7 Questions to Pakistani Members : Article 370

[Shane]

lol. Grow up kid.
You dont write History in a Mathematics paper and call its a "befetting reply".

@MastanKhan @BATMAN @Alternatiiv I doubt PDF has any appetite for serious talks anymore

Tell that to a Indian Occupied Kashmiri 9year old Kid with 17 pellets in her face.

Ask her if she has any appetite for serious talks anymore.

Yeah Khaki Shorts, its like that here.

 

[hussain0216]

I think this was WELL TESTED in 1965. No ?
And it proved to be a shock.


Operation Gibraltar was based on the assumption that guerrilla attacks would trigger an uprising by the Muslim majority population of Indian-controlled Kashmir, most of whom had wanted to join Pakistan at the time of the partition of British India in 1947.

Result :

But the civilians of Indian-administered Kashmir were not only not prepared for mass rebellion, they actually suffered at the hands of the intruders. Military historians cite numerous examples where civilians were killed or harmed, and others where they turned the infiltrators in.

This is a Indian revision of history, much like how you are trying to convince yourself that Muslims in Azad Kashmir who despise Hindus and Indians would want independence
We experienced it first hand in February 2019 when after being humiliated and losing a Mig 21 India tried to bullshit its way out by claiming your downed Mig shot a f16 and termed your useless Su30s as #AmraamDodgers



This is 2019 and even Indian Muslims are waking up to the threat of a hindutva India let alone Kashmiris

 

[Furious]

Let's make this simple

Because we hate Indians and want partition from India

It's that simple!

But for some dumbfcuk reason you Indians want to force a Muslim majority state that hates you and wanted partition into a union full of Hindus creating decade's or turmoil at the same time your turning increasingly hindutva extremist

Well the dumbfuck reason is India was given IoA because you guys wanted to forcefully annex it. And Indian soldiers fought to defend Kashmir and lost their lives. So there is no way that India will let go after the sacrifices of our soldiers. Maybe if you werent a warmonger then, Kashmir might have gone to you. So blame your general and politicians for the tragedy.

 

[Chanakyaa]

That's your claim, it's you who need to clarify your base less accusations.

Im not getting you dude.

Pakistan never did though, did it?

True. Still under consideration.
Its once again like Siachin, Pakistan and India both wanted the result, India executed it faster.

This is a Indian revision of history, much like how you are trying to convince yourself that Muslims in Azad Kashmir who despise Hindus and Indians would want independence
We experienced it first hand in February 2019 when after being humiliated and losing a Mig 21 India tried to bullshit its way out by claiming your downed Mig shot a f16 and termed your useless Su30s as #AmraamDodgers



This is 2019 and even Indian Muslims are waking up to the threat of a hindutva India let alone Kashmiris

BBC is Indian Bhai?

Tell that to a Indian Occupied Kashmiri 9year old Kid with 17 pellets in her face.

Ask her if she has any appetite for serious talks anymore.

Yeah Khaki Shorts, its like that here.

Bhai.. if you want.. "dirt" 1971 rapes victims whose limbs were chopped 'by their own people' are still waiting for justice.

 

[Lincoln]

Im not getting you dude.



True. Still under consideration.
Its once again like Siachin, Pakistan and India both wanted the result, India executed it faster.



BBC is Indian Bhai?



Bhai.. if you want.. "dirt" 1971 rapes victims whose limbs were chopped 'by their own people' are still waiting for justice.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-pakistan-election-idUSTRE5AB1ZE20091112

They want to integrate, opposition is less. Pakistan rejected it because it goes against defining all Kashmir as disputed territory then.

 

[hussain0216]

BBC is Indian Bhai?

The version is no different then to verbalise Indias nonsensical claims of being amraam Dodgers

As India turns notably hindutva so Indian Muslims begin to awaken to the threat, Kashmiris are well ahead and despise Hindus and Indians

Well the dumbfuck reason is India was given IoA because you guys wanted to forcefully annex it. And Indian soldiers fought to defend Kashmir and lost their lives. So there is no way that India will let go after the sacrifices of our soldiers. Maybe if you werent a warmonger then, Kashmir might have gone to you. So blame your general and politicians for the tragedy.

Our actions insured freedom for GB and Azad Kashmir, we also opened a vital link to China and blocked India from central Asia

India is untrustworthy, we never trust Hindus and Kashmir would be occupied in total if we hadn't acted

Today we continue to support the Kashmiris

 

[Temur Afendi]

It’s an irony that the people of GB who revolted against the Dogra governor and won their independence, then approached Pak and asked for the accession of GB to Pak are still waiting to be accepted as equal Pakistanis. Instead of giving GB provincial status and fully integrating it into Pak, its leaders successfully turned it into a disputed territory and linked its faith with the valley. This is a great injustice to their sacrifices and their love towards the country they always wanted to be a part of. But is there anything the rulers of this country hasn’t made a complete mess of.

