Something I have to make clear

[Chinese-Dragon]

Note : all these being said , we definitely are NOT sad or angry about oil's money . our concern is that we are looking for someone to trust (if you get my point )

Well you are one of the most pro-Indian members on this forum, so maybe ask India?

Geopolitics is not about friendship, it is based on interests, if you can help us further our interests then we can help you by continuing to buy the majority of your oil exports.

Oil is getting very cheap now (Saudi says they won't cut production even if oil falls to $20 a barrel), I'm sure you could find plenty of other buyers if you want.

 

[Daneshmand]

Well you are one of the most pro-Indian members on this forum, so maybe ask India?

Geopolitics is not about friendship, it is based on interests, if you can help us further our interests then we can help you by continuing to buy the majority of your oil exports.

Oil is getting very cheap now (Saudi says they won't cut production even if oil falls to $20 a barrel), I'm sure you could find plenty of other buyers if you want.

That is true. Relationships between big powers are based on national interests. India is not in the same position to provide strategic cover to Iran as China is.

Oil and gas are finite reserves. If you think the price of oil and gas are going to remain low forever, then you live in lala-land. Saudis are a puppet of US, and if China wants to keep its energy security hostage to an American puppet, while it plays strategic zero sum games of high stake variety, in China sea with US navy, then be our guest.

Not to mention the fact that Iran is the only Muslim power opposing Sunni extremism in middle east (specially of pan-Turkic variety) while China itself has a serious Sunni extremistism problem with a pan-Turkic flavor in its western provinces. The question is not whether Iran will find another oil importer. The question is whether you will find a partner that can guarantee your energy needs when US controls almost all the world's energy choke points! So good luck with that.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

That is true. Relationships between big powers are based on national interests. India is not in the same position to provide strategic cover to Iran as China is.

Oil and gas are finite reserves. If you think the price of oil and gas are going to remain low forever, then you live in lala-land. Saudis are a puppet of US, and if China wants to keep its energy security hostage to an American puppet, while it plays strategic zero sum games of high stake variety, in China sea with US navy, then be our guest.

Not to mention the fact that Iran is the only Muslim power opposing Sunni extremism in middle east (specially of pan-Turkic variety) while China itself has a serious Sunni extremistism problem with a pan-Turkic flavor in its western provinces. The question is not whether Iran will find another oil importer. The question is whether you will find a partner that can guarantee your energy needs when US controls almost all the world's energy choke points! So good luck with that.

We have a strong relationship with almost all of the major oil suppliers on the planet, not just in Russia/Venezuela/Gulf countries/African countries etc but also with Saudi Arabia:

Is the U.S. Losing Saudi Arabia to China? | Daniel Wagner

Which makes sense because we have the highest energy consumption on the planet, they want to sell their oil and we are the biggest customer.

The question is whether you will find a partner that can guarantee your energy needs when US controls almost all the world's energy choke points! So good luck with that.

We are already the 4th largest oil producer on Earth, we produce more oil than Iran:

List of countries by oil production - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And more importantly, we have by far the largest Shale gas reserves out of any country in the world. According to the World Bank we only import 10% of our energy usage, nearly the lowest among all the major countries, and that number can fall very quickly once we are determined to start using our own internal energy sources, which as of now are being saved for a rainy day.

Our Shale gas reserves alone are enough to last thousands of years:

List of countries by recoverable shale gas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Our energy security is something we take very seriously, that's why we only import around 10% of our total energy usage, and that's why we are pushing so hard for alternative and renewable energy (currently we invest the most in renewable energy out of any country).

In Geopolitics you can only really rely on your own power and your own capabilities.

 

[yavar]

I know some Iranian members are still feeling pissed as China for owing Iran money for the oil.
.

is not only the oil money .
passing united nation security council sanction on Iran and voting in favor of it / fully cooperating with united state of legal sanction passed by us congress .

eating Iran money on join military project nd cancelling then one sided

++++++++++



so that some of reason why we look at China just as same way we look at Russia

Iran the Secret History Noor Cruise Missile

The Secret History of Iran Noor cruise missile and how Iran manage to build it by itself and upgrade it and how Chinese cheated Iran by cancelling the joint project one sided and eating Iran money . the ex CIA officer explain how Iran manage to finish the project and bypass sanction and make 5 times better cruise missile called Noor which has much more capabilities than the Chinese type



more nonesense
you do not even know the history and many fool like you think China is Iran friend or Iranians look at China as friend

do you know how much money China owe us money which is NOT paying only on oil payment ?? can you tell us how many times China eated Iran money in past 36 years ??

