An Indo-Arab blunder?

[ranjeet]

Yes, despite you guys writing English and sometimes a language I do not recognize (Hindi/Urdu?) the content of the discussion for me is like attempting to communicate in Papuan.

Pretty much off-topic as well. Thanks for that mate. That was an excellent meal!

Anyway to the other Indian users then I suggest you really watch that video. A lot of nice Arabian chicks are included

Barring few most of Indians and Pakistanis rarely discuss things on topic. We love to drone about trivial and non nonsensical things over and over again. Our dismal economies reflect it beautifully. Apologies for derailing the thread tho.

It was the chicks which made go through the vid in the first place.

 

[al-Hasani]

Barring few most of Indians and Pakistanis rarely discuss things on topic. We love to drone about trivial and non nonsensical things over and over again. Our dismal economies reflect it beautifully. Apologies for derailing the thread tho.

It was the chicks which made go through the vid in the first place.

Not much difference compared to us Middle Eastern people then or this section for that matter.

No, need to apologize. The discussion was on topic for almost the entire initial 10 pages of this thread which might be a record on this section and the discussion was interesting overall.

Indeed.

 

[KingMamba]

Or probably because the palestenians as too weak to support pakistan against India. But when time comes, they are sure to support pakistan against us which is evident by the fact that they have called upon pak army to fight against the Israelis. But I believe, even today, if Israel needs any help, India would extend fll support though it would be under the carpets.

Palestinians have supported India over Pakistan. Arafat was best buds with Indira and used to spurn Pakistan left and right.

Well said!
I dont know why some (only some) Pakistanis are still in denial that they were "Indians" not so long back.I mean Pakistan didnt even exist before '47.

Neither did India.

Not really, they are either called urdu speakers or Haryanvies. Punjabis are only those who speak punjabi. These haryanives never needed to learn punjabi, since urdu was official language. In multan lots of haryanvis migrated who still speak their original language at homes plus urdu.

Haryanvis are race of bhaiyas who look like biharis, bengalis. They can pass as chuhras/gutter cleaner. So instead they like to call themselves urdu speakers.

I disagree that they are not Punjabi, they are probably just choore.

 

[SouthDesi]

How long they will fight and kill like this? Is there any solution for Israel - Palestine conflict at all?

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

Sorry for derailng thread, but i just corrected and said Indian word is very insulting. Biggest insult ever for a Pakistani.

Palestinians have supported India over Pakistan. Arafat was best buds with Indira and used to spurn Pakistan left and right.



Neither did India.

Why these Indians ignore British word, ''British Indians'' and that to for period of just 99 years in whole history. I will never undertsand ignoring ''British'' and how forcefully they made us part of ''British India''.

 

[KingMamba]

Sorry for derailng thread, but i just corrected and said Indian word is very insulting. Biggest insult ever for a Pakistani.


Why these Indians ignore British word, ''British Indians'' and that to for period of just 99 years in whole history. I will never undertsand ignoring ''British'' and how forcefully they made us part of ''British India''.

Sirjee before they started calling the jangli ancestors of the modern day India as Indians they used to refer to the Indus valley and its people as Indians. The locals called it Sind the Persians translated it to Hind and Hindu and the Greeks translated that to Ind and Indoi after coming into contact with the Persians. When Alexander invaded India he was only invading the province that was once held by Darius and listed in his Persepolis terrace inscription, the Greeks had no idea there was anything further east. It was only during the Diadochi period specifically under the Seleucus' that further exploration was done into the Gangetic plains, and from then on anything further east was referred to as the Indies in general. So therefore there is nothing wrong with saying the ancestors of modern Pakistanis were Indians as the very name India started in the Indus.

 

[Armstrong]

@Armstrong, sir when you talk to @Sidak in punjabi, you sound soooo Indian.

I ain't an Indian !

@Sidak is my Baby Sister hence why she talks Punjabi the same way I do !

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

Sirjee before they started calling the jangli ancestors of the modern day India as Indians they used to refer to the Indus valley and its people as Indians. The locals called it Sind the Persians translated it to Hind and Hindu and the Greeks translated that to Ind and Indoi after coming into contact with the Persians. When Alexander invaded India he was only invading the province that was once held by Darius and listed in his Persepolis terrace inscription, the Greeks had no idea there was anything further east. It was only during the Diadochi period specifically under the Seleucus' that further exploration was done into the Gangetic plains, and from then on anything further east was referred to as the Indies in general. So therefore there is nothing wrong with saying the ancestors of modern Pakistanis were Indians as the very name India started in the Indus.

