15 Jordanian F-16 for sale

[CHI RULES]

I couldn't have expected such an emotional, albeit absent deep insight, response from you.

As @Bratva so rightly states, in post 121, these may not be effective against IAF and since IAF is the only real reason we even have a military and Air Force, it is kind of short sighted to continue procurement of these jets especially since we are unable to upgrade them beyond understanding of IAF and also because we cannot count on the US to continue with supplies of spares in the event we actually need them in a war.

We may get spares as much we like as many nations are going to retire F16s and even EFT as soon as they acquire F35. Further Pak may count on other resources to mantain our F16s just like we did with Mirages or Iran did with 70's US fighters. On the other hand you should take Windjammer Sir, comments more seriously as he is ex fighter pilot from PAF.

 

[ghazi768]

Hi,

Supposedly---everytime a U S F16 went against a Mig 29 equipped with HOBS missile during an excercize---it was shot down.

This is an extremely false statement, atleast three US pilots had actually flown and served embedded in Mig-29 squadrons and there were lots of exercises and mock dogfights not only with F-16 but with many other Nato fighters. where did you get this information? can you point to me to it?

 

[_NOBODY_]

We may get spares as much we like as many nations are going to retire F16s and even EFT as soon as they acquire F35.

No nation is stupid enough to replace EFT with F-35.

 

[Wolf]

The IAF has more and better of tech. We will lose more aircraft than them in any conflict that is prolonged beyond a few days. Their greatest disadvantage is inability to generate enough sorties due to lack of pilots per aircraft, and more importantly fresh pilots.

Agreed. Pakistan should enhance its Battle endurance I.e. ability to fight on longer. Further, Pakistan should come out of this minimum credible defence syndrome. Increase the numbers and try to match Indians in numbers. Tank for a tank, jet for a jet , ship for a ship, sub for a sub and so forth. Change in psyche only will made us capable to think and act to develop means in terms of economy to achieve economic parity and defense parity.

@Oscar && @Quwa @araz @Bratva

Your statements regarding corruption are fine, however please make a differentiation.
We are NOT talking about the average joe on the street.
We are talking about men in blue, who have undergone rigorous character building and decorated as officers
above all.
( it's a separate thing, once they wear ray bans they consider themselves Gods above all ).

What I want to focus upon is mismanagement and lack of capability more than corruption.
There is just no excuse for those two.

Anyway, another thought.

India already has accurate electronics signatures of F-16s, they are getting to train against them too courtesy
uncle sam.

How wise would be to keep inducting the same platform that your enemy is getting to know in more detail by the day ?

Really informative regarding electronic signatures of F 16s with Indians. If that's the case then strange why Paf uncles are interested in more 16s

 

[CHI RULES]

No nation is stupid enough to replace EFT with F-35.

it is happening and u will see soon

 

[volatile]

We will not see AESA on the 16s. The platform for AESA will be JFT. You will neither get permission nor will you want to.
A

I have a hunch if we can get AESA for F17 we will get V configuration considering US recent history of dealing with Pak

 

[Windjammer]

This is one of the Jordanian aircraft acquired earlier by the PAF, after some in house work, these aircraft were brought back into immaculate condition, notice that these particular aircraft have a fairing at the base of the tail, housing some form of gadgets.

 

[_NOBODY_]

it is happening and u will see soon

EFT is superior in terms of air superiority so why would any nation replace EFT with F-35.

 

[MastanKhan]

This is an extremely false statement, atleast three US pilots had actually flown and served embedded in Mig-29 squadrons and there were lots of exercises and mock dogfights not only with F-16 but with many other Nato fighters. where did you get this information? can you point to me to it?

Hi,

This is years old news---25 years old---and I will try to find it for you---.

 

[SQ8]

Hi,

This is years old news---25 years old---and I will try to find it for you---.

There is no such news of being shot down by a Mig-29 in actual combat. What you are trying to recount is the initial encounters western pilots had with the Mig-29's acquired by the Luftwaffe after the reunification of Germany at the end of the cold war.