Well you are one of the most pro-Indian members on this forum, so maybe ask India?
.

is not only him which is pro Indian .
i think you been sleep
look at thread below and you will find out the Iranian establishment is more pro Indian then China

Iran and India relation Banking oil gas culture economy

 

[Daneshmand]

We have a strong relationship with almost all of the major oil suppliers on the planet, not just in Russia/Venezuela/Gulf countries/African countries etc but also with Saudi Arabia:

Is the U.S. Losing Saudi Arabia to China? | Daniel Wagner

Which makes sense because we have the highest energy consumption on the planet, they want to sell their oil and we are the biggest customer.



We are already the 4th largest oil producer on Earth, we produce more oil than Iran:

List of countries by oil production - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And more importantly, we have by far the largest Shale gas reserves out of any country in the world. According to the World Bank we only import 10% of our energy usage, nearly the lowest among all the major countries, and that number can fall very quickly once we are determined to start using our own internal energy sources, which as of now are being saved for a rainy day.

Our Shale gas reserves alone are enough to last thousands of years:

List of countries by recoverable shale gas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Our energy security is something we take very seriously, that's why we only import around 10% of our total energy usage, and that's why we are pushing so hard for alternative and renewable energy (currently we invest the most in renewable energy out of any country).

In Geopolitics you can only really rely on your own power and your own capabilities.

Good for you.

is not only him which is pro Indian .
i think you been sleep
look at thread below and you will find out the Iranian establishment is more pro Indian then China

Iran and India relation Banking oil gas culture economy

Iranian establishment is independent. It is neither pro-India nor pro-China. Iran has no strategic understanding with any major power, currently. If Iran has been able to live without US, then what makes you think Iranian establishment needs to be pro-India to survive.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

is not only the oil money .
passing united nation security council sanction on Iran and voting in favor of it / fully cooperating with united state of legal sanction passed by us congress .

eating Iran money on join military project nd cancelling then one sided

++++++++++



so that some of reason why we look at China just as same way we look at Russia

Iran the Secret History Noor Cruise Missile

The Secret History of Iran Noor cruise missile and how Iran manage to build it by itself and upgrade it and how Chinese cheated Iran by cancelling the joint project one sided and eating Iran money . the ex CIA officer explain how Iran manage to finish the project and bypass sanction and make 5 times better cruise missile called Noor which has much more capabilities than the Chinese type



more nonesense
you do not even know the history and many fool like you think China is Iran friend or Iranians look at China as friend

do you know how much money China owe us money which is NOT paying only on oil payment ?? can you tell us how many times China eated Iran money in past 36 years ??

Then stop selling us oil. Problem solved.

We currently buy the majority of Iranian oil (more than all other countries combined), but I'm sure you can find other customers, especially now that oil is so incredibly cheap and the price is being pushed down every day.

Our most reliable oil seller is Russia (number 1 oil producer) and Venezuela (largest oil reserves in the world), not to mention the Gulf countries who have already promised to provide oil at a discount to any country that reduces oil purchases from Iran. Oh and the African countries as well who are our strong partners. Not to mention our partners in SE Asia.

And let's not forget that China is currently the 4th largest oil producer in the world, we produce more oil than Iran.

And we have by far the largest Shale gas reserves in the world, enough to last thousands of years. Hell we could go from only importing 10% of our energy usage today, to one day returning to the status of being an energy exporter, like we were before the 1980's.

is not only him which is pro Indian .
i think you been sleep
look at thread below and you will find out the Iranian establishment is more pro Indian then China

Iran and India relation Banking oil gas culture economy

Then I wish you the best of luck with India.

Of course they don't import even a fraction of the oil China imports (China alone buys the majority of Iranian oil exports), but friendship is worth more than money right?

China is reducing our energy imports anyway, which is one of the reasons why the oil price is falling across the world. One day we aim to be completely energy independent, using our enormous Shale gas reserves and renewable energy sources. Until then, Russia/Venezuela/Gulf countries/African countries/SE Asian countries can provide more than enough, at cheap prices too.

 

[haman10]

Then stop selling us oil. Problem solved.

We currently buy the majority of Iranian oil (more than all other countries combined), but I'm sure you can find other customers, especially now that oil is so incredibly cheap and the price is being pushed down every day.

Our most reliable oil seller is Russia (number 1 oil producer) and Venezuela (largest oil reserves in the world), not to mention the Gulf countries who have already promised to provide oil at a discount to any country that reduces oil purchases from Iran. Oh and the African countries as well who are our strong partners. Not to mention our partners in SE Asia.

