11 Feb '13: Pakistan conducts test fires of two Hatf-IX Nasr BRBMs

[JonAsad]

One question-

If the missiles are supposedly fired in salvos be it with or without tactical warheads- why there is a need for canards and manoevering?-

 

[The Deterrent]

One question-

If the missiles are supposedly fired in salvos be it with or without tactical warheads- why there is a need for canards and manoevering?-

Nasr is not a MBRL. It has only four missiles per vehicle, so each missile has to be survivable enough. It should be noted that Nasr is a modern missile, developed considering the evolving threats to ballistic missiles. Shaheen-IA is developed keeping the same threat in mind, and so will be the future ballistic missiles of Pakistan.

 

[Safriz]

1. Testing salvo firing mode. As seen in the video, the two missiles were fired with a time interval of a couple of seconds. (the video is cut, but the smoke trail of the first missile hints the time interval).

2. Two more missiles were seen in the video which weren't fired, indicating that they were placed for testing the pressure and shock imparted on the launcher by missiles which were fired.

3. The term maneuverable missile has been used for the first time, indicating that probably for the first time the canards were utilized to perform unpredictable flight maneuvers (previously used for course correction only perhaps), thereby giving the ability to confuse AB

The video shows both missiles being Fired at interval of about 6 seconds...
The burnout time seems to be about 10 seconds and the Launch Profile is angular in comparison to Indian Prahaar's vertical launch...

The Launch trajectory suggest a highly manoeuvrable Depressed/Quasi Ballistic Path..Such missile can follow many different types of trajectories and ABM will be extremely Difficult..

 

[Jango]

Double Negation
A double negative occurs when two forms of negation are used in the same sentence


so its imperative that you are saying

Sorry...couldn't resist.

 

[Safriz]

From the looks of it all 4 Missiles can be fired at different targets in less than 24 seconds....
There is no evidence of the Launch tubes being able to change Azimuth..So the guess is that all 4 missiles will be fired for the same general area.

 

[The Deterrent]

From the looks of it all 4 Missiles can be fired at different targets in less than 24 seconds....

Nah, the video is cut between the two missile launches. The time interval between the consecutive launches is definitely more than 6 seconds.

There is no evidence of the Launch tubes being able to change Azimuth..So the guess is that all 4 missiles will be fired for the same general area.

Good observation.
Thats what the canards are for IMO. They can change the flight path, and could target a couple of kilometers away (sideways) from usual ballistic trajectory.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

From the looks of it all 4 Missiles can be fired at different targets in less than 24 seconds....
There is no evidence of the Launch tubes being able to change Azimuth..So the guess is that all 4 missiles will be fired for the same general area.

their guidance system will take them to different paths once they are out of the tube and reached a certain elevation. they are not dumb rockets from MLRS.

 

[Windjammer]

Eik Pakistani eik Indian ko samjata hey,

" Tum paheley samja karo, har baat key dou matlab hotey hain"....

Indian jawab deta hey...."Fir nikal kar dikhaou".

Pakistani kaheta hey..."Aub mein kiya tujey samjaou'n, iskey bi dou matlab hain". !!

 

[Armstrong]

For a country of 1200 million..10 million casualties will be an acceptable scenario if the other scenario involves the complete destruction.

No it isn't even a few thousand dead is a few thousand too many; considering that we've got nearly 200 million to spare we can loose a few million as well but we can't & neither can India ! Thankfully neither your military planner or civilian executive nor our military planners & the same, consider the loss of 10 million casualties as even remotely acceptable.

And rest assured there isn't going to be a complete destruction of the other side with you guys only loosing 10 million people; I've reiterated enough times already that no one, least of all India, knows where all of our nuclear facilities are never mind our exponentially more mobile platforms. The 5-10 nuke figure that I gave was to impress upon you that even an absurdly low number of nukes is still one nuke too many.

