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PAF air marshal test flew the euro fighter

the current fighters on order, F-16, JF-17, and J-10, should be sufficient for the PAF for at least 10 years. i'm sure the paf is already planning to obtain stealth fighters. perhaps, they could even skip a generation and move onto stealth UCAV's.
 
PAF will only get EF or Rafale is if it cancels the Block-52+...for the rest it will stick to JF-17 & FC-20 regardless. Personally I don't think anyone is in the mood to pay penalty fees and begin negotiations for even more expensive aircraft. There might have been a chance for EF had Turkey taken up the EADS offer, but that has passed.
 
Having said all of this, if the PAF were really interested in a European fighter, the Gripen would be the most likely and realistic choice.

Gripen uses too many US parts and any likely sactions placed on pakistan by the US will also effect the Gripen deal.
 
$123 mil a plane? in the eurofighter's official website the cost is shown as being less than that of rafale, f-15 and f-18. the actual figure isnt shown, but a bar graph is shown comparing costs. check it out

Eurofighter Typhoon - Affordable Air Dominance

Indeed the graph shows that EF is cheaper then all of the rest except of the F-16 but what about the weapons induction and logistics support?
 
I am sure with some enhancements the JF-17 can match the EF somewhat.

matching 'somewhat' isnt good enough. if that was the case, who needs EF or Rafale. Put 6 R-77s on a MiG-21 bison and it can 'somewhat' match a EF. they'll both be able to engage targets at the same range, the Mig-21 actually has a higher top speed. then why isnt anyone going for Mig-21s?
 
I hope India does not go for the f-16's it will be a very big issue for us cuz seems as if anything we can possibley still get more f-16's although they wont be the advanced versions as of the deal laid out for india but it will be something a balance in some case perhaps anyhow we can not afford aircraft like ef for sure nor to tell u the truth any other aircraft in that range and all good things come with a heavy price tag.I guess we just have to wait and see wat india does i might be wrong but to my knowledge they were more in to the f-18's then anything but with them u never know.If they dont go for the f-16's then we should try to get much f-16's as possible while Mr.Bush is still house and also try to look at the grippen and raffele again that all depends on the india issue its hard to say right now wat is going to happen so lets wait to and see but over all for now just now i think the jf-17 and the few j-10's will do the job also with the few f-16's soon to arrive anyhow these are just my thoughts i might be wrong thought i share !!!!! its just amazing how the United States plays everyone double crossing all the time!! :azn::pakistan:
 
I hope India does not go for the f-16's it will be a very big issue for us cuz seems as if anything we can possibley still get more f-16's although they wont be the advanced versions as of the deal laid out for india but it will be something a balance in some case perhaps anyhow we can not afford aircraft like ef for sure nor to tell u the truth any other aircraft in that range and all good things come with a heavy price tag.I guess we just have to wait and see wat india does i might be wrong but to my knowledge they were more in to the f-18's then anything but with them u never know.If they dont go for the f-16's then we should try to get much f-16's as possible while Mr.Bush is still house and also try to look at the grippen and raffele again that all depends on the india issue its hard to say right now wat is going to happen so lets wait to and see but over all for now just now i think the jf-17 and the few j-10's will do the job also with the few f-16's soon to arrive anyhow these are just my thoughts i might be wrong thought i share !!!!! its just amazing how the United States plays everyone double crossing all the time!! :azn::pakistan:

india prefers f-18 since f-18 will be in US inventory for much longer than F-16, and offers everything F-16 offers plus more in terms of capability.


And about US, its not double crossing, its choosing national interest. its what every country does.
 
matching 'somewhat' isnt good enough. if that was the case, who needs EF or Rafale. Put 6 R-77s on a MiG-21 bison and it can 'somewhat' match a EF. they'll both be able to engage targets at the same range, the Mig-21 actually has a higher top speed. then why isnt anyone going for Mig-21s?

I think the point is slightly different. Yes the Typhoon is $120 million a pop. However there are very similar technologies (as those integrated in the typhoon) available on aircraft priced much less. Now I am not comparing the DASS EW suite of the Typhoon to anything on the JF-17 or the limited supercruise type capability of the former with the conventional propulsion of the latter, however weapons suit and self protection capabilities available on one happen to be quite similar as those on the other.

Now you can take all day talk about a cheap Chinese data bus vs. something made by a German or an Italian firm which happens to be more expensive (thus the cost of $120 million), the difference in the JF-17 and the Typhoon, or the blk 52 with Typhoon is not like a 3rd Gen to 5th gen split. The difference is somewhere in the middle. There are very many things that would be integrated on the JF-17 which happen to be on the Typhoon so you can draw some comparisons but knowing so that JF-17 was never intended to play in the market where Typhoon is playing (actually its a loner in this market, even Rafale is a distant 2nd in terms of price etc.)

I would be the first to admit that comparing the two on line by line basis is a no go proposition..however overall the two (like any other aircraft on the market barring F/A-22) can be compared in terms of the MR capabilities of the two.
 