And let's not forget that China is currently the 4th largest oil producer in the world, we produce more oil than Iran.

And we have by far the largest Shale gas reserves in the world, enough to last thousands of years. Hell we could go from only importing 10% of our energy usage today, to one day returning to the status of being an energy exporter, like we were before the 1980's.



Then I wish you the best of luck with India.

Of course they don't import even a fraction of the oil China imports (China alone buys the majority of Iranian oil exports), but friendship is worth more than money right?

China is reducing our energy imports anyway, which is one of the reasons why the oil price is falling across the world. One day we aim to be completely energy independent, using our enormous Shale gas reserves and renewable energy sources. Until then, Russia/Venezuela/Gulf countries/African countries/SE Asian countries can provide more than enough, at cheap prices too.

Lol , whats up with the attitude ?

So you're problem is with me being "pro-indian" ? if thats the case , Iran has an independent foreign policy Tnx to God . Iran is allies to both pakistan and india in case you did NOT know . we really don't care what you think , iran will follow its cordial relations with india and is really interested in establishing an Strategic relationship with China . But if in any sort , you're not comfortable with iran-india having relations , its completely YOUR problem and actually no one here in iran gives a shyte .

BTW , i'm no way "pro-indian" , i promote friendship with everyone from chinese to indians and others . I am and i'll always be "Pro-Iran" . my agenda is clear .

Then stop selling us oil. Problem solved.

We currently buy the majority of Iranian oil (more than all other countries combined), but I'm sure you can find other customers, especially now that oil is so incredibly cheap and the price is being pushed down every day.

Our most reliable oil seller is Russia (number 1 oil producer) and Venezuela (largest oil reserves in the world), not to mention the Gulf countries who have already promised to provide oil at a discount to any country that reduces oil purchases from Iran. Oh and the African countries as well who are our strong partners.

And let's not forget that China is currently the 4th largest oil producer in the world, we produce more oil than Iran.

And we have by far the largest Shale gas reserves in the world, enough to last thousands of years. Hell we could go from only importing 10% of our energy usage today, to one day returning to the status of being an energy exporter, like we were before the 1980's.

Like @Daneshmand said , Good for china mate

This thread's intention was sth else , you ruined it and it was really un-called for .

in that sense , no one gets to play with iran . US did , and is currently getting spanked in its policies in the ME region and to less extent Latin america and africa .

I noticed you mentioned Venezuela at some point . venezuela will choose iran over anyone at a matter of seconds .

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

best thing China could do for Iran is support Iran's positions @ UN, as China is a permanent member on UNSC

many areas for mutual cooperation especially in areas like counter terrorism, coming to an agreement on Afghanistan strategy etc.

with energy - the sanctions cant be ignored so some new sanction proof method would have to be made

 

[black-hawk_101]

May be a way to sell F-7s with upgrade plan for better Air Defence?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Lol , whats up with the attitude ?

So you're problem is with me being "pro-indian" ? if thats the case , Iran has an independent foreign policy Tnx to God . Iran is allies to both pakistan and india in case you did NOT know . we really don't care what you think , iran will follow its cordial relations with india and is really interested in establishing an Strategic relationship with China . But if in any sort , you're not comfortable with iran-india having relations , its completely YOUR problem and actually no one here in iran gives a shyte .

BTW , i'm no way "pro-indian" , i promote friendship with everyone from chinese to indians and others . I am and i'll always be "Pro-Iran" . my agenda is clear .

Like @Daneshmand said , Good for china mate

This thread's intention was sth else , you ruined it and it was really un-called for .

in that sense , no one gets to play with iran . US did , and is currently getting spanked in its policies in the ME region and to less extent Latin america and africa .

I noticed you mentioned Venezuela at some point . venezuela will choose iran over anyone at a matter of seconds .

Like I said, it's all about interests. Iran eventually broke down and accepted America's deal right?

We'll buy oil from anyone who can sell it cheaply, and the entire world is currently jumping over each other to sell oil at lower prices. Saudi already said they will NOT cut production even if oil falls to $20 a barrel, oil is going to be cheaper than the barrel itself.

It is the sellers who are desperate to sell their oil now.

The world is moving away from oil, that's why demand is falling across the globe, and that's why the oil price is falling. Renewable energy, Shale gas, Shale oil, etc. are pushing it irrevocably in that direction.

But anyway, I'm sure your "friendship" with India will be able to make up for the majority of Iranian oil exports that are currently being bought by China. Of course, India's economy is nowhere near strong enough to buy that much oil from Iran, and don't forget the Indian PM was just hugging Obama and getting nuclear cooperation from the USA a short while ago.

