10 captives, Over 20 soldiers, including Commanding Officer killed at Galwan border clash with China

[Figaro]

2014 analysis is not to be trusted.

What are you actually talking about? This is the most detailed stealth analysis done on the J-20 by a Western observer we have ... its not like the shaping of the J-20 (except from some small areas) has changed from then whatsoever

 

[Feng Leng]

India has the Agni missiles that can reach anywhere in China. Even if the Chinese manage to intercept a couple of them (which by itself would be an incredible feat given limited US progress in that area), many Indian warheads would still hit Chinese cities and cause hundreds of millions of casualties. Of course all of India would be destroyed by the second strike but is that something China would want to risk?

LOL Agni missiles are an elaborate Bollywood misinformation campaign. India doesn't have miniaturized warheads. At most they can put conventional warheads on a primitive ballistic missile. The proper strategy toward India is strike first and strike hard. Partition them and then relax after a job well done.

 

[Philip the Arab]

What are you actually talking about? This is the most detailed stealth analysis done on the J-20 by a Western observer we have ... its not like the shaping of the J-20 (except from some small areas) has changed from then whatsoever

Ah, I have seen that its frontal stealth is great but its stealth at angles is questionable. More than likely if this was in a vaccum it wouldn't be being searched by just one platform.

 

[maverick1977]

I dunno, J-20 has a RCS similar to a F/A-18 Hornet from what I can gather off online sources. If Chinese data link was being jammed(like Feb 2019 incident with PAF where IAF data link was jammed) there would be no data coming in and out and in theory the J-20 would be vunerable.

so much for stealth then, .. i am sure u are way off here

 

[ohmrlobalobayeh]

To be fair, I wouldn't doubt that Mig-21s with AWACS may be able to clap J-20s without AWACS if firing solution is provided to the aircraft from other sources like Su-30s.

ya the mig-21 will screw up the j-20 for sure.

1 mig-21 will take down 20 j20s

 

[Figaro]

LOL Agni missiles are an elaborate Bollywood misinformation campaign. India doesn't have miniaturized warheads. At most they can put conventional warheads on a primitive ballistic missile.

If the US fears the North Korean nuclear arsenal enough to not go to war with it, then how does China not fear the Indian nuclear arsenal, which is much more developed than the North Korean delivery systems/warheads. No country should underestimate the threat another country's nuclear arsenal poses to them.

 

[Liquidmetal]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1277012677458616321

 

[Feng Leng]

If the US fears the North Korean nuclear arsenal enough to not go to war with it, then how does China not fear the Indian nuclear arsenal, which is much more developed than the North Korean delivery systems/warheads. No country should underestimate the threat another country's nuclear arsenal poses to them.

US does not fear North Korean's nukes. Maybe South Korea does but definitely not Uncle Sam. Uncle Sam fears North Korea's neighbor!

Bollywood's Agni series missiles can do zero damage in real life because they are fictional and imaginary! India's ballistic missile technology is like Iraq in 1990.

 

[Philip the Arab]

ya the mig-21 will screw up the j-20 for sure.

1 mig-21 will take down 20 j20s

Thats not the point, I was emphasizing the importance of aerial assets like AWACS.

so much for stealth then, .. i am sure u are way off here

Its stealth is great from the front, but questionable from other angles much like the F-35.

 

[Figaro]

Ah, I have seen that its frontal stealth is great but its stealth at angles is questionable. More than likely if this was in a vaccum it wouldn't be being searched by just one platform.

Why don't you just read the abstract if you're not going to even bother reading the whole article ...

This study has explored the specular Radar Cross Section of the Chengdu J-20 prototype aircraft shaping design. Simulations using a Physical Optics simulation algorithm were performed for frequencies of 150 MHz, 600 MHz, 1.2 GHz, 3.0 GHz, 6.0 GHz, 8.0 GHz, 12.0 GHz, 16.0 GHz and 28 GHz without an absorbent coating, and for frequencies of 1.2 GHz, 3.0 GHz, 6.0 GHz, 8.0 GHz, 12.0 GHz, 16.0 GHz with an absorbent coating, covering all angular aspects of the airframe. In addition, the performance of a range of Chinese developed radar absorbers was modelled, based on a reasonable survey of unclassified Chinese research publications in the area. None of the surveyed materials were found to be suitable for use as impedance matched specular radar absorbers. Modelling has determined, that if the production J-20 retains the axisymmetric nozzles and smoothly area ruled sides, the aircraft could at best deliver robust Very Low Observable performance in the nose aspect angular sector. Conversely, if the production J-20 introduces a rectangular faceted nozzle design, and refinements to fuselage side shaping, the design would present very good potential for robust Very Low Observable performance in the S-band and above, for the nose and tail aspect angular sectors, with good performance in the beam aspect angular sector. This study has therefore established through Physical Optics simulation across nine radio-frequency bands, that no fundamental obstacles exist in the shaping design of the J-20 prototype precluding its development into a genuine Very Low Observable design.

