Are Muslims Better Off in Quaid-e-Azam M.A. Jinnah's Pakistan Today?

[KRAIT]

You guys are again baiting the trolls. The thread was
Are Muslims Better Off in Quaid-e-Azam M.A. Jinnah's Pakistan Today?
Please reflect on the article.

Do you really think they want to discuss this. All such threads are often turned into comparative analysis of Indian and Pakistani Muslims.

Suddenly, all the ills in their society means nothing as they just want to prove that they have done better than Indian Muslims.

They sideline the parameters to judge growth and progress. They ignore population size, political system, social stability, demographics, economic growth, resources available etc.

This thread has been derailed to same old competition. Soon, Mods will come, there will be deletion of posts, infractions, bans and closure of thread with no conclusion.

 

[Skies]

The partition brought the competition between India and Pakistan which is good for progress/

 

[Azazel]

Dumb-***, you gave me one picture. I said that atleast give me the whole report..you don't even have whole report? Are you just using a picture in every thread?


It goes either way.

Muslims vs Indians (Indian Muslims included)--Muslims VASTLY outperforms indians..

Muslims(Indian Muslims included) vs Indians---Muslims VASTLY outperforms indians.





Oh so that line is bothering you guys. lol..skip it. It was for that racist guy who was claiming "Muslims are inherently inferior"....The main point of my post remains true though..

Its all a matter of perspective.Muslims in Middle East just happened to sit on top of largest oil reserve in the world.So they have plenty of money.Their is no outperformance there.

 

[KS]

Dumb-***, you gave me one picture. I said that atleast give me the whole report..you don't even have whole report? Are you just using a picture in every thread?

And how many pics, studies have you referenced except the studies done by Dr.Auz ?

And I have clearly said that it is done by PEW..go to PEW website and read your heart out..lol

and this for you one more - this is the study of economic inequality on basis of ethnicity/religion in UK..pakistanis lag behind Indians in EACH AND EVERY conceivable field...inherently superior yessirrrr

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/bsp/hi/pdfs/27_01_10_inequalityfull..pdf

The story is the same all over Europe. The only areas where the muslims are wealthy are the gulf region and turkey where every other minority has been stamped out. In areas where they are going to compete with other population on an equal basis they come out at the bottom of the pile.

It goes either way.

Muslims vs Indians (Indian Muslims included)--Muslims VASTLY outperforms indians..

Muslims(Indian Muslims included) vs Indians---Muslims VASTLY outperforms indians.

Did you even read what you wrote...:facepalm:..so Indian muslims now are not muslims ? ok lets take percapita income of pakistani muslims and indians - who is better ? lets take the literacy rate of pakistani muslims and indians..who is better ? lets take the HDI of a pakistani muslim and Indians..who is better ?..like I said..you are drunk. Go home dude.

 

[bronxbull]

Auz,

u r living in a fairytale land bro,without Oil,your theory is nothing.

 

[Contrarian]

I would like to share this one crucial fact with both Indian members and Pakistani members.
Specifically @FaujHistorian

During partition, from India most of the educated and middle class Muslims shifted to Pakistan. Those who stayed behind in India were mostly either the Muslim elites or the Muslim lower/peasant class.

This lower/peasant Muslim class did not believe in education, for the longest time in India, they contented themselves with madrassa education. They did not move with the times. The elite Muslims in India, became their leaders. And the elite Muslims have ruthlessly exploited the majority poor Muslims in India.

They deliberately never tried to give or setup education, encourage education amongst the Muslims in India. This was simply because once Muslims became educated, they would stop becoming cannon fodder for these leaders. They would not turn up a dime a dozen on their numerous 'Islam khatray main hai' related speeches, or vote for them on non issues.

They have been the biggest curse on the Indian Muslims.

It has taken over 60 years for a new Muslim middle class to emerge. Only today, since 2005, has a credible Muslim middle class with sufficient mass started emerging. These people are not as gullible as the poor muslims. They seek education to be able to compete in India, and competition in India for even the smallest job is absolutely ruthless.

And this middle class now will act as a catalyst for the lower class, like it did for Hindus. Today even the poorest Hindu family spends on their children's education - it is a matter or prestige for them.

