Yom Kippur War 1973: The Egyptian Revenge

[Malik Alashter]

Sadat moved third army (I guess) to the west to keep it for emergency situation. He thought USA would intervene directly with Israel. Noting that he was very suspicious from USA navies build up near Egyptian waters. So he was keen to keep reserve forces for unexpected scenarios. But Alshathly strongly opposed this. Nevertheless, it seems that Alshathli's view was the right one though.

how about his order to occupy the straits without the coverage of the air defense how can someone solve it.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

how about his order to occupy the straits without the coverage of the air defense how can someone solve it.

Air deffene systems were already covering the strait until Israeli Army got into west bank with tanks and destroyed some of Egyptian sam-2+3+6 which made a gap in the coverage, that allowed IAF to strike egyptian land forces. IAF wouldn't dare to attack Egyptians if the air defense systems weren't got destroyed.

 

[nwmalik]

But dont forget
egypt was fighting both USA and Israel, victory was not possible
you were able to get early gains until uncle Sam joined the war fully.
Still egypt did well in the war.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

But dont forget
egypt was fighting both USA and Israel, victory was not possible
you were able to get early gains until uncle Sam joined the war fully.
Still egypt did well in the war.

All of us are proud of them.

 

[500]

October the 14th 1973, complete Egyptian air superiority, Israel lost 90 fighter jets, Egypt none.

Next time you invent stories, make them at least a bit relable, not complete joke.

Israeli Air-to-Air Victories in 1973

But dont forget
egypt was fighting both USA and Israel, victory was not possible
you were able to get early gains until uncle Sam joined the war fully.
Still egypt did well in the war.

There was no any USA. Tiny Israel was fighting alone against Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Morocco...

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

Next time you invent stories, make them at least a bit relable, not complete joke.

Israeli Air-to-Air Victories in 1973


There was no any USA. Tiny Israel was fighting alone against Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Morocco...

Actually 102 Israeli jets were shot down in the whole war not 90. I hope you get your info from unbiased sources. If I get my info from Arabic Wiki, it would be a totally different story.
Yom Kippur War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
[URL="http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf"]http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf[/URL]

 

[Banglar Lathial]

Nobody denied that initially Egypt was in an advantageous position. An Egyptian spy played for an Israeli double agent in a very good way which allowed Egypt to go for pre-emptive strike. Israel would have been occupied by Egypt if not for American help.

However, by American help or otherwise, tide was turned at the end and Israel recaptured Sinai as well as some territories on the west side of Suez. Prior to the ceasefire, Israel had captured some territories in west side of Suez, Egypt had also captured some territories on the Sinai peninsula. In the end, it could be said that it was status quo anti bellum. (with Sinai belonging to Israel). However, considering the fact that Egypt's man and material loss was several times higher than Israel's and Israel captured the Suez canal, the military victory was for Israel, not Egypt.



At present, I'm afraid the status quo is highly in Israel's favour. Israel's highly advanced nuclear and biological program means it can wipe out all Arab countries if it wishes to, in a matter of hours. Dolphin submarines gives Israel a second-strike capability as well. Had it not been for the fear of the "islamic bomb", Greater Israel would have already been established. The process of taking out Pakistan's nukes is underway, and when it is completed, we will see the dramatic territorial expansion of Israel from Egypt to Iraq, with KSA, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria reduced in size or wiped out.

Compared to Egypt, Israel's air force is vastly superior. The major handicap of Egypt is that it has no BvR capability on its F 16s. These F 16s would be taken out by Israel by BvR and Egyptian F 16s won't even have the ability to lock on outside range.

The recent NATO attack on Libya means Egypt would be attacked from TWO fronts now, from the east by Israel and from the West by NATO (from Libya), in addition to naval blockade in the Mediterranean. Unfortunately, there is very little chance of Egypt surviving when Israel decides to initiate the great war.

Most of the information you provided is wrong and the rest of your prognosis regarding the future is likely to be wrong as well but the future is always uncertain and only Allah (SWT) knows best what the future holds. If you think it's Pakistani nuclear bombs that is holding "Israel" back, you are sadly mistaken, though. One threat from America forced Pakistan to allow Americans and NATO to invade and kill Afghans by the millions, possibly, and cause unspeakable damage which continues to this day. Drone attacks continues, Pakistani air defence is pretty much non-existent so American helicopters can sneak in any time, and they killed 24 or so Pakistani soldiers openly without any repercussion.

At least Iranian gov't and North Korean gov't openly say that Americans are evil and that Americans should leave Afghanistan immediately (read any Iranian gov't newspaper or North Korean