There is some serious flaw in the Pakistani thinking process here, if you think a Pakistani nuclear strike on Indian soldiers will not invite an Indian nuclear response on Pakistan.
Now if Indian response is a proportional one, perhaps a Pakistani armored corps or nuclear weapons base.
Pakistan will surely attack back with more nuclear weapons, this time on Indian soil..thus will begin process of gradual escalation in which major portion of both the countries will be destroyed.

Who said a Pakistani Nuclear response would not invite an Indian Nuclear Response ? But so will an Indian Nuclear Response invite a subsequent Pakistani Nuclear Response & in any event if most of our facilities are being targeted then most of India's facilities will be targeted conversely, to assume that somehow India would mobilize & then launch so many Nukes without Pakistan even getting a whiff of it is fantastic at best.

That mutually assured destruction that was present on a strategic level has now been devolved to a division & perhaps a regimental level & that is precisely why there isn't going to be any wars fought between India & Pakistan in the future.

India comes up with the Cold Start doctrine to thrust into Pakistan in multiple places in a small frame of time to punish us in case of a terrorist attack on India, allegedly, backed by Pakistan.

Pakistan answer that by bringing into service tactical nukes, appears to be mass producing them & has them operational on highly mobile platforms that can traverse the length & breadth of Pakistan in a matter of hours.

So the real question - Are we bluffing or not when we say that if your Cold Start is brought into motion we'd nuke the first Armored Division that crosses over into Pakistani territory overwhelming our lines !

Right now India has shown that it takes that bluff quite seriously ! If Kargil, if the Stand-Off or if Mumbai itself weren't reasons enough for India to cross over into Pakistan & punish us then god knows what the 'red lines'.

Indian response of massive nuclear strike after the first Pakistani strike ensures, we directly jump to the last step ..so that number of Pakistani nukes launched on India are kept to the minimum.

Surely it is not ideal scenario..but its the best one India can get, if the war has already gone nuclear.

India's massive response isn't even a response in contention...heck its not even a bluff ! India can't even at the best of their performance hope to take out most of Pakistan's Nuclear Capabilities & she knows it.

What is India going to do ? Launch SRBMS & MRBMS against Pakistan's launch sites ? How in God's name do you think Pakistan wouldn't have preempted such a response in case it does decide to use a tactical warhead ? How do think that India would be able to even mobilize all of that without Pakistan getting a whiff of it ? How do you account for, the 10th time, the many mobile launchers that Pakistan has got ?

If its not the SRBMs & the MRBMs, is it going to be air-craft ? Do you think we've left our nukes out in the open without any air-defenses or air-cover whatsoever ? Without any hardened shelters ? Anything of the sort ?

Policy of massive retaliation is not dissuade Pakistan from launching the second strike(which you will launch with whatever is left of your arsenal)..but dissuade Pakistan from first strike itself.

And the policy of Tactical & Miniaturized Nukes is to dissuade India from escalating the conflict to begin with ! If the Indian High Command is willing to find out whether Pakistan will target Indian FOBs in case our forward lines in some areas are run over, then be my guest; however, until, now both the Indian High Command & the Civilian Executive appear to consider the probable casualties of any such escalation far...far too high to even contemplate putting it to the test ! Thats a good enough deterrent for me.

 

[Safriz]

Neither Pakistan nor India is running a Nuclear missile program on the scale of Minute man Project when they Installed 1000 Megaton range ICBMs..
So please stop talking of "Total annihilation".

 

[Armstrong]

@Hyperion : Mein nei Suchhh kahaa ya nahin ?

 

[Hyperion]

Tumm hamesha sach kehtay ho. Daffa karo auron ko!

@Hyperion : Mein nei Suchhh kahaa ya nahin ?

 

[Armstrong]

@Irfan Baloch : Irfan Bhai, are there any functioning nuclear facilities at Chagai or was it just a one off thing ?

And I was waiting for your reply in the G3 thread...aap ne koii ghaas hiii nahin dalliii mujhe naa cheez ko !

 

[Safriz]

Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable missile | Pakistan | DAWN.COM

Look at the picture in this news report..

 

[manojb]

Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable missile | Pakistan | DAWN.COM

Look at the picture in this news report..

Pak media is obsessed with Prithvi missile