Analysis: Did Hillary Clinton's feel-good visit leave India feeling bad?

[Fasih Khan]

Confused Answer

The Real Thread

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/179501-hillary-s-bad-trip-india.html

 

[vsdoc]

Confused Answer

That's because I'm talking the US, Iran, and Israel - all parties we deal with and have to balance per our own interests.

We don't have that baggage with Pakistan. We are very clear with respect to Pakistan.

We do not see that clarity forthcoming from the Americans officially and openly.

Hence we have no obligations to take their sentiments under consideration when it comes to Iran.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

@the title of this thread. Here is my post to you guys:

Now don't you need that advice more than us? Right now the state you're in is "no girl friend, no petrol".
Just some gas!

It is in our longterm strategic interest not to let the US get a foothold in the region.

What we need, we should make or buy.

And if the US is not willing to sell, there are others who are.

It is extremely myopic strategy to reduce oil imports from Iran and increase our dependenc on the Gulf countries - the oil spigot that the US controls.

If anything, it makes sound business sense to always have multiple suppliers - especially when Iran needs at least another 10 years to become refinery self-sufficient. A further business interest that cannot be ignored.

A nuclear Iran is going to happen. India is neither in a position to prevent it or stand in the way of the West were they to try preempting it. We should simply continue standing to the side. Continue to make the right noises. But not lose our longterm strategic regional focus.

I agree with that.

If Iran goes nuclear, its no skin off my back. Actually if that happens, Iran still is less likely to be a migraine to USA than some countries with nukes already are.
And are the Ayatollahs gonna rule the roost for ever in Iran? Also will there be eternal enmity between Iran and USA?

If we could live with all the pitfalls and side-effects of NAM before, we're better placed to do so now.

 

[vsdoc]

I agree with that.

If Iran goes nuclear, its no skin off my back. Actually if that happens, Iran still is less likely to be a migraine to USA than some countries with nukes already are.
And are the Ayatollahs gonna rule the roost for ever in Iran? Also will there be eternal enmity between Iran and USA?

If we could live with all the pitfalls and side-effects of NAM before, we're better placed to do so now.

More than anything its my sense of fairplay that's seriously offended by the US talking nuclear non-proliferation in any form.

Secondly, they are too transparent as to why they do not want Iran to go nuclear.

I am paying through my arse to keep my cars and bikes running. I don't want a third party to control which way my arse should point while I do that.

Or who I should lend my arse to while I'm at it.

 

[Awesome]

Ultimately I think India will ditch the Iranians.

 

[Indian009]

Ultimately I think India will ditch the Iranians.

No India won't ditch Iran but oil imports will definately come down to certain level. After all India won't face sanctions for Iran.
India was buying 12/13 % crude from Iran so when new sanction levels will be implemented on Iran India will cut it to 7/8% to avoid penalties on Indian firms dealing with Iran.
But there are other trade options other than oil that are being checked by Iran and India.

Self -Delete

What ??? Ashamed of having gas ???
Dude you will never understand the 1200 CC motorbike ride with petrol cuz you have gas too bad.

 

[Edevelop]

Ultimately I think India will ditch the Iranians.

Once Iran gets itself aligned with Pakistan, Indians will suffer. It has happened on many occasions. General Ayub Khan took office in 58 and left in 69. We had great economic ties and came 65 war came in which Iran had supported. Then came Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto in the 70s who had an Iranian wife. and then in Benazir Bhutto in late 80s and early 90s... Right now Asif Zardari is a shi'a President and Iranians are starting to come back again....

No India won't ditch Iran but oil imports will definately come down to certain level. After all India won't face sanctions for Iran.
India was buying 12/13 % crude from Iran so when new sanction levels will be implemented on Iran India will cut it to 7/8% to avoid penalties on Indian firms dealing with Iran.
But there are other trade options other than oil that are being checked by Iran and India.


What ??? Ashamed of having gas ???
Dude you will never understand the 1200 CC motorbike ride with petrol cuz you have gas too bad.

We have both gas and petrol....
I deleted because i think i was taking the trolling too far...

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Ultimately I think India will ditch the Iranians.

HeHeHe, India will just do what it needs to serve ITS OWN INTERESTS.

Just happens that India does not have to carry any burden of either "hi-fi non-NATO alliances" or " ummah (non) allegiances".
Gets simpler to focus on one's own interests then without any 'baggage'!

 

[Indian009]

Once Iran gets itself aligned with Pakistan, Indians will suffer. It has happened on many occasions. General Ayub Khan took office in 58 and left in 69. We had great economic ties and came 65 war came in which Iran had supported. Then came Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto in the 70s who had an Iranian wife. and then in Benazir Bhutto in late 80s and early 90s... Right now Asif Zardari is a shi'a President and Iranians are starting to come back again....