During the various exercises carried out, the western aircraft found themselves at a severe disadvantage in a turning fight against a Mig-29 due to the combination of the AA-11 and the early monocle sight used by the Mig-29 pilots. However, in all other realms including BVR combat; the Mig-29 was thoroughly outclassed. @ghazi768 hope this clears it up.

That being said, today's Mig-29 is a little different as it embodies all those lessons of ergonomics and user friendliness to a much better degree than say 20 years ago.

 

[MastanKhan]

There is no such news of being shot down by a Mig-29 in actual combat. What you are trying to recount is the initial encounters western pilots had with the Mig-29's acquired by the Luftwaffe after the reunification of Germany at the end of the cold war.

During the various exercises carried out, the western aircraft found themselves at a severe disadvantage in a turning fight against a Mig-29 due to the combination of the AA-11 and the early monocle sight used by the Mig-29 pilots. However, in all other realms including BVR combat; the Mig-29 was thoroughly outclassed. @ghazi768 hope this clears it up.

That being said, today's Mig-29 is a little different as it embodies all those lessons of ergonomics and user friendliness to a much better degree than say 20 years ago.

Sir,

I never stated actual combat---. After the Berlina wall came down---th U S got access tot he MIG29's and that happened during the excecize.

 

[nomi007]

@Oscar
dear sir is PAF considering this offer or not?

 

[GiG]

as far they are able to fire AIM 120 C then its a good deal

"Main armament of the RJAF F-16s is the AIM-9 Sidewinder, although the RJAF was hoping to acquire the AIM-120 AMRAAM for a long time. On November 24th, 2004 a deal was announced in which Jordan would receive up to 50 AIM-120C missiles and associated equipment in a deal worth $39 million."

 

[Quwa]

@Oscar
dear sir is PAF considering this offer or not?

Seems like it.

“The negotiations are being held through our Pakistani representative,” a TAI official said. “We are hopeful about an eventual deal in view of our excellent relations with PAF.”

If finalized the deal will involve upgrades on a batch of 74 PAF F-16 aircraft, including 14 fighters Pakistan will acquire from Jordan.

http://www.defensenews.com/story/de...4/tai-talks-upgrade-pakistani-f-16s/84854448/

 

[Mav3rick]

We may get spares as much we like as many nations are going to retire F16s and even EFT as soon as they acquire F35. Further Pak may count on other resources to mantain our F16s just like we did with Mirages or Iran did with 70's US fighters. On the other hand you should take Windjammer Sir, comments more seriously as he is ex fighter pilot from PAF.

But the question is, would these F-16's be able to not only deny air superiority to MKIs but also be able to dominate them? 18 Block 52+ might just be able to do that but they will have to contend with 270 MKIs.........and what happens when all MKIs are upgraded to Super MKI standard and our very small fleet of F-16's is still stuck on MLU largely and some on Block 52+?

Instead, we should rather have a JF-17 that has state of the art AESA radar, EM/ECM & ECCM, high usage of superior composites, RAM Coatings, largely stealth with the assistance of design/RAM & avionics, much more powerful engine with supercruise, higher service ceiling, longer range and duration..........basically the JFT should be able to take on anything in the IAF arsenal and out-perform it with Pakistani skies. And on top of it all, they should have a weapons package like no other. And we should have atleast 300 of these. Plus, we should have J-31's in service within the next 5-10 years.

It's time to let go of the F-16's, they served us well........but very soon they will only be a liability instead of an asset. That is unless we are able to get upgrade packages for all our F-16's that upgrade them to Block 60.......which again is a dream.

So realistically, we need to put 80% of our eggs in JF-17's basket and 20% in J-31's basket. Within 5 years, the JFT can be a formidable 4.5 gen fighter.

Like what? and where. Could you prepare a feasibility where $250 million could go to offer an equivalent amount of capability within that timeframe?

Please read my post above.

And.......money spent wisely is money spent well.

Such as?If you are talking local effort then fruition is 15 yrs away. If its an off the shelf buy then you need to tell me which platform can you buy which is available to you and within your reach and is not sanction prone. Please dont say SU35 because the russians are a very untrusted water to be sailing into for PAF.
A

Please read my post above.

Also, there is no real hurry, it is not like India can impose war on Pakistan in the near future.

We have 5-10 years to prepare well.