Khalid-1 : VARTA active protection system
Arjun II : ???
ATGMs
Al Khalid-1 : Kombat , 9M119 Refleks (AT-11 Sniper) etc (laser beam guidance, unstoppable since can't be detected due to laser beam guidance method..some claim it also has top attack mode. Unsure about it though)
Arjun II : LAHAT (Top attack mode..very effective!)
Types of rounds carried
Al Khalid-I: APFSDS, HEAT-FS , HE-FS, Depleted Uranium rounds
Arjun II: FSAPDS, HESH, PCB, TB etc.
Other than this, both Al Khalid-I and Arjun II have thermal imagers, panoramic sites for commanders, and Battlefield management systems...
Al Khalid-1's muzzle velocity is very damn good too...superior to that of even Merkava IV...but I didn't get stats for Arjun II muzzle velocity or rate of fire..so can't say anything...
Conclusion: Al Khalid-1 is right up there, if not superior, to Arjun II. Arjun sure has its advantages in heavier armour..but then Al Khalid-1 is superior to Arjun in mobility, speed, and firepower...
Pakistan's Al Khalid project is by all measures superior to indian arjun..
Remember, Al Khalid-II is coming out in December at IDEAS 2014 and it will have better armour than current Al Khalid-1 tank.
APS is just an add on feature,it's not like something that can not be integrated at a later stage.
Battlefield troop carrier!!Please,give it a rest.You call that a troop carrier!!You wanna shove your troops in that cramped ammo chamber and then what??How many troops you can carry in that box??Heck,they will soon pass out in the summer heat.Even worse,your mighty tank will have no ammo left to fight!!This troop carrier thingy is just a marketing gimmick,don't take that too seriously.Israelis themselves do not do that for obvious reasons,the first of them being it's pretty much impossible and totally impractical.
Proven combat record - seriously!!Against whom??The Hezbollah??Did this Merkava IV ever go head to head against another 3rd generation MBT??
And as for cost,it's because the small order and the exorbitant cost of the imported engines and thermals.These two subsystems alone cost more than 60% of total cost of Arjun tank.
Dude, the guy you are replying to is a retard. He thinks india is a stronger military power than China :/
Forget him.
Regarding Arjun II....Pakistan's upgraded Al Khalid-1 tank already matches Arjun II...
When Arjun II came out, indian forums were buzzing and everyone was happy. So one day, I was reading discussions on Arjun II and indians were going "OMG..it has thermal imagers...OMG, it has BMS and it commander can control UAVs from within..it is this and that and blah blah" ...and after reading for a while..I was like "Wait! Al Khalid-I already has all of them..how is Arjun II superior then?" Then I realized that actually, Pakistan might not even need to bring out its Al Khalid II..since Al Khalid-I pretty much matches Arjun II already
So here is a basic comparison between the two tanks...
Note : highlight = Advantage over the other tank
No highlight means can't say if an advantage or not. Since different things have different uses.
Weight
Al Khalid-1 : 48 tons
Merkava IV : 68 tons.
Speed
Al Khalid-1 : 72 km/h
Arjun II : 58 km/h
Main Armament
Al Khalid-1 : 125 mm smooth bore gun
Arjun II : 120 mm rifled gun
Payload Capacity
Al Khalid-1 : 49 rounds
Arjun II : 39 rounds
Engine
Al Khalid-1 : KMDB 6TD-2 6-cylinder diesel 1,200 hp (with upgrade)
Arjun II : 10 cylinder, V-90 turbo charged 1400 hp
Power/Weight ratio (critical for superior accelaration)
Al Khalid-1 : 26 hp/tonne
Arjun II : 20.1 hp/tonne
Armour
Al Khalid-1 : Composite armour, and RHA, with ERA plate coating (right up there. very tough)
Arjun II : Improved kanchan armour, Russian-style ERA (slightly better)
Operational Range
Al Khalid-1 : 500 km
Arjun II : 450 km
Protection
Al Khalid-1 : VARTA active protection system
Arjun II : ???
ATGMs
Al Khalid-1 : Kombat , 9M119 Refleks (AT-11 Sniper) etc (laser beam guidance, unstoppable since can't be detected due to laser beam guidance method..some claim it also has top attack mode. Unsure about it though)
Arjun II : LAHAT (Top attack mode..very effective!)
Types of rounds carried
Al Khalid-I: APFSDS, HEAT-FS , HE-FS, Depleted Uranium rounds and KOMBAT ATGM
Arjun II: FSAPDS, HESH, PCB, TB, and Lahat ATGM
Other than this, both Al Khalid-I and Arjun II have thermal imagers, panoramic sites for commanders, and Battlefield management systems...
Al Khalid-1's muzzle velocity is very damn good too...superior to that of even Merkava IV...but I didn't get stats for Arjun II muzzle velocity or rate of fire..so can't say anything...
Conclusion: Al Khalid-1 is right up there, if not superior, to Arjun II. Arjun sure has its advantages in heavier armour..but then Al Khalid-1 is superior to Arjun in mobility, speed, and firepower...
Pakistan's Al Khalid project is by all measures superior to indian arjun..
Remember, Al Khalid-II is coming out in December at IDEAS 2014 and it will have better armour than current Al Khalid-1 tank.
Huh,a chimp calling me retard.Clearly you have no fucking idea about the subject at hand,go read up,educate yourself first then talk.As for AK Is matching Arjun MkII,sorry to burst your bubble.But that AK as it presently stands out is nothing more than a joke,really.Too many weak areas all over that thingy.
Dude, the guy you are replying to is a retard. He thinks india is a stronger military power than China :/
Forget him.
Regarding Arjun II....Pakistan's upgraded Al Khalid-1 tank already matches Arjun II...