We have both gas and petrol....
I deleted because i think i was taking the trolling too far...

Iran can't get itself aligned to Pakistan till Pak broke up with USA. Simple is it but it's hard for Pak to do that.
Second only Russia is standing with Iran today. So Iran is unlikely to go against Russian friendship with Indians.
In politics it doesnt matter who marry who and what's personal relation with others. Those are policy decisions.
And at current state it's India helping Iran than Pak so it's difficult to happen what you say.

Oh you have petrol too good. Hope it's affordable to bikers there

 

[Edevelop]

Iran can't get itself aligned to Pakistan till Pak broke up with USA. Simple is it but it's hard for Pak to do that.
Second only Russia is standing with Iran today. So Iran is unlikely to go against Russian friendship with Indians.
In politics it doesnt matter who marry who and what's personal relation with others. Those are policy decisions.
And at current state it's India helping Iran than Pak so it's difficult to happen what you say.

Oh you have petrol too good. Hope it's affordable to bikers there

The one thing that bothers India right now is NO BORDER WITH IRAN. It would have been a total story if Pakistan wasn't in between.

Iran won't forget us easily with the Nuclear technology help, trades in the 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s. In today's conditions, Iran needs Pakistan for food and Pakistan needs Iran for gas/oil.

Pakistan is slowly ditching the U.S and will end the relationship when the next government with Imran Khan totally an anti-American guy comes in. There is a reason why Russia has been at our door step almost everyday and China as you already know is our strongest ally. Both of these powers want Pakistan to be partners because of our strategic location, that enables to view Afghanistan and Middile Eastern countries holding NATO presence and for our natural resources and for our ports that are potential trading routes to the world....

The U.S is also ditching Pakistan--- for India... that we are seeing clearly. I think Hilary Clinton has made a lot of trips over the last 6 months... .

Believe it or not, but there is a shift here.

 

[Indian009]

The one thing that bothers India right now is NO BORDER WITH IRAN. It would have been a total story if Pakistan wasn't in between.

Iran won't forget us easily with the Nuclear technology help, trades in the 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s. In today's conditions, Iran needs Pakistan for food and Pakistan needs Iran for gas/oil.

Pakistan is slowly ditching the U.S and will end the relationship when the next government with Imran Khan totally an anti-American view guy comes in. There is a reason why Russia has been at our door step almost everyday and China as you already know is our strongest ally. Both of these powers want Pakistan to be partners because of our strategic location, that enables to view Afghanistan and Middile Eastern countries holding NATO presence and as a potential trading route to the world....

The U.S is also ditching Pakistan--- for India... that we are seeing clearly. I think Hilary Clinton has made a lot of trips over the last 6 months... . Believe it or not, but i defiantly see a paradigm shift.

Iran already have Nuclear tech plus you can't help Iran openly in nuclear field. Russia will be better choice if more help needed for this than Pakistan. You will agree that too.
Your food supply -Pakistan isn't the only option. There are better option for food supply including India which has a variety of agriculture produce and in larger quantity.
Russia isn't in your door step. Russian interest is different. It will be cleared in a year or most 2 yrs. wait.
China is your strongest ally. Yes but only against India and not open help. China needs Iran too. But this still doesn't go against India as India is bigger market for Russia and china both. So not likely.
Iran is making sale of its oil and India is buying like crazy so Iran unlikely give up that much sell for Pak
Afganistan is crucial point but atleast today its lost game for Pakistan.
USA is ditching Pakistan no doubt. But not for India. They want India to their ally like Pak in past but India never go beyond its own interest so they too not going to expect more from India. Still they will help India to counter China.

Pakistan only has important location. Nothing else atleast yet.

 

[illusion8]

Once Iran gets itself aligned with Pakistan, Indians will suffer.

This is where you are wrong, Diplomacy and foreign relations is never a zero sum game. You do not have enough influence to alienate a country against another. No country operates like that, U cannot dictate - If you are with us you have to be enemies of India. No country likes dictating to unless you are powerful enough.

 

[Abingdonboy]

“From our point of view, Pakistan has been involved in terrorism for years and years and years, and there's this terrible thing that happened in Mumbai. But Pakistan is not declared a terrorist state ... The United States doesn't even talk politically of Pakistan as a terrorist state,” Sibal said.

Frustated Indians

Of course Indians are going to be frustrated! Pakistan- a country the US has significant leverage with and is called a "friend" by US is allowed to continue to not only harbor masterminds of past attacks but others planning at present to carry out attacks on India. The clear hypocrisy by the US who is trying to play up one incident that killed 0 people and down play an incident that killed 166 IS FRUSTRATING. Why should India take punitive action on Iran when the US takes none on Pakistan?



It is more than frustrating, it is BLOOD BOILING!!