A True Soldier!!

[The Unnamed]

I am getting used to this trend now..... OP spoke about a soldier who made Nehru to use his brain...... But eventually the thread turned to religion, soft **** and "Kerala" and TN......

What is there to learn so much about Nehru anyway ? Other than the fact that at times, he acted like a moron. Most of the times, his education saw him through as a PM. Honestly, I personally think he didn't have a vision strong enough.

Who really cares what happened 50-60 years ago ?

I would rather we put in more of Bose/counter congress in our school's textbooks. Just like how it happened in real life.

 

[nair]

What is there to learn so much about Nehru anyway ? Other than the fact that at times, he acted like a moron. Most of the times, his education saw him through as a PM. Honestly, I personally think he didn't have a vision strong enough.

Who really cares what happened 50-60 years ago ?

I would rather we put in more of Bose/counter congress in our school's textbooks. Just like how it happened in real life.

Some how i find funny the way people criticise him, most of these guys forget the condition of India when he was the prime minister...... It is true his visions were not perfect, and he made lot of mistakes then.....

 

[The Unnamed]

Some how i find funny the way people criticise him, most of these guys forget the condition of India when he was the prime minister...... It is true his visions were not perfect, and he made lot of mistakes then.....

Why Nehru ? Had congress become a dynasty rule even in 1940s, 1930s to be precise...THAT is the question nobody asks about Nehru. How Nehru ? Why Nehru ? Why not somebody else ? Nobody was there like Nehru or an equivalent ? Other than Jinnah of course. Out of question.

 

[gubbi]

What is there to learn so much about Nehru anyway ? Other than the fact that at times, he acted like a moron. Most of the times, his education saw him through as a PM. Honestly, I personally think he didn't have a vision strong enough.

Who really cares what happened 50-60 years ago ?

I would rather we put in more of Bose/counter congress in our school's textbooks. Just like how it happened in real life.

On the contrary it was Nehru's strong vision of an independent strong India with independent institutions of which you/we all reap the fruits today. He along with his colleagues formulated a strong vision for a democratic India. Given at the time, capitalism was looked upon unfavorably and communism/socialism had some degree of romanticism attached to it, no wonder Nehru adopted socialist agenda. He was proven wrong in this particular aspect, but at the time, his 5yr plans, did help many of the poor people in India and also with industrialization, albeit slow.

Bose, for all his bravado and leadership skills, was indeed a short sighted leader. Talk about fighting for freedom from oppression of an Empire and then going and allying with the axis powers like Imperial Japan who was enslaving and massacring people across east and south east Asia on the basis of their racial superiority!! Good thing that he did not exert much influence on the policies being formulated.

 

[The Unnamed]

On the contrary it was Nehru's strong vision of an independent strong India with independent institutions of which you/we all reap the fruits today.

True, very true, Pappu Gandhi is still around doing the same congressi s*** ! We all reaped the fruits...very true !

He along with his colleagues formulated a strong vision for a democratic India. Given at the time, capitalism was looked upon unfavorably and communism/socialism had some degree of romanticism attached to it, no wonder Nehru adopted socialist agenda. He was proven wrong in this particular aspect, but at the time, his 5yr plans, did help many of the poor people in India and also with industrialization, albeit slow.

Thank God he went to Britain for his education, had Mountbatten as his political mentor, USSR, Britain supporting India, a new nation.

He was an academic. You want an example ? If India was a college, Nehru should have been dean, not principal. I hope I have been clear enough with an apt analogy. It's an analogy.

Bose, for all his bravado and leadership skills, was indeed a short sighted leader. Talk about fighting for freedom from oppression of an Empire and then going and allying with the axis powers like Imperial Japan who was enslaving and massacring people across east and south east Asia on the basis of their racial superiority!! Good thing that he did not exert much influence on the policies being formulated.

We Indians do not know what Bose was. Alright ? You are parroting the congressi line...which ousted Bose and inducted Nehru in his place. You know what Bose was, fellow forumer ? He was a man whom the Indian government can not tell the truth about. STILL TODAY. Aight ? His bravado and what not created the first fighting men of India. Not a stooge army for her royal highness...get it ?

 

[gubbi]

True, very true, Pappu Gandhi is still around doing the same congressi s*** ! We all reaped the fruits...very true !

Blame the people, not the congress. Its the people who vote for dynastic politics.

Thank God he went to Britain for his education, had Mountbatten as his political mentor, USSR, Britain supporting India, a new nation.

He was an academic. You want an example ? If India was a college, Nehru should have been dean, not principal. I hope I have been clear enough with an apt analogy. It's an analogy.

An irrelevant rant.

We Indians do not know what Bose was. Alright ? You are parroting the congressi line...which ousted Bose and inducted Nehru in his place. You know what Bose was, fellow forumer ? He was a man whom the Indian government can not tell the truth about. STILL TODAY. Aight ? His bravado and what not created the first fighting men of India. Not a stooge army for her royal highness...get it ?

