Z-10 or T-129 Atak or AH-1Z for the Pakistan Army?

[SekrutYakhni]

You are talking as If Pakistan won't see a future light so arm itself While pointing all World as enemy excluding China. Have you ever check Pakistani weapon arsenal and realize How many Western strategic products Pakistan ordered in near past and keep negotiating for likely future collaborations ? I don't think that Pakistan has a concern for arm embargo since Noone can guarantee that China won't fall into difficult situation to supply arms to allies in that 21. century benefit games. The biggest problem to export T129 Atak to Pakistan is about USA permission for LHTEC engines and its spare parts to Pakistan. As far as I know Turkey is busy with taking permission for Pakistan and other friend/brother states like Azerbaijan but USA is also willing to export their similar platforms to Pakistan. Rest of the products on Atak and their service guarantees and spare parts and trainings are about Turkey's responsibility.

Ohh...I thought Turkey scammer was a very advanced country....Buy parts from USA, Europe and fit them together....That too using their expertise

Thai babe!!!

 

[cabatli_53]

I don't have any idea What you are talking about with pointing 1. pilot cabin dude... Anyway;

State of art Aselsan AVCI Helmet which got technological prize in Turkey.

5 T129 Atak marching towards real operation areas of Turkey against PKK.

Instagram

 

[T-123456]

Ohh...I thought Turkey scammer was a very advanced country....Buy parts from USA, Europe and fit them together....That too using their expertise

Thai babe!!!

You ok in the head?

 

[Irfan Baloch]

You ok in the head?

try T-129 and test it on him to show us how effective it is in pest control

 

[T-123456]

try T-129 and test it on him to show us how effective it is in pest control

Nah,we couldnt do that to an old women(avatar).

 

[SekrutYakhni]

You ok in the head?

No Thai babe. My head bangs itself on the fake booty.

 

[cabatli_53]

Five T129 Atak is in their bases in Malatya.

 

[cabatli_53]

 

[fatman17]

for immediate needs it looks like PAA leaning towards Mi-35M helos.
for the mid-term to replace the older Cobras (delivered in 1984) the PAA may opt for the Z-10 (no 3rd party permissions required)
for the long-term the T-129 could be a good buy with ToT.

 

[cabatli_53]

 

[cabatli_53]

Atak over Istanbul and Erzurum

 

[Peshawar Khan]

T-129 is better choice as there will be technology transfer so Pak and Turkey joint venture to upgrade T129 later and make it better that viper,

 

[CHI RULES]

AH-1Z viper is a combo package with Helfire-II can match any future procurements of India, similarly for lighter attack role Pak should get WZ-10 due to following reasons.
1. Pak even in case of sanctions may keep AH1Z active as done in case of Super Cobras of Iran along with other US jets of Shah era.
2.Wz10 has no strings attached unlike T129, may evaluate in future as per Pak feedback also much cheaper than rivals.

 

[Zhukov]

There is lots and lots of debate going on regarding new attack helicopters for Pakistan army aviation replacing its inventory of bell AH1 cobra which is really becoming a pain to maintain in its current age of lifespan.

Possible contenders that are surfacing are Mil Mi 35 for COIN ops and a competition between CAIC-Z10 from China, TAI T129 Atak from turkey a variant of Italian Augusta Westland A129 Mangusta and the formidable American Bell AH1-Z Viper also termed as Zulu.

While it is a tough decision to take up a choice because every deal have its potential perks and flaws.

AH1Z is undoubtedly the best among them second to none in attack choppers with its armaments avionics and performance equalling AH64 Apache. But AH1Z will come with strings attached without any TOT and at a much higher cost to maintain and armaments. Though the finances will be arranged by US defence Aid But still other equipment can be purchased from that 1 billion $ quota.

T129 Atak comes with a robust western avionics and armaments set and will come with TOT. Plus Turkey agrees to provide Atak system with TOT at favorable financial terms. Atak is probably the best option available to Pakistan viz viz performance TOT and resources. But Atak uses american engine and hence this is a major problem in TOT and subject to american clearance for sale to Pakistan.

While Chinese Z10 is technically inferior to the above 2. But still it is a very potent chopper with great potential of growth as we all the rapid advancements in Chinese defense industry. Also Z10 can come with 100% TOT like JF-17. It will come with premature Chinese avionics and weapons systems. though this platform is long way from being matured but it will eventually be there.

While Russian offer of Mil mi35 is an attack helicopter and not a modern day Gunship. It is primarily for COIN ops and thus does not fall in this category. If Russia offers Mil mi 28 havoc , that might be considered.

But the best way forward for this Gunship deal can be a mixture of the above option.
Chinese claim that Z10 is a modular design and is compatible with western avionics. Pakistan should Look for its own customized version of Z10 such as F10.
Assembly line of Z10 should be installed in Kamra. And we should use the Turkish avionics suit used in Atak like the millimeter radar , HMS and other sub systems . Buying liscence production from turkey and converting the AH1Z deal to only armaments and subsystems and possibly American Engines for F10. Modifying Z10 for our needs into F10 so that it can be used both with Western, Chinese and local built armaments. And it will not be the first case for Pakistan for modifying Chinese Weapons with western subsystems

I believe this option will be more complex and costly but this is the best way forward.

So what will be best suitable option for Pakistan army aviation

1-Bell AH1-Z Viper
2-TAI T129 Atak
3-CAIC Z10
4-PAC F10

 

[CHI RULES]

PA won't go for T129 unless Turkey can make it 100% indigenous. PA can't take the risk of arm embargo during conflict. China is more Logistics friendly in war time, we will not compromise under pressure. Helicopter is vulnerable against firepower from ground, so quantity matters the most.

Pakistan won't go for T129 as Z10 is also much capable attack helo with stealth features and low noise. It is already tested in Rwp/Isl area with positive results. In future with more powerful indigenous engines and further upgrades shall be able to challenge any modern attack helo.

In near future Turkey can't produce indigenous engine because producing engines is a complicated and long term process. Being a nato member even if Turkey gets permission from USA for Pak, they may not be able to provide engines or parts to Pak in case of war with India.

In the past during and after 1971 war China openly helped Pakistan specially in case of PAF, having much better past record and even having independent economy so China can and will provide weapons to Pak in case of sanctions in any future war. As Russia is helping militarily to both Syria and Iran.

Now after 46 billion dollars agreements being signed by China with Pakistan the cooperation in defense sector is inevitable between two countries.