Well as long as Indians instead start calling them gangias and Ganga land then its ok. After all we are original Hindus, but now these jungli babuas try to spin it and associate themselves with us because of name. Thats why Jinnah was furios when he learned that Gangias will keep ''India'' as name after British left.

But todays we don't want anything to do with word India because its been hijacked by jangli babuas, our ancestors can be simply called ancient Pakistanis.

 

[KingMamba]

Well as long as Indians instead start calling them gangias and Ganga land then its ok. After all we are original Hindus, but now these jungli babuas try to spin it and associate themselves with us because of name. Thats why Jinnah was furios when he learned that Gangias will keep ''India'' as name after British left.

But todays we don't want anything to do with word India because its been hijacked by jangli babuas, our ancestors can be simply called ancient Pakistanis.

Jinnah was furious because Nehru was trying to say Pakistan would collapse indirectly, before that everyone thought they would use the name Hindustan officially but Nehru backed out last second and chose India then he withheld Pakistan's payment trying to force its collapse but it backfired and now they are a country named after a river in another country.

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

Jinnah was furious because Nehru was trying to say Pakistan would collapse indirectly, before that everyone thought they would use the name Hindustan officially but Nehru backed out last second and chose India then he withheld Pakistan's payment trying to force its collapse but it backfired and now they are a country named after a river in another country.

Jinnah knew what will happen, especially when whole South Asian ancient hisotry in confined to land of Pakistan and its people from IVC to Rig Vedic period.

 

[KingMamba]

Jinnah knew what will happen, especially when whole South Asian ancient hisotry in confined to land of Pakistan and its people from IVC to Rig Vedic period.

Hence the Indian dilemma, anyway hope akhi @al-Hasani will read these few posts to learn some history he might not have known before.

 

[Armstrong]

Anyway did I really say anything wrong? I mean what is exactly the difference between Pakistani and Indian Punjabis and Sindhis for instance?

There is no cultural difference other than religion. Besides the passport they carry. On all other fronts I would struggle to set them apart.
I don't know how that makes Pakistanis Indian or Indians Pakistanis.

I was very specific in my examples.

A Pakistani Punjabi & an Indian Punjabi are both the same ethnic people who've evolved into separate but similar cultural & quasi-linguistic groups; our culture, our festivals & even our use of the same language is fairly different than each other due to imprint that Islam left on our culture & our languages.

For example the Indian Punjabis celebrate the Besakhi festival & others such as that & its a big thing there - We don't have anything of the sort here.

This distinction wasn't really our creation that suddenly popped out of thin air because even the British differentiated between the three major religious groups living here because the differences virtually made them different sub-ethnic groups of a larger pan-Punjabi identity - there has been a separate mention of Punjabi Muslims, Punjabi Hindus & Sikhs as far back as one can remember !

Furthermore there really is no such thing as a Pakistani Punjabi because a Punjabi is someone who lives in the land called 'Punjab' or the 'Land of the 5 Rivers' which means that Punjab in itself is culturally, ethnically & linguistically extremely diverse !

Whereas a Punjabi from Lahore may have dramatic similarities with a Punjabi sitting in Chandigar (India) despite the differences that their different view points in life have brought, the Punjabi from the Saraiki belt, the Pukhtoon belt & the Baluch belt have next to nothing in common with an Indian Punjabi heck even the languages they speak are very different let alone the culture & the ethnicity.

The Pakistani Sindhis don't really have a pound for pound counterpart in India because the Indian Sindhi population is pretty low on numbers & isn't indigenous to any Province or State of India because there was only one Sindh - the one thats part of Pakistan.

And they too like their Punjabi counterparts from the North are similar but different.

The differences between Punjabi/Sindhi Indians & Pakistanis can be best summed up by the analogy that they are to each other what Urdu & Hindi are to each other - same roots (i.e Hindustani - the mother language) but they later evolved into different directions till a point when they ceased being the same language & instead became two separate languages a little like Afrikaans & Dutch or even German & Dutch....mutually interchangeable & understandable to a degree but different enough to be called two different languages !

So far as the rest of Pakistan is concerned - the West of Pakistan has next to nothing in common with India. The Baluch, the Barahvi, the Makranis in the South, the Pukhtoons, the Kohistanis, the Swatis, the Gilgiti, the Baltis, the Hazarawal etc. in the North have next to no cultural, linguistic or ethnic similarities with their Indian counterparts because there are no Indian counterparts of theirs.