 

[ghazi52]

 

[jericho]

 

[Kabira]

lol... I think Mature discussions are not your cup of tea.
Please go and attend the Threads where Israeli Pilots are Captured or where.. India and pak are going to have a war next week.



Please Educate Yourself :

Population trends for major religious groups in India (1951–2011)
Religious
group Population
% 1951 Population
% 1961 Population
% 1971 Population
% 1981 Population
% 1991 Population
% 2001 Population
% 2011[59]
Hinduism 84.1% 83.45% 82.73% 82.30% 81.53% 80.46% 79.80%
Islam 9.8% 10.69% 11.21% 11.75% 12.61% 13.43% 14.23%
Christianity 2.30% 2.44% 2.60% 2.44% 2.32% 2.34% 2.30%
Sikhism 1.79% 1.79% 1.89% 1.92% 1.94% 1.87% 1.72%
Buddhism 0.74% 0.74% 0.70% 0.70% 0.77% 0.77% 0.70%
Jainism 0.46% 0.46% 0.48% 0.47% 0.40% 0.41% 0.37%
Zoroastrianism 0.13% 0.09% 0.09% 0.09% 0.08% 0.06% not counted
Others/Religion not specified 0.43% 0.43% 0.41% 0.42% 0.44% 0.72% 0.9%

between : 1951 and 2011 > It changed from 10% to 14% and we are talking about 14% of 1.3 Billion !

My point still stand, Indian muslims will never become majority in any state. While ethnic cleansing is real danger now in muslim majority IoK.

Anyway this is slap on the face of secular Abdullahs of Kashmir. They rejected Jinnah offer and wanted to join secular India. Cannot feel sorry for them as long as likes of Abdullah's can walk free on streets of Kashmir and win elections. Will this move change anything? Lets wait and see how long it take for mainstream Kashmiri leadership to accept new reality and sell it to public.

 

[Shane]

Bhai.. if you want.. "dirt" 1971 rapes victims whose limbs were chopped 'by their own people' are still waiting for justice.

Bhau, you are not as dum as your posts and your sense of comparison for people's suffering under state sponsored genocide is remarkably inhumane.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

You have no right in asking us, that's why.

 

[zip]

lol. Grow up kid.
You dont write History in a Mathematics paper and call its a "befetting reply".

@MastanKhan @BATMAN @Alternatiiv I doubt PDF has any appetite for serious talks anymore

Haven't you seen now situation here is ..
Bolnewala bi deewana aur sun ne wala bi..

 

[Ultima Thule]

Thanx for th reply. Much appreciated.
Actually i mean is the Legal or lets say... the outcome part :

“Constitutionally and legally, the territory of Gilgit-Baltistan is part of the state of Jammu and Kashmir and any attempt to secede it from the disputed region will deal a blow to the stand of Pakistan and Kashmiris regarding the longstanding dispute,” said Sardar Abid Hussain Abid, AJK Minister for Information, while talking to Dawn.

“But the federal government should avoid annexing the territory as a province, lest India may use it a justification to annex the territories of Jammu and Kashmir under its control,” he warned.

Please comment on the Bold Part. If Pakistan can Do it .. why not India ?

In whats country Constitutions it written that GB is part of Jammu and Kashmir, and read the history troll AJK?GB tribes ask PA for help because they know sooner and later DOGRA RAJ will join India and in Gilgit Baltistan peoples lives their normally Unlike Kashmiri in IOK
and we did,'t make GB as 5th province, there is no representation of GB in Pakistani Parliament/National assembly @XiNiX

 

[zn426]

Hello,

Im Making a Set of Questionnaire..
Kindly reply in point wise manner. I wish to understand your POV for Educational purposes.

1.1 What do you know about Article 370 ?

1.2 Do you know that Pakistan too has initiated steps to Convert its part of Kashmir into fifth Province ?

• https://www.dawn.com/news/1232018
• https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/headline/govt-set-to-convert-gilgit-baltistan-into-fifth-province/

Don't you think, Pakistan too is WRONG to add GB as its Province ?

2. Why do you care for Kashmir ?

A. Because we are with the "People" of Kashmir and Their Rights
B. Because Kashmir is a Muslim Majority and we Care for Islam and Muslims
C. Kashmir Belongs to Pakistan
D. Others( Please Explain )

3. If You chose 2.A :

If you are concerned with the Rights of Kashmiris, Why is the Situation somewhat similar to Indian Kashmir ?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019...inking-pro-freedom-space-190304091423290.html

Your Views Please.

3. If You chose 2.B :

If you really care about a Muslim Majority, And you care about Palestine as well, why Not Uigher Muslims ?