It is completely true that Indian muslims are poorer than the Pakistani's in general. There are two factors responsible, and both are equally so - the govt has not been active in putting educational institutions in muslim majority areas or encouraged them to seek the education that the rest of India is doing - because the leaders of Muslim community never wanted it - they discouraged this. The successive govts have known that this was wrong - yet they never bothered. The biggest culprit here are the respective govt's of India since independence.

The second reason is that the majority of Muslim poor in India have never bothered to seek it like the Hindus/Sikhs/Christians/Jains/Budhists do. They have been stuck in the past - happy with religious education alone. So this part of blame lies with the Muslim community itself.

However that is set to change NOW with an emerging educated Muslim middle class along with rapidly expanding education facilities in India and after 10 years - you will see a very very noticeable change in stats for all Indians and noticeably the Indian Muslims.

 

[kam83]

Dummy, first thing, I brought such comparison because an Indian brought it FIRST (See his links...Islam's global economic failure whatever).

Secondly, dumb-***, there is NO "list" of failed states. That is an INDEX of "likely to become a failed state"...and it doesn't hold any water because one random THINK TANK of US puts this list up..on their own calculations. Same think tank , in 2009 , said that Pakistan will in next 6 months...lmao! so no one cares about that 'list' ..lol...

And Pakistan atleast has less povery than than india....lol

Indian poverty levels higher than Pakistan's, says UN report - Telegraph

Swearing & mouthing off doesn't make you right......

Pakistan has less poverty then India............. really........Could you tell me what is the difference between governing a nation of few million yet making to list of likely too be a failed state And A nation of billion population yet growing economically...



The Human Development Index (HDI) is a comparative measure of life expectancy, literacy, education, standards of living, and quality of life for countries worldwide. It is a standard means of measuring well-being, especially child welfare. It is used to distinguish whether the country is a developed, a developing or an underdeveloped country, and also to measure the impact of economic policies on quality of life. The index was developed in 1990 by Pakistani economist Mahbub ul Haq[2] and Indian economist Amartya Sen.[3]

List of countries by Human Development Index - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Medium human development index

134 Steady India 0.547 Increase 0.005

Rank

LOw Human development index

145 Steady Pakistan 0.504 Increase 0.001


List of countries by GNI (PPP) per capita - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

128............ India................ 3,640......................... 2011

135............. Pakistan ............ 2,880......................... 2011

to get clear prespective

compare population of pakistan with India......what a shame

 

[Sedqal]

I would like to share this one crucial fact with both Indian members and Pakistani members.
Specifically @FaujHistorian

During partition, from India most of the educated and middle class Muslims shifted to Pakistan. Those who stayed behind in India were mostly either the Muslim elites or the Muslim lower/peasant class.

This lower/peasant Muslim class did not believe in education, for the longest time in India, they contented themselves with madrassa education. They did not move with the times. The elite Muslims in India, became their leaders. And the elite Muslims have ruthlessly exploited the majority poor Muslims in India.

They deliberately never tried to give or setup education, encourage education amongst the Muslims in India. This was simply because once Muslims became educated, they would stop becoming cannon fodder for these leaders. They would not turn up a dime a dozen on their numerous 'Islam khatray main hai' related speeches, or vote for them on non issues.

They have been the biggest curse on the Indian Muslims.

It has taken over 60 years for a new Muslim middle class to emerge. Only today, since 2005, has a credible Muslim middle class with sufficient mass started emerging. These people are not as gullible as the poor muslims. They seek education to be able to compete in India, and competition in India for even the smallest job is absolutely ruthless.

And this middle class now will act as a catalyst for the lower class, like it did for Hindus. Today even the poorest Hindu family spends on their children's education - it is a matter or prestige for them.

It is completely true that Indian muslims are poorer than the Pakistani's in general. However that is set to change NOW with an emerging educated Muslim middle class along with rapidly expanding education facilities in India.

Far too self serving an argument but India's Muslims are India's problem now, a huge minority without education (thus being non productive) is going to drag India not Pakistan.