They're similar to Afghans, Iranians & the Kashmiris !

Pakistan has the unique advantage to be born at the crossroads of civilizations - India on East, Afghanistan & Central Asia on the West & North-West, Iran on the South-West & China in the North; naturally there has been an imprint of different civilizations borne out of those regions on Pakistan just as there has been an imprint of different civilizations that were born out of Pakistan on those regions themselves !

That doesn't mean that Pakistanis & Indians are only separated by a passport or religion - Its like saying Swedish, Dutch, Danish & Finnish are all the same people because they're collectively called the Scandinavians !

 

[A Town]

The Pakistani Sindhis don't really have a pound for pound counterpart in India because the Indian Sindhi population is pretty low on numbers & isn't indigenous to any Province or State of India because there was only one Sindh - the one thats part of Pakistan.

And they too like their Punjabi counterparts from the North are similar but different.

I've heard the Kutchi Gujaratis are similar to Sindhis culturally and ethnically.

 

[Armstrong]

I've heard the Kutchi Gujaratis are similar to Sindhis culturally and ethnically.

Kutchi & Sindhi are similar just as Sindhi & Saraiki are similar - It doesn't make them the same languages !

The Kutchi of Gujrat are probably the same as the Kutchi of Pakistani's side of Kutch & adjoining areas !

 

[Desert Fox]

A Pakistani Punjabi & an Indian Punjabi are both the same ethnic people who've evolved into separate but similar cultural & quasi-linguistic groups; our culture, our festivals & even our use of the same language is fairly different than each other due to imprint that Islam left on our culture & our languages.

For example the Indian Punjabis celebrate the Besakhi festival & others such as that & its a big thing there - We don't have anything of the sort here.

This distinction wasn't really our creation that suddenly popped out of thin air because even the British differentiated between the three major religious groups living here because the differences virtually made them different sub-ethnic groups of a larger pan-Punjabi identity - there has been a separate mention of Punjabi Muslims, Punjabi Hindus & Sikhs as far back as one can remember !

Furthermore there really is no such thing as a Pakistani Punjabi because a Punjabi is someone who lives in the land called 'Punjab' or the 'Land of the 5 Rivers' which means that Punjab in itself is culturally, ethnically & linguistically extremely diverse !

Whereas a Punjabi from Lahore may have dramatic similarities with a Punjabi sitting in Chandigar (India) despite the differences that their different view points in life have brought, the Punjabi from the Saraiki belt, the Pukhtoon belt & the Baluch belt have next to nothing in common with an Indian Punjabi heck even the languages they speak are very different let alone the culture & the ethnicity.

The Pakistani Sindhis don't really have a pound for pound counterpart in India because the Indian Sindhi population is pretty low on numbers & isn't indigenous to any Province or State of India because there was only one Sindh - the one thats part of Pakistan.

And they too like their Punjabi counterparts from the North are similar but different.

The differences between Punjabi/Sindhi Indians & Pakistanis can be best summed up by the analogy that they are to each other what Urdu & Hindi are to each other - same roots (i.e Hindustani - the mother language) but they later evolved into different directions till a point when they ceased being the same language & instead became two separate languages a little like Afrikaans & Dutch or even German & Dutch....mutually interchangeable & understandable to a degree but different enough to be called two different languages !

So far as the rest of Pakistan is concerned - the West of Pakistan has next to nothing in common with India. The Baluch, the Barahvi, the Makranis in the South, the Pukhtoons, the Kohistanis, the Swatis, the Gilgiti, the Baltis, the Hazarawal etc. in the North have next to no cultural, linguistic or ethnic similarities with their Indian counterparts because there are no Indian counterparts of theirs.

They're similar to Afghans, Iranians & the Kashmiris !

Pakistan has the unique advantage to be born at the crossroads of civilizations - India on East, Afghanistan & Central Asia on the West & North-West, Iran on the South-West & China in the North; naturally there has been an imprint of different civilizations borne out of those regions on Pakistan just as there has been an imprint of different civilizations that were born out of Pakistan on those regions themselves !

That doesn't mean that Pakistanis & Indians are only separated by a passport or religion - Its like saying Swedish, Dutch, Danish & Finnish are all the same people because they're collectively called the Scandinavians !

Very elaborate and informative!