An Article written by a Pakistani on 14th August 2019 > https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/why-...hinas-repressed-uighurs.631248/#post-11700464

3. C. If you choose 3.C , Then dont you think India has a better claim as the "Instrument of accession" is with India ?

4. Many in the forum are claiming that despite Russia, US and France taking a stand against Pakk+China , Its a victory coz, Kashmir issue was "Internationalised" .. Your Thoughts ?

Dont you think, that Year after year...Each Speech in UNGA has the mention of Kashmir .. was it still not Internationalized ? Kargil happened in 1999 the reason was Kahsmir.. Still it was not Internationalized ?

5. Article 370, was a line in Indian Constitution SINCE 1950. The Line was DELETED as per the Laws Given in Article 370 ITSELF.

How is a change of "Indian constitution" Illegal or for that matter, Not an Internal matter of India ?

6. After the UNSC meeting :

- India stays in Kashmir, the way it wants
- Pakstani cannot start a war due to Financial condition

Do you still think there is any chance for Pakistan , given the fact that UNSC too favored "bilateral" route ( which means > Solve between yourself.. we wont intervene ) ?

7. LOC is the Border Now, Pakistan keeps its part of AJK, India now keeps Its part of Kashmir.

Dont you think , we can administer our respective areas of Kashmir.. focus more on economy and development and stay away from this unnecessary conflict ?

1. Article 370 gives the right for every province or state of India the right to have its own constitution, autonomy over its own affairs, and a significant degree of independence. At the time of independence, most of India decided to defer to the Indian constitution and submit to federal rule. AJK decided they wanted to stay independent and thus became autonomous. Their right to autonomy has been steadily eroded, and with the revocation of 370, it has been taken away completely. Not only that, India refuses to grant it even the status of a province a la Maharashtra. That is shameful.

2. GB has semi-provincial status pending the resolution of the Kashmir issue, and has autonomy like AJK did until the revocation of 370. Also, you're citing a two year old article that preceded a change in governments, and the prior government didn't actually make GB a province. I think IK has bigger issues on his plate than statehood for GB.

3. I'm not a Muslim, unlike many on this board, but that doesn't stop me for caring for Pakistan. Heads up-two wrongs don't make a right. Of course Pakistan should protest the Uigher issue with China, IK is in the best position to advocate for their cause. Do keep in mind though, that India oppressing minorities is wrong as well. If you are a supporter of Indian democracy, you should support fairness and equality for Kashmiris just like you favor it for every other group in India. That can't be done when India insists on marching hundreds of thousands of troops into the region and shutting down the area whenever they think it necessary.

4. The Indian economy is struggling, Modi is looking more like a dictator every single day...you tell me. All these countries you claim have supported India are doing so because India has money. What happens if the Indian economy goes in the gutter? You lose the ear of a lot of important people. The issue has been internationalised, and now if there's a war then IK can say he tried everything to resolve it peacefully. I despise war, but as is said in the Bible, those who live by the sword will die by it.

5. The issue stopped being an internal matter when this became an international issue, that India even acknowledges should be negotiated bilaterally. Not unilaterally. Bilaterally. Pakistan has done its part in helping keep Azad Kashmir autonomous for the most part. India is acting in bad faith by insisting this is somehow an internal issue. You might say that 370 applies to every state in the Union of India, as I mentioned earlier, but last I checked India only even gained any access to Kashmir through the acts of a ruler who had lost his throne and was on the run, and this went to the international stage for a resolution, a resolution that has not come. So no, it's not an internal manner. Besides, Pakistan is not India. Since when does Pakistan have to recognize the internal matters of India? India could write in its constitution that men in Punjab must start their day by dressing in a Japanese kimono and singing songs from Bollywood, and as Pakistan is an independent nation, no one in Lahore is subject to that order.

6. That's up to Pakistan. The historical narrative on war essentially favors a stalemate despite what India might claim. I take the opinion that IK was taking every diplomatic option to try and get this resolved, and since it hasn't, unfortunately war is on the cards, and there's no fool like Nawaz Sharif to hand back everything Pakistan won with previous blood and lives in the first place. No doubt a war would be hard, costly, and there's no guarantee Pakistan would win it-but that's Pakistan's choice.

7. If you consider "administering" leaving hundreds of thousands of troops in place, Amit Shah insisting that they will find a way to make Kashmiris a minority in their own homeland, etc.-then sure, great work! Except oppression is wrong no matter who's doing the oppressing. Shah is a man who has taken justice into his own hands in the past, rather than letting the authorities handle things. I have long appreciated India's ability to make a place for everyone, yet now I see India making India a country-for Hindus.

To finish, the day India wants to be a great country, they will care for everyone in their country, not just the majority. That's the weakness of democracy-mob rule.