Also, global opinion polls show that Indians are amongst the most pro-American people on the planet. If you think they'll give up America for Iran, then try and see how your "friendship" goes.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

May be a way to sell F-7s with upgrade plan for better Air Defence?

energy commerce is one thing....military sales to Iran would be a red line crossed, the West and their Arab allies in the region would raise hell over it and it would bring 'negative' attention 24/7 to China. Chinese tend to be very cautious on such things. Russians however due to isolation may be the ones more inclined to sell air defence equipment to Iran - though they bowed down to western pressure and cancelled the S-300 deal, maybe they are regretting that now

 

[haman10]

Like I said, it's all about interests. Iran eventually broke down and accepted America's deal right?

We'll buy oil from anyone who can sell it cheaply, and the entire world is currently jumping over each other to sell oil at lower prices. Saudi already said they will NOT cut production even if oil falls to $20 a barrel, oil is going to be cheaper than the barrel itself.

It is the sellers who are desperate to sell their oil now.

The world is moving away from oil, that's why demand is falling across the globe, and that's why the oil price is falling. Renewable energy, Shale gas, Shale oil, etc. are pushing it irrevocably in that direction.

But anyway, I'm sure "friendship" with India will be able to make up for the majority of Iranian oil exports that are currently being bought by China. Of course, India's economy is nowhere near strong enough to buy that much oil from Iran, and don't forget the Indian PM was just hugging Obama and getting nuclear cooperation from the USA a short while ago.

Also, global opinion polls show that Indians are amongst the most pro-American people on the planet. If you think they'll give up America for Iran, then try and see.

Oh , so thats whats wrong here

I was actually wondering whats wrong with you and whats with the sudden change of behavior

your problem is with Iran having relations with india

as i said before mate , our foreign policies are 100% independent , if we wanted to get lectures from a country like china on how and who to have relations with , we would not make a revolution in the first place

Even if india was actually bhutan (just replace the 2 countries in your mind) and china wanted to lecture iran and make us break up with bhutan , our reaction would have been the same : showing the middle finger with all due respect .

The world is moving away from oil, that's why demand is falling across the globe, and that's why the oil price is falling.

World is moving away from oil ? lol you're kidding right ?

IF you are talking about fall of demands some years ago , it was for World-wide economic recession . not using "renewable" energy

anyway , we are also moving away from oil-based economy so don't you worry about iran

we also have lots and lots of buyers , china is just one of them

Iran eventually broke down and accepted America's deal right?

NO :O what ? We are the ones who broke down ?

Do you know anything about the short-term deal that was made ?

US intention : Stopping uranium enrichment and fuel-cycle .

Iran : Fvck you !

^ that was the deal in short

 

[yavar]

they'll give up America for Iran, then try and see how your "friendship" goes.

Asia Pacific Policy of U.S by 2018 will come to play .
this is when the thing start hitting the fan .

what goes around comes around .

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Oh , so thats whats wrong here

I was actually wondering whats wrong with you and whats with the sudden change of behavior

your problem is with Iran having relations with india

as i said before mate , our foreign policies are 100% independent , if we wanted to get lectures from a country like china on how and who to have relations with , we would not make a revolution in the first place

Even if india was actually bhutan (just replace the 2 countries in your mind) and china wanted to lecture iran and make us break up with bhutan , our reaction would have been the same : showing the middle finger with all due respect .


World is moving away from oil ? lol you're kidding right ?

IF you are talking about fall of demands some years ago , it was for World-wide economic recession . not using "renewable" energy

anyway , we are also moving away from oil-based economy so don't you worry about iran

we also have lots and lots of buyers , china is just one of them



NO :O what ? We are the ones who broke down ?

Do you know anything about the short-term deal that was made ?

US intention : Stopping uranium enrichment and fuel-cycle .

Iran : Fvck you !

^ that was the deal in short

Whatever relations Iran has with any other country (including the deal they made with America) are their own business, I have no special hatred for India, but I do see your love for India that has gotten you in arguments with many Pakistanis on here.

Unfortunately for you they love America (and Israel), go and check the polls, Indian people love America more than anyone else in Asia apart from maybe the Philippines. And see their PM hugging Obama like he is the last guy on Earth.

Regardless, they do not have the capability to make up for Chinese oil purchases, their entire economy is smaller than our currency reserves alone.

Anyway, to answer your original question, I think China has done more than enough for Iran.

- We buy the majority of Iranian oil exports (more than the rest combined) despite all the sanctions and threats from the West

- We blocked plenty of sanctions (and watered down others) against Iran in the UNSC, even though we didn't have to.