 

[Philip the Arab]

Why don't you just read the abstract if you're not going to even bother reading the whole article ...

This study has explored the specular Radar Cross Section of the Chengdu J-20 prototype aircraft shaping design. Simulations using a Physical Optics simulation algorithm were performed for frequencies of 150 MHz, 600 MHz, 1.2 GHz, 3.0 GHz, 6.0 GHz, 8.0 GHz, 12.0 GHz, 16.0 GHz and 28 GHz without an absorbent coating, and for frequencies of 1.2 GHz, 3.0 GHz, 6.0 GHz, 8.0 GHz, 12.0 GHz, 16.0 GHz with an absorbent coating, covering all angular aspects of the airframe. In addition, the performance of a range of Chinese developed radar absorbers was modelled, based on a reasonable survey of unclassified Chinese research publications in the area. None of the surveyed materials were found to be suitable for use as impedance matched specular radar absorbers. Modelling has determined, that if the production J-20 retains the axisymmetric nozzles and smoothly area ruled sides, the aircraft could at best deliver robust Very Low Observable performance in the nose aspect angular sector. Conversely, if the production J-20 introduces a rectangular faceted nozzle design, and refinements to fuselage side shaping, the design would present very good potential for robust Very Low Observable performance in the S-band and above, for the nose and tail aspect angular sectors, with good performance in the beam aspect angular sector. This study has therefore established through Physical Optics simulation across nine radio-frequency bands, that no fundamental obstacles exist in the shaping design of the J-20 prototype precluding its development into a genuine Very Low Observable design.

https://www.businessinsider.com/3d-model-chinas-j20-stealth-fighter-strengths-weaknesses-2017-12

But as Business Insider previously reported, the J-20's design isn't fully stealth. Some angles stick out and will light up enemy radars.

However, it appears to have a low radar cross section from the forward angle, which would help its proposed air interception role.

 

[Figaro]

Thats not the point, I was emphasizing the importance of aerial assets like AWACS.


Its stealth is great from the front, but questionable from other angles much like the F-35.

You are relying on an inaccurate radar modeling that was debunked back in 2017. Why don't you look at the much more accurate RCS models provided by Dr. Kopp?

https://www.businessinsider.com/3d-model-chinas-j20-stealth-fighter-strengths-weaknesses-2017-12

But as Business Insider previously reported, the J-20's design isn't fully stealth. Some angles stick out and will light up enemy radars.

However, it appears to have a low radar cross section from the forward angle, which would help its proposed air interception role.

You got me man ... Business Insider is the source we should trust. And of course, the J-20 is an aerial-interceptor ... another theory debunked by AVIC itself.

 

[Liquidmetal]

who exactly is hemat? why is a random Pakistanis tweet important to this conversation?

Hemat is that ethereal entity that spreads wisdom and knowledge, but perhaps too wise for some as it seems to have gone over your head. Plus I liked the tweet I added it here because I wanted to, who are you mate?

 

[Figaro]

ya the mig-21 will screw up the j-20 for sure.

1 mig-21 will take down 20 j20s

@Philip the Arab seems to genuinely have misleading information here ... I don't think he is trying to troll.

 

[Philip the Arab]

@Figaro
This is what I mean by the J-20 will get clapped without assets. Its frontal RCS is way better than the rest of the aircrafts RCS much the like F-35. This scenario was copied off Quora, but it shows what I am talking about pretty much.


Let me explain: If a stealth plane, lets assume F-35, is flying directly “towards” the AWACS, then the chances of picking it up are extremely low because of the very small cross section of the plane from its frontal aspect. However, if the same plane is flying directly “away” from the AWACS, then the chances of detecting it are far greater because its cross section is much bigger from its rear aspect. So, an AWACS has to be positioned correctly in order to detect the F-35.

In real battle scenario, an AWACS will be backed up by other long-range radar equipped planes like Su-30 or F-15. Now the game turns on its head. Since the F-35 is being tracked from 2–3 aspects, and the AWACS has excellent data fusion capabilities, there is no chance that the F-35 can go undetected. Add to that Optical Sensors and Ground Radars! Almost 100% probability that the F-35 WILL be detected by the AWACS.