‘Admitting you are a secularist can get you killed in Pakistan’

[BATMAN]

There are new Fatwas out everyday.

Lool! You're clearly living in you la-la land.

Watching TV and falling into the haram

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watching football is haram

What should one believe now? The Quran and Hadiths or these Mullah brigade?

They are saying TV is haram/Music is haram/watching movies and dvds are haram/going out to cinema is haram/facebook is haram/internet is haram/in fact they even say leisure activities like playink snooker is haram and in fact football is haram as well.

I'm sure you've done most of these things, so according to these mullahs you are not a Muslim and will need to do your Shahada again.

This is problem.. people are following nonsense propagated by hindus, but do not follow what Quran say about idol worshippers and their friends.

 

[Patriots]

Laws from medivial Arabia cannot be applied today beside much of the Islamic laws were learned from the Romans, Persians and other civilizations surrounding Arabia!

Quran is revealed till Qayamat ... So Islamic rules are implementable till Qayamat too ..

 

[KS]

Laws from medivial Arabia cannot be applied today beside much of the Islamic laws were learned from the Romans, Persians and other civilizations surrounding Arabia!

See I'm not disputing they are medieval Arabia or anything. Just saying Islam does have a law and it requires those laws to be applied in governance.

And good luck trying to convince the Muslim world that those laws were written for medieval arabia and not for eternity.

Why would someone deny a fact?

Because those who want secularism in an Islamic Republic are essentially denying that fact - by encouraging separation of Islam and state !

 

[Patriots]

Yes but you were defending that Zaravan guy's post which said 'Everything non-Muslim is kufr, you're either with us or against us.'

I just say that in Islamic state all laws would be implemented according to Quran & Sunnah ... Nothing else ..

 

[SQ8]

Can you please.. give reference to the highlighted part for the sake of learning?



WTF are you talking?

Accounts of judgements for spared and executed individuals of Banu Qurayzah during the Prophets time as one example.
Accounts of Judgements for the Byzantine's during the time of the Caliphs are others.
The reference to the first may be found in Biographies such as Martin Lings.

The latter is in from an Urdu book whose name has slipped my tongue just because I am trying to recall it right now.

See I'm not disputing they are medieval Arabia or anything. Just saying Islam does have a law and it requires those laws to be applied in governance.

And good luck trying to convince the Muslim world that those laws were written for medieval arabia and not for eternity.



Because those who want secularism in an Islamic Republic are essentially denying that fact - by encouraging separation of Islam and state !

There laws were for all time.. the question is of the interpretation of these laws.
The Quran has the laws.. it was the interpretation of their application that was different.
Chopping off a hand is still a very good deterrent for theft. but the way to gather evidence for that is not.. nor was that set in stone.

Kindly give me evidence of Hadith which you quoted ... Thanx

Kindly study the seerat of the Prophet for your reference and expand upon by reading up on the times of the Khulfa Rashideen.

 

[Sugarcane]

Well, that is not entirely true....If Religion was a personal matter than no one else would have followed it because that way it would have only been the PERSONAL MATTER of the prophet or JESUS or BUDDHA or RAM or whosoever...

MIND YOU it is a HUMAN who governs not some alien so if he/she likes some ideology it will somehow or another influence him or her...as said by @LoveIcon

Religious ideologies either Islam, Christianity, Judaism or Hinduism (True not politicized) are far better and comprehensive than secularism. Secularism just focus on social issues and tells that you should do justice irrespective of someone's beliefs but doesn't teach you morality. For example it doesn't says that bribe, theft, murder etc. are right/wrong but says that if there is punishment that must be same for everyone. But on other hand every religions teach you morality and do justice as well. Every religion has 3 major parts Personal, Rights of Others, Rights of society for example in Islam

1. Personal is: I must believe in oneness of God & Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) as last messenger, Praying, Fasting, Zakat, Hajj, refrain from Haram etc. These are purely personal things same are with other religion and nobody have right to interfere in this or dictate me to do this or dictate me how i must do this.

2. Rights of Others - This part is completely missing in secularism which infect guide you how to become good human-being. i.e. It's my religion who tell me I shouldn't lie, backbite, should remove the stones from path, rights of my parents, kids, neighbors etc.

3. Rights of Society i.e. guidance on how to run state affairs. No religion (in true ideology) says that you should discriminate based on religious beliefs, things are included by ruler for their personal gains.

So, One thing for sure is Religious ideology is far batter and comprehensive than Secularism, For me secularism is out of equation because every religion in true form address the concerns on which Secularism is based. Now which religion is better that's another debate.

 

[BATMAN]

Accounts of judgements for spared and executed individuals of Banu Qurayzah during the Prophets time as one example.
Accounts of Judgements for the Byzantine's during the time of the Caliphs are others.
The reference to the first may be found in Biographies such as Martin Lings.

The latter is in from an Urdu book whose name has slipped my tongue just because I am trying to recall it right now.

.

Thanks.

Same time there are examples of complete forgiveness too....History books can't fully explain the circumstances of event but suerly cannot supersede the ultimate Quran!

I hope you know what Quran says about idol worshippers, in other words, those who believe in others but Allah!

 

[Patriots]

Yeah my post was a response to somebody else's idiotic post.

Yeah but these Mullahs have made almost everything Haram, which I'm sure isn't stated anywhere anywhere in Quran or any other religious scriptures. Do you think such Fatwas should be paid any attention to?

Things like 'Every thing Non-Muslim is Kufr' and stuff.

True Muslim just go to this below Quranic Verse:

They have taken as lords beside Allah their rabbis and their monks and the Messiah son of Mary, when they were bidden to worship only One God.
Surah Al-Tawba: 31

 

[SQ8]

Thanks.

Same time there are examples of complete forgiveness too....History books can't fully explain the circumstances of event but suerly cannot supersede the ultimate Quran!

I hope you know what Quran says about idol worshippers, in other words, those who believe in others but Allah!

The last verse from Surah Fatehah is enough to explain all about it.

 

[Patriots]

.............

 

[Sugarcane]

Sir they should get punishment and government should make laws for that Sir we are to decide Quran don't have only one ayat Sir ALLAH has told the laws in Quran and Sunnah and we have to implement them other wise their will be chaos if you want to come up with **** so Mr if some one harms you family than don't ask for his punishment too let ALLAH decide

Quran is book of guidance not law

 

[SHAMK9]

Sir in Islam either you are with Islam or you are with kufr that kufr can be of some religion or new kufr of secularism but that will be kufr and the denial of Islam and orders of ALLAH and his PROPHET SAW and in Islam state can't be neutral and even many secular say you can't be full secular until you are Atheist

You are so confused about your own faith, it bothers me.

 

[somebozo]

You are so confused about your own faith, it bothers me.

Now take that confusing and multiply it x10000000 people and basically you get an idea of our daily deteriorating law and order situation!

 

[Patriots]

Quran is book of guidance not law

Janab Quran has complete laws how to spend life ... Whatever you want ..

 

[Sugarcane]

Do you any doubt that Islam has some lacks regarding morality & humanity..????

My argument was comparison between Secular Ideology & Religious (any) Ideology and in my point of view Religious Ideologies are far better and comprehensive than Secularism. Among the religions - My belief is that Islamic ideology better address all aspects of personal and social as compared to other religions (non-Muslims will disagree that's why i said it's debatable) but one thing is for sure the Shariah which these mullahs want to enforce that's not Islam but purely politics.