I hope India does not go for the f-16's it will be a very big issue for us cuz seems as if anything we can possibley still get more f-16's although they wont be the advanced versions as of the deal laid out for india but it will be something a balance in some case perhaps anyhow we can not afford aircraft like ef for sure nor to tell u the truth any other aircraft in that range and all good things come with a heavy price tag.I guess we just have to wait and see wat india does i might be wrong but to my knowledge they were more in to the f-18's then anything but with them u never know.If they dont go for the f-16's then we should try to get much f-16's as possible while Mr.Bush is still house and also try to look at the grippen and raffele again that all depends on the india issue its hard to say right now wat is going to happen so lets wait to and see but over all for now just now i think the jf-17 and the few j-10's will do the job also with the few f-16's soon to arrive anyhow these are just my thoughts i might be wrong thought i share !!!!! its just amazing how the United States plays everyone double crossing all the time!! :azn::pakistan:

As far as the American products are concerned, I have a feeling that the Indians are a lot more wary of the F-16 from a purely strategic point of view because the PAF has more experience with the platform. The only way they will consider the F-16IN is if it is different from the PAF models. I'm guessing that they'll also prefer their variant be similar to what the Israelis fly because IAF pilots more than likely have access to Israeli training facilities which have made their pilots highly competent with the Sufas.

There are also reports that the IAF pilots who have participated in exercises with Singapore, and USAF in prior exercises weren't very happy with the F-16's performance as an adversary. The F-16IN would be required to compensate for these listed shortcomings too.

The biggest factor however what is keeping the F-16IN in the race is the per unit cost, aftermarket parts availability, high level of ToT and the ability to integrate training with the Israeli Air force.

Boeing's F-18 is touted to be superior to the F-16 on most fronts, it is also a twin engined aircraft (an initial top rated priority for the IAF). With the Russian deals with the Gorshkov having gone sour thereby eliminating any possible future carrier deals with them and the US's willingness to avail the catapult system for future Indian indigenous carriers may give Boeing a slight lead because they can always offer the carrier versions (including the Growler) to the IN which would reduce the maintenance overheads. Boeing also has the ability to offer other incentives on the civil aviation front in terms of ToT and industrial investments which will certainly have an impact. The biggest drawback however is that the per-unit cost of the F-18 is bound to be much higher and the training program will be US-dependent and not with IAF's close ally Israel. I don't know what the level of ToT will be for this aircraft, but given that the F-16 is at the end of it's lifespan, the assumption is that LM can offer a much larger magnitude of ToT.

Having said all of this, Dassault still has a very strong chance given the novelty of the Rafale, the IAF's support of the Mirage2000, France's willingness to offer ToT, current infrastructure and Snecma's offer to help develop and then integrate the Kaveri engine into the Indian Rafale. Also, the IN will be given the option to purchase the Rafale-M for the carriers in the future.
 
I think the point is slightly different. Yes the Typhoon is $120 million a pop. However there are very similar technologies (as those integrated in the typhoon) available on aircraft priced much less. Now I am not comparing the DASS EW suite of the Typhoon to anything on the JF-17 or the limited supercruise type capability of the former with the conventional propulsion of the latter, however weapons suit and self protection capabilities available on one happen to be quite similar as those on the other.

Now you can take all day talk about a cheap Chinese data bus vs. something made by a German or an Italian firm which happens to be more expensive (thus the cost of $120 million), the difference in the JF-17 and the Typhoon, or the blk 52 with Typhoon is not like a 3rd Gen to 5th gen split. The difference is somewhere in the middle. There are very many things that would be integrated on the JF-17 which happen to be on the Typhoon so you can draw some comparisons but knowing so that JF-17 was never intended to play in the market where Typhoon is playing (actually its a loner in this market, even Rafale is a distant 2nd in terms of price etc.)

I would be the first to admit that comparing the two on line by line basis is a no go proposition..however overall the two (like any other aircraft on the market barring F/A-22) can be compared in terms of the MR capabilities of the two.

IMO the JF-17 and the Eurofighter are two aircrafts designed and built for very different purposes. True, they are both fighters and subsequently share the same operational objectives, but attempting to draw comparisons here will be difficult not because one is superior to the other, but rather because they are akin to apples and oranges.

The JF-17 is a low cost fighter designed to be a force multiplier for air forces with low budgets, while the Typhoon is designed to be a front line fighter designed for air forces with deeper pockets who operate on technical superiority at the expense of lesser numbers.

Within each category, the JF-17 and the Typhoon are both excellent options.

IMHO aircrafts should be graded by how well they serve their intended purpose as opposed to the more common habit of simply comparing different models.
 
My friend forward to to me:
read this in an artical in a magzine and took this pic from that artical its blurd but it was our air marshal
the reason its blurd is that i took this pic from my ****ty cell phone
in the magzine it was pretty good.
(Any one has info plz post)
Its Conformed.

Over RAF Conningsby - England
November 1, 2006

Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed becomes the first Pakistani to fly in the Eurofighter.
 
PAF will only get EF or Rafale is if it cancels the Block-52+...for the rest it will stick to JF-17 & FC-20 regardless. Personally I don't think anyone is in the mood to pay penalty fees and begin negotiations for even more expensive aircraft. There might have been a chance for EF had Turkey taken up the EADS offer, but that has passed.

Is Turkey getting the F-35s instead?
 

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