India left "disappointed" as US goes ahead with F-16 sale to Pakistan.

[Jungibaaz]

Their response is both natural and expected. Of course they'd respond like this, but I can't help but call it about as pathetic as it is.

 

[waz]

Dont need to disappointed about that .
Use our influence in US Congress and if that fails then kick out the US from next major defense deal for some silly reason .We are good in that .
After all these eight F 16 not gonna change anything in this region.

Please SrNair, India is not going to kick the US out of any defence deal. You need that equipment to off-set China's massive conventional superiority. Just look at the amount of cash India has paid so far for US equipment.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Technically speaking IAF is way ahead of PAF in terms of quantity and quality of planes they have. I still don't understand why they are so worried about mere 8 planes...

No one said they were worried about 8 planes changing the balance of power. But why let an oppurtunity to potentially scupper such a deal go unexplored?

If they had been succesful this is 8 fewer F-16s to face in any potential conflict, 8 fewer F-16s to have to take out.

It is the job of governments and their agencies (like the MEA) to serve the national interest, it isn't in India's national interest for Pakistan to get any offensive weaponary that will be used against it so they will do what they can when they can to resist this. Welcome to the real world.

Indian government is bitching on Twitter too.

https://twitter.com/x/status/698315845013889024

Supa Puwa India also summons US ambassador to protest this sale.

https://twitter.com/x/status/698369593140576256

What's so wrong in this? Showing some spine and asking others to explain their actions is now perceived as a weakness?

 

[salarsikander]

No one said they were worried about 8 planes changing the balance of power. But why let an oppurtunity to potentially scupper such a deal go unexplored?

If they had been succesful this is 8 fewer F-16s to face in any potential conflict, 8 fewer F-16s to have to take out.

It is the job of governments and their agencies (like the MEA) to serve the national interest, it isn't in India's national interest for Pakistan to get any offensive weaponary that will be used against it so they will do what they can when they can to resist this. Welcome to the real world.

HI,
Good Luck in coming to the reality as it always has been.

Nonethless, US will look after its interest and if they see its suitable the deal will go ahead regardless of anyones crying and moaning

 

[Abingdonboy]

Nonethless, US will look after its interest

As will all nations, this is exactly what India was doing in this situation.

 

[salarsikander]

As will all nations, this is exactly what India was doing in this situation.

Hi,

Good Luck with that

 

[Abingdonboy]

You just took the words from my mouth. I Was about to ask the same question. lol
The thing is, if some Indians think any little symbolic action a country takes towards another country India considers an ennemy( like in this case U.S/Russian weapon sale to Pakistan) is enough reason to cut/dowwngrade relations with that country, then India will have no relations whatsoever with any country. Since many ciuntries/powers will often take actions some of their allies/partners dont agree with, that doesnt in any way changes their close relationship/ties though.
An example of this is our very own close ties/partnership with China(pioneering western country responsible for making what AIIB is today/trade and investment ties etc etc), the U.S wasnt and still isnt happy with our policy vis a vis China, but that doesnt change the fact that are still each other closest allies by far in all fields one can think of. This is how mature powers behave. . India shouldnt take things personal and it should look at the big picture.

Has India downgraded its ties with any nation for these "petty" reasons?

India doesn't need to be lectured about its foreign policy, this is a nation with good relations with both Iran/UAE/Oman/Qatar and Israel, Ukraine and Russia, Russia and the US etc etc.


India knows how to look out for its interests.

 

[Abingdonboy]

The last time I heard ISIS wanted a chunky piece of your beloved India. Stop confusing Pakistan with India. ISIS is coming for India. No doubt about it.

Well how fortunate that India has a nice buffer with 200+ million friends to the West.

 

[dadeechi]

Excellent news.

This is a win-win for all the parties

US - Increases it's influence in Pakistan

Pakistan - Offsets/Negates the RAFALE procurements by India

India - US influence balancing the growing Chinese influence in Pakistan

China - Gets hands-on review of the tech.