We wish Indian Muslims all the best but the raison d'etre for Pakistan was not limited to economic prosperity it was (and is) about Muslims being a separate nation thus their right and freedom to form their own constitution and leading their country as they deem fit. The Idea was not Anti-India as many Indians seem to think, unless you believe in Akhand Bharat or some divine Hindu destiny.

 

[Contrarian]

Far too self serving an argument but India's Muslims are India's problem now, a huge minority without education (thus being non productive) is going to drag India not Pakistan.

We wish Indian Muslims all the best but the raison d'etre for Pakistan was not limited to economic prosperity it was (and is) about Muslims being a separate nation thus their right and freedom to form their own constitution and leading their country as they deem fit. The Idea was not Anti-India as many Indians seem to think, unless you believe in Akhand Bharat or some divine Hindu destiny.

When did i argue otherwise. I said Indian Muslims are India's responsibility. You saw something in my post that i have not mentioned, nor implied, nor even thought of as a matter of fact.

I donot care for the reasons of Partition. Infact i believe that Partition has been very good for India - for reasons you may or may not not like.

However It hardly makes a difference today. However, what does and has affected India is the effects of Partition, how the most educated Muslims of India, the biggest middle class simply packed up and left, leaving mostly feudal elites and peasants. How we manage from there on is our concern. And i see we have reached a critical/tipping mass in development in India, and therefore my statement - After 10 years, the difference in statistics between India and all neigbouring countries will see a marked shift - and that is particularly so for Indian Muslims - for reasons i outlined in my previous post.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

Good for you,We are also happy that we got rid of you otherwise we would've had the trouble to execute you,like that Kasab guy from Faridkot.Now chill up

u didnt 'got rid of us' but actually we got rid of u by liberating Pakistan.

 

[kam83]

what burden?
So any sovereign country is now reduced burden on India?
How much reduction in burden did you get when USA became a country?
How about South Africa?
How much of a megalomaniac is India to think that sovereign country are reduced burden on her?
And despite all those countries, she still has the world's largest starving population.


Looks like she need more reduction in her burden

i hope this answer your question what he meant by reduction in burden

India's visionary knew this ppl knows nothing accept there religion and to kill each other in name of religion ...thats why India accepted the partition..Look around what happenning in your nation know.

As far as ppl fear India want to capture pakistan and unite it with its mainland....firstly Indians won't allow it....

 

[Azazel]

u didnt 'got rid of us' but actually we got rid of u by liberating Pakistan.

And Bangladeshis got rid of you by liberating East Pakistan.Its a matter of perspective.You can interpret it anyway you want.

 

[Sedqal]

u didnt 'got rid of us' but actually we got rid of u by liberating Pakistan.

Why bother to reply? The got rid of us good enough, we are happy gotten rid off.

And Bangladeshis got rid of you by liberating East Pakistan.Its a matter of perspective.You can interpret it anyway you want.

Of course, BD is a Muslim country we wish BD the best.

 

[Paan Singh]

u didnt 'got rid of us' but actually we got rid of u by liberating Pakistan.

Your failure as state was already predicted that why nehru etc were in favor of partition as they knew that British are here and its good chance otherwise we will have country dominated by islamist and history of sub continent shows that islamic rulers have always been brutal and spread violence here.

 

[Sedqal]

Your failure as state was already predicted that why nehru etc were in favor of partition as they knew that British are here and its good chance otherwise we will have country dominated by islamist and history of sub continent shows that islamic rulers have always been brutal and spread violence here.

You are so right, I also say that we should celebrate Nehru day .

When did i argue otherwise. I said Indian Muslims are India's responsibility. You saw something in my post that i have not mentioned, nor implied, nor even thought of as a matter of fact.

I donot care for the reasons of Partition. Infact i believe that Partition has been very good for India - for reasons you may or may not not like.

However It hardly makes a difference today. However, what does and has affected India is the effects of Partition, how the most educated Muslims of India, the biggest middle class simply packed up and left, leaving mostly feudal elites and peasants. How we manage from there on is our concern. And i see we have reached a critical/tipping mass in development in India, and therefore my statement - After 10 years, the difference in statistics between India and all neigbouring countries will see a marked shift - and that is particularly so for Indian Muslims - for reasons i outlined in my previous post.

Self serving because you put the blame squarely on Muslims. But then like I said your problem not ours.