Another conspiracy theorist! Ah!
We all know who Bose was. Bose was shunted out of Congress for his extreme short sighted ideologies. As simple as that. Bose was a good man, but his policies were wrong, so was his timing. Period. A wrong man at the wrong time.
The first fighting men of India? Please not to be embarrassing us with this malarkey! As for anti-British sentiments, Tipu Sultan was among the very first Indians who fought against the British. So did the Marathas and the Mughals. Whats your point here?

 

[The Unnamed]

Blame the people, not the congress. Its the people who vote for dynastic politics.

And congress who promoted it among them. When Pappu's son tomorrow will come, Pappu will stand beside him while presenting him to India as India's next heir apparent. Congress too...not just the people. Wait...isn't it the benefit of Nehru's legacy that the same people are free today to choose the appointed by birth Nehru/Gandhi as our King ?

An irrelevant rant.

Riiighht...Nehru never had an education befitting a future King, Mounbatten was not his political mentor, USSR and Britain never supported the nascent democracy India..rant it is ! What are you ? a congressi mouthpiece here ?

Another conspiracy theorist! Ah!
We all know who Bose was. Bose was shunted out of Congress for his extreme short sighted ideologies. As simple as that. Bose was a good man, but his policies were wrong, so was his timing. Period. A wrong man at the wrong time.
The first fighting men of India? Please not to be embarrassing us with this malarkey! As for anti-British sentiments, Tipu Sultan was among the very first Indians who fought against the British. So did the Marathas and the Mughals. Whats your point here?

The point is, Bose was better suited than a Nehru Al Britaani, the british lawyer to be India's PM, on our topic. But then Gandhi was one of the original supporters of the dynasty ruled, muslim appeasing Nehru led Congress. And ousting Bose from congress has to do with Gandhi himself. Tipu Sultan, marathas, mughals, they all did it for themselves and their own empire.

Bose did it for the entity called India. I hope you read these and understand these points, these are not vacant shouts. gotta go, reply tomorrow if you have anything to say.

 

[gubbi]

And congress who promoted it among them. When Pappu's son tomorrow will come, Pappu will stand beside him while presenting him to India as India's next heir apparent. Congress too...not just the people. Wait...isn't it the benefit of Nehru's legacy that the same people are free today to choose the appointed by birth Nehru/Gandhi as our King ?

Seriously? A party where people like Gandhi, Patel, Nehru, even Bose rose to prominence promoted dynastic politics? You've got to be kidding me. Though I give it to you that in later years, Indira Gandi did indeed promote or sow the seeds for such succession. But then, the party is not be blamed entirely for this, Indians too must share the blame.

Riiighht...Nehru never had an education befitting a future King, Mounbatten was not his political mentor, USSR and Britain never supported the nascent democracy India..rant it is ! What are you ? a congressi mouthpiece here ?

What exactly are you wanting to convey here? I dont think you have your own thoughts cleared. And this unfortunately shows in you trying to convey something but cannot say exactly what it is you want to say. Probably, you are too confused as to what it is that you think your thoughts should be.
As for calling me a congressi mouthpiece, please!! You think you read some manifestoes, articles, and you consider yourself to be an authority on any given topic? That you can go around calling & branding people who dont agree with your point of view with some labels? You seem to be too much of a greenhorn to be taken seriously. As they say, "You know nothing, John Snow."

The point is, Bose was better suited than a Nehru Al Britaani, the british lawyer to be India's PM, on our topic. But then Gandhi was one of the original supporters of the dynasty ruled, muslim appeasing Nehru led Congress. And ousting Bose from congress has to do with Gandhi himself. Tipu Sultan, marathas, mughals, they all did it for themselves and their own empire.
Bose did it for the entity called India. I hope you read these and understand these points, these are not vacant shouts. gotta go, reply tomorrow if you have anything to say.

You are funny.
You dont even understand politics or the time and conditions of the day to understand how and why Bose was the wrong man then. You dont seem to have the capacity to understand why non-violence took precedence over "armed revolution" and yet won the day. You dont seem to comprehend how important was consensus development in formulating policies and vision for India over some crazy violent short sighted plan for liberating India. For what its worth, if Bose had succeeded, he would have been India's Caesar, and our history would have been no different from that of Pakistan.
See kiddo, just because you shout, doesn't mean you are right. Think.

 

[scorpionx]

No Wonder Mountbatten ran away from India in just one year as he was worried about his WIFE!!!



Politicians CAN'T be normal humans, if they want to live NORMAL life then please feel free & don't become a POLITICIAN. An Indian PM is the FACE of INDIA & INDIANS internationally. Don't know what IMAGE our Great Chacha Nehru wanted to Portray of Indians Internationally.

Am sorry, I see this as a bit emotional overreaction from Indians especially when they want to look at their leaders as a sacred deity and try to bring their private choices, preferences within this holy ideological boundary. While doing so, some of you intentionally and some unintentionally dismiss the fact that in a country where 34% of MPs in the parliament are actually accused of committing crimes it is ridiculous to expect that,"politicians CAN'T be normal humans." These words sounds good in school but practically all these are empty slogans with no substantial weight carrying.