- We vetoed the Syria resolution, despite multiple threats and warnings from America/Europe and NATO. What does Syria have to do with us?

- We provided investment and technology when no other country wanted to touch Iran

Now, what has Iran done for China?

- Sell us oil? That's not a political favor, that is business, and you didn't even give us a discount on it.

And oil is cheap now, Russia/Latin America/Middle East/SE Asia/Africa are all jumping over each other to sell us oil at even cheaper prices than ever before. We just did a trillion dollar energy deal with Russia despite Western sanctions.

I'm not sure what else you expect from us? We have given you plenty of political cover and buy the majority of your oil exports even though you are not giving us anything in return?

 

[haman10]

Whatever relations Iran has with any other country (including the deal they made with America) are their own business, I have no special hatred for India, but I do see your love for India that has gotten you in arguments with many Pakistanis on here.

Unfortunately for you they love America (and Israel), go and check the polls, Indian people love America more than anyone else in Asia apart from maybe the Philippines. And see their PM hugging Obama like he is the last guy on Earth.

Regardless, they do not have the capability to make up for Chinese oil purchases, their entire economy is smaller than our currency reserves alone.

Anyway, to answer your original question, I think China has done more than enough for Iran.

- We buy the majority of Iranian oil exports (more than the rest combined) despite all the sanctions and threats from the West

- We blocked plenty of sanctions (and watered down others) against Iran in the UNSC, even though we didn't have to.

- We vetoed the Syria resolution, despite multiple threats and warnings from America/Europe and NATO. What does Syria have to do with us?

- We provided investment and technology when no other country wanted to touch Iran

Now, what has Iran done for China?

- Sell us oil? That's not a political favor, that is business, and you didn't even give us a discount on it.

And oil is cheap now, Russia/Latin America/Middle East/SE Asia/Africa are all jumping over each other to sell us oil at even cheaper prices than ever before. We just did a trillion dollar energy deal with Russia despite Western sanctions.

I'm not sure what else you expect from us? We have given you plenty of political cover and buy the majority of your oil exports even though you are not giving us anything in return?

Now this is the kind of post , which although against iran , i really appreciate .

Talking with reasoning is much better than talking none-sense off-topic like iran-india relations .

now one by one :

I do see your love for India that has gotten you in arguments with many Pakistanis on here.

Not true .

Once again , i'm a nationalist . i don't actually give a shizzam about anyone but Iran . Being a nationalist , i want my country to have cordial relations with everyone that includes Muslim pakistan , Hindu india , china .

I don't love anyone but My own country and being friends with Indians has never ever been a topic of discussion with pakistanis themselves . Cause its no one's business and they respect that .

our only - and i really mean only- fight with pakistanis is security matters . nothing else .

Unfortunately for you they love America (and Israel), go and check the polls, Indian people love America more than anyone else in Asia apart from maybe the Philippines. And see their PM hugging Obama like he is the last guy on Earth.

Everyones entitled to their opinion that includes the indians .

No hard feelings here .

We buy the majority of Iranian oil exports (more than the rest combined) despite all the sanctions and threats from the West

True , but be sure that not a favor from china .

1- Switching from one oil exporter to another one is not as easy as you might think . @Serpentine probably knows more about this .

2- Iran's oil is relatively cheap compared to its quality

3- China has actually reduced its imports by a huge quantity

We blocked plenty of sanctions (and watered down others) against Iran in the UNSC, even though we didn't have to.

What do you mean we didn't have to ? No one is making anyone to do anything here . its the definition of being "Allies" . either you are friends with iran or not .

You should make up your mind .

What does Syria have to do with us?

lol , you really think that decision has anything to do with iran ?

Dude , syria and iran are literally the last wall between you and NATO + US

don't you feel their breath ?

We provided investment and technology

You never take any step which endangers your national security and interests .

be sure about that .

I'm not sure what else you expect from us? We have given you plenty of political cover even though you are not giving us anything in return?

Iran gives you security

If iran goes down , China and Russia go down with it .

Have you see the map ?

This is no joke mate if for a second you just assume you're strong enough and you're safe , you'll have the same fate as Soviet union .

They were an infinite power , yet they fvked up .

Also , economic interests . Iran is a HUGE market for sometimes Sub-standard Chinese goods

====================================================

These all said , we're not unappreciative people . We appreciate all you support throughout the rough times . But we also think that these supports were not done as a favor but as a tool to enhance the national security of china and they were on par with your national interests .

All these discussions were made on how to Promote the ties and make it strategic rather than just "friendly" .

but you started to go off-topic and ruined it .

Good job