When Arjun II came out, indian forums were buzzing and everyone was happy. So one day, I was reading discussions on Arjun II and indians were going "OMG..it has thermal imagers...OMG, it has BMS and it commander can control UAVs from within..it is this and that and blah blah" ...and after reading for a while..I was like "Wait! Al Khalid-I already has all of them..how is Arjun II superior then?" Then I realized that actually, Pakistan might not even need to bring out its Al Khalid II..since Al Khalid-I pretty much matches Arjun II already
So here is a basic comparison between the two tanks...
Note : highlight = Advantage over the other tank
No highlight means can't say if an advantage or not. Since different things have different uses.
Weight
Al Khalid-1 : 48 tons
Merkava IV : 68 tons.
Speed
Al Khalid-1 : 72 km/h
Arjun II : 58 km/h
Main Armament
Al Khalid-1 : 125 mm smooth bore gun
Arjun II : 120 mm rifled gun
Payload Capacity
Al Khalid-1 : 49 rounds
Arjun II : 39 rounds
Engine
Al Khalid-1 : KMDB 6TD-2 6-cylinder diesel 1,200 hp (with upgrade)
Arjun II : 10 cylinder, V-90 turbo charged 1400 hp
Power/Weight ratio (critical for superior accelaration)
Al Khalid-1 : 26 hp/tonne
Arjun II : 20.1 hp/tonne
Armour
Al Khalid-1 : Composite armour, and RHA, with ERA plate coating (right up there. very tough)
Arjun II : Improved kanchan armour, Russian-style ERA (slightly better)
Operational Range
Al Khalid-1 : 500 km
Arjun II : 450 km
Protection
Al Khalid-1 : VARTA active protection system
Arjun II : ???
ATGMs
Al Khalid-1 : Kombat , 9M119 Refleks (AT-11 Sniper) etc (laser beam guidance, unstoppable since can't be detected due to laser beam guidance method..some claim it also has top attack mode. Unsure about it though)
Arjun II : LAHAT (Top attack mode..very effective!)
Types of rounds carried
Al Khalid-I: APFSDS, HEAT-FS , HE-FS, Depleted Uranium rounds
Arjun II: FSAPDS, HESH, PCB, TB etc.
Other than this, both Al Khalid-I and Arjun II have thermal imagers, panoramic sites for commanders, and Battlefield management systems...
Al Khalid-1's muzzle velocity is very damn good too...superior to that of even Merkava IV...but I didn't get stats for Arjun II muzzle velocity or rate of fire..so can't say anything...
Conclusion: Al Khalid-1 is right up there, if not superior, to Arjun II. Arjun sure has its advantages in heavier armour..but then Al Khalid-1 is superior to Arjun in mobility, speed, and firepower...
Pakistan's Al Khalid project is by all measures superior to indian arjun..
Remember, Al Khalid-II is coming out in December at IDEAS 2014 and it will have better armour than current Al Khalid-1 tank.
Anybody not using abusive language on this forum is not a retard.
Seeing your username well...
Arjun MBT is based on western tank model and Al-Khalid is based on lighter Chinese and Russian models.
Please don't compare Al-khalid with Merkava. Although on this forum Al-Khalid is the world's best MBT. I however do not want to get into a debate where nationalism is the theme and i get banned when i post facts.
Regarding your comparison above where you are highlighting advantages i strongly recommend you look at the engine comparison again.
Also Arjun max speed is 72 Km/h not 58km/h.
You seem to have posted Arjun mk1 specs under Arjun mk2 specs.
Also Arjun carries more varieties of ammunition than you have listed. HEAT, APFSDS.
You are either misinformed or lying.
Both Al-khalid and Arjun have advantages over each other. Nobody is a clear winner.
APS is a very important feature which Arjun lacks.
It has provision for carrying troops in battle.
Proven in many wars. (Earlier versions)
Buying a $10million tank in large numbers in not financially viable.
Ooph,you are not listening.Markava MkIV doesn't have provision for troop carriage,as simple as that.It can theoretically caary some troops into its ammunition compartment but there is a difference between 'can' and 'is'.Don't believe all those bs shown in Discovery programmings like Future Weapons and as such.And lastly,could please name a few books you have read on tanks,even one will do.
APS can be installed any time,not a big problem.
Clearly you lack understandings in this matter.If you do not order it in large numbers,there will be no point in investing money in R&D for a domestic power pack and thermals which are now being bought COTS at exorbitant price,and the price will never go down.It's called Economy of scales.Read up first on these matters since this are extremely crucial.Try to make a better understanding of things before you make your judgement
Oh and one more thing,there is no need to spar with such fools like @TeesraIndiotHunter chimp.
It has provision. Proper seats with AC.
Why not install APS?
Do i have to pass a written exam to post on the forum?
Economy of scales?
366 Arjun are in service/on order. How many should be ordered to lower the price from $10 million to $4 million?
Nothing we do will reduce price. Not economical to operate this tank no matter how protected, lethal and agile it may be.
Man give it a rest,you win. I've a rather limited capacity to take such bs,even it is from a fellow Indian.Clearly you have no idea about tanks,all your 'knowledge' is based on nothing more than some propaganda 'documentaries' and youtube videos.try to read a few proper books on this subject,not what some random internet article (unless of course some research papers).
And no,you do not need to pass written exam to spread such bs as you are doing now.But a few good books could certainly help you to realize how much of a fool you are making out of yourself as of now.
gslv mk3
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Thank you bro..
You are welcome bro,could you give your fb id??
gslv mk3
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Will do it in the members section...let me try in the Kerala corner.
Don't answer to that fucking chimp,he doesn't know jack about tanks.So just ignore him,let him blabber as much he wants to.
TeesraIndiotHunter
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No that I have shown your ugly face the reality..and all the stats are given..you have no reply. lol..