Secondly, characteristic piety does not make one an apt leader of a country. Apparently, Gandhi was perhaps the most self righteous leader who did his best to couple his religious faith into his political doctrine and we know how unimpressive he was in terms of realizing the political scene, both domestic and International. His self imposed "Godmanship" did not help much to make him a leader with a common sense and necessary political intuition.

Not a great admirer of Nehru, but the way this thread has turned into a Nehru bajao thread is really an unfortunate development.Criticism of his policies that affected India's future or jeopardized India's relation with its neighbor are always welcome but condemning him as an immoral politician today strongly challenges our ethical honesty.

 

[Bang Galore]

This statement not expected from you. I thought you would bash him.
Well, I know this incident very well before.
I am glad you have proven wrong my assessment for you.
Everyone curse Nehru but they forgot that if he wants to become a dictator then nobody can stop him.
Nobody is perfect as summarize his strength become India's strength and his weakness become India's weakness.
He is influenced India so much that we are yet not change his certain key policies.

You know the funny thing is that when everyone praises the soldier (& rightly so), almost no one credited Nehru with the courage & grace to change his decision. Therein lies his greatness.

Not a great admirer of Nehru, but the way this thread has turned into a Nehru bajao thread is really an unfortunate development

We live in a different world...today greatness is defined by an inability to say sorry or accept one's mistakes.

 

[scorpionx]

You know the funny thing is that when everyone praises the soldier (& rightly so), almost no one credited Nehru with the courage & grace to change his decision. Therein lies his greatness.

Spot on. It has been a fashion to call him a fascist these days. I really wonder how many politicians had guts then or have now to write a self introspective article like,"... we want no Caesars."

 

[Bang Galore]

Spot on. It has been a fashion to call him a fascist these days. I really wonder how many politicians had guts then or have now to write a self introspective article like,"... we want no Caesars."

Ya, if you go by some of these chaps, it is almost as if Nehru & Gandhi physically stopped their "heroes" from winning independence in whatever manner they wished......Their failures are all heaped on Gandhi & Co. Either Gandhi didn't support....or supported someone else....etc; they don't realise there is a confession inherent in those remarks on the importance of Gandhi. If Gandhi wasn't great, why did his support or lack thereof matter?

 

[dray]

Ya, if you go by some of these chaps, it is almost as if Nehru & Gandhi physically stopped their "heroes" from winning independence in whatever manner they wished......Their failures are all heaped on Gandhi & Co. Either Gandhi didn't support....or supported someone else....etc; they don't realise there is a confession inherent in those remarks on the importance of Gandhi. If Gandhi wasn't great, why did his support or lack thereof matter?

Are they "Heroes" of only "Those chaps"? I think every freedom fighter has contributed their bit to our freedom movement in whatever manner they saw fit, it was a collective effort, and calling their efforts & sacrifices "Failures" (Which also means giving all the credit for "Success" to one person), would do a great injustice to our long & painful fight to freedom. For me, all of them are our Heroes.

 

[Indrani]

Ya, if you go by some of these chaps, it is almost as if Nehru & Gandhi physically stopped their "heroes" from winning independence in whatever manner they wished......Their failures are all heaped on Gandhi & Co. Either Gandhi didn't support....or supported someone else....etc; they don't realise there is a confession inherent in those remarks on the importance of Gandhi. If Gandhi wasn't great, why did his support or lack thereof matter?

His support or lack thereof did not matter as was revealed by the British PM Clement Atlee. Gandhi only matters because of how history was hijacked by the Marxist historians to present him and Nehru as the only important figures of Indian freedom struggle and how they managed to sideline all the Nationalists to beggar India for the next 60 years of its freedom. Our only aim in dragging their name is to make sure the coming generations know them for the anti-Hero they were.

 

[dray]

Spot on. It has been a fashion to call him a fascist these days. I really wonder how many politicians had guts then or have now to write a self introspective article like,"... we want no Caesars."

I evidently don't have a lot of respect for him, I don't criticize him for his socialist policies though, capital formation didn't happen in those days and state funded industries and socialist type economic policies were the only solution we had, I can also forgive him for those critical mistakes that he made even if the price was heavy, to err is human.

But two of his acts;

1. The way he became the Prime Minister by depriving the rightful (and elected) candidate.

And 2. The way he "Worked" to ensure Indira's succession to the throne, and played some dirty politics with some other senior & respected Congress leaders in the process.

For me, he was "Just a politician", not a freedom fighter, not a great leader, not a hero, not after those blatant examples of selfishness, greed for power, and nepotism. And his legacy still continues till date.


There are plenty of examples of freedom fighters who did their bit, but later they or their widows refused to take Government pension or token of recognition because they didn't do it for money or a certificate, they did it for their motherland. And now some of us call them "Failures".