 

[LeGenD]

Exactly, we deserved this. We should learn from the past and work for only India's agenda, not for that of US.

So Indians will decide whom US would sell its weapons to?

US offered an extremely advanced variant of F-16 to India a few years back; known as F-16IN. Your nation refused to buy them.

Now don't complain if US is selling some F-16s to Pakistan.

 

[Abingdonboy]

The republicans have always been friendly towards Pakistan. Also where did you get the idea that they will also be in power?

Well sir, this time it will be different because it will be Trump as the Republican president and his views on Pakistan are well known.

Of the 3 credible contenders for the White House (Sanders, Clinton and Trump), 2 are quite outspoken critics of Pakistan but the third (Sanders) is an unknown entitiy in this regard- foreign policy doesn't seem to be a concern for him.

I'm not saying this will translate into any change of the status quo but I wouldn't be surprised if it did, especaially witha radical like Trump at the helm and with a Republican Congress.

+ the last republican president cleared a civil nuclear deal with India.

 

[SrNair]

Please SrNair, India is not going to kick the US out of any defence deal. You need that equipment to off-set China massive conventional superiority. Just look at the amount of cash India has paid so far for US equipment.

Well our Pakistani friends in here claimed that US is paying for the efforts and sacrifices of Pakistanis in WoT .Of Course that is correct . 869 million$ or these 8 F 16s wouldnt be a big deal,when we considering the sufferings of common Pakistanis
You can assume same conclusion in ours case also .
US used their clout to create a way for our entry in to NSG and they are doing same thing in the in MTCR and also UNSC P5 seat and in return we are giving them billion$ of deals and support their cause in SCS .Nothing comes free .
Trust me our policy makers will talks a lots about our relation with US .But deep inside we wont trust them.
Will never trust them .
MTCR and other like top tables are good but not necessity .Russians are aready in there ,French are there .All they need is small convincing reply from GoI .We have money and will buy from them .
And CISMOA,LSG a lots of deal are already in there ,important for US .If we want we can pull out the plug .That is their choice .

Nope we dont need US weapons for countering Chinese . Chinese threat are mainly strategic and main concerns will be ocean region ,IOR,fortunately we have our own ship manufacturing industry .Except Poseidon there in nothing credible from US in there .And subs are the mix of French ( again a big deal),Russian (majority) and Indian.
In near future it would be mainly indigenous .
Of Course US weapons have additional advantage .But look at our inventory all those deals are just for 3 items .C17,C130J and P8i .All of them are unique cant get from other nations including Russia because they dont have .
But again in our inventory we have spare Russian systems .
US suggested two major US Companies Boeing and LM for MMRCA and at the end Rafale won.

This is a fair relation.To counter China we dont need US arms (not compulsory) .

 

[cerberus]

The republicans have always been friendly towards Pakistan. Also where did you get the idea that they will also be in power?

Dynamics are Changed Sir Republicans Always Come to Power on Conservative Sentiments of American Society
After 9/11 Republicans use Sentiment of US People to Serve Interest of US in Asia & Middle East.
Let Trump Aside Every American Republican Presidential Candidate is Shifted to Negative after OBL incident not only them But US Media & Public Sentiments and US is a Democracy and It Will be Bounded by Compulsion

PS:Republicans Will we will come back to it Sir on Final Results

 

[Abingdonboy]

The US Government on Friday, said it had approved the sale to Pakistan of eight F-16 fighter jets built by Lockheed Martin Corp, radars and other equipment, in a deal valued at $699 million.

The Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency said it had notified lawmakers about the possible sale on Thursday.

It said the sale would improve Pakistan's capability to meet current and future security threats.

US okays sale of 8 Lockheed F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan, Pentagon says - Breaking News - Jerusalem Post

U.S. okays sale of 8 Lockheed F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan -Pentagon

U.S. okays sale of eight Lockheed F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan: Pentagon| Reuters

From what I understand this is not the final barrier, this is the US State department/White House's clearance but now the deal progresses to the Congress. There is a seperation from the executive in the US and arms deals can't be pushed through by the Government alone, now the Congress will take this issue.

And there seems to be some turbulence coming on this front:

"I do not plan to support the expenditure of the very limited Foreign Military Financing (FMF) account to finance this deal, now or in the future," Senator Bob Corker, Chairman of the powerful Senate Committee on Foreign Relations said in a letter to Kerry on February 9.


---
"I reiterate my present hold on the release of funds via CN 15-319. I may reconsider my blanket hold on US FMF assistance should the Pakistanis make progress on addressing my significant concerns about their support for the Haqqani network. But but for now if they wish to purchase this military equipment, they will do so without a subsidy from the American taxpayer," Mr Corker, a Republican party member, told Mr Kerry in his letter.
---

"The Administration's proposed sale of eight new F-16 combat aircraft to Pakistan raises substantial concerns," Congressman Matt Salmon, Chairman of the Asia and Pacific Subcommittee of the House Foreign Affairs Committee told US President Barack Obama in a letter dated February 10.


----
"As several other Members of Congress and numerous independent experts have argued, providing such a significant upgrade to Pakistan's offensive military capabilities is extremely problematic in light of the Pakistani military's widely alleged complicity in terrorist violence, as well as the potential for the Pakistani military to use these F-16s to deliver nuclear weapons in a conflict scenario with India. I strongly urge the Administration to reconsider the sale," Mr Salmon, another Republican leader, wrote.
The State Department today notified the Congress of its determination to sell eight F-16s to Pakistan.
------

"Given that the United States has already supplied Pakistan with over USD 30 billion in foreign assistance from FY2002-FY2016 and Pakistan still has not changed its behaviour in any significant way, it is unconvincing that giving Pakistan more taxpayer dollars to finance the purchase of F-16s will somehow break that trend," they wrote.

"Pakistan has the ability to become an integral partner in the international community and be part of the solution on ending terrorism and the instability that plagues the region. Until that time comes, however, we urge you not to use taxpayer money to finance the sale of F-16s to Pakistan," Mr Poe and Gabbard said.



"The Pakistani and Taliban-linked terrorist group Jaish-e-Mohammed, listed by the US government since 2001 as a designated foreign terrorist organisation, is believed to be behind the recent attack on India's Pathankot Air Force base, which killed seven Indian nationals," Ms Gabbard and Mr Poe said

"On February 3, Hafiz Saeed, one of the masterminds of the 2008 Mumbai terrorist attacks in which six US citizens were killed, called for additional attacks against India.
Despite being designated as a terrorist organisation by the United Nations, a USD10 million bounty on his head by the US government and pleas from India to rein in Saeed, he remains free," they argued.

------


The Congress has 30 days' time to act on the proposal. In case of any objection, the process would be lengthier and complicated as the proposed sale would be debated and voted in the Congress. Normally this kind of situation does not arise as in case of opposition to major arms deals, both the Congressional leaders and the administration mutually work together to arrive at consensus.

US' Proposed Sale Of F-16s To Pakistan Likely To Face Resistance



It is progress for Pakistan's quest to get these birds but it isn't a definitive yes and it's pretty premature to be talking about delivery schedules just yet.

 

[Ankit Kumar]

So Indians will decide whom US would sell its weapons to?

US offered an extremely advanced variant of F-16 to India a few years back; known as F-16IN. Your nation refused to buy them.

Now don't complain if US is selling some F-16s to Pakistan.

The problem I have here is that , US calls India an strategic ally. (1)
It expects India to stand up for US activities in SCS (2)
Yet does every thing against their own " Strategic Ally ".

If they drop the usage of term " Strategic Ally " when referring to India, I will delete all my comments here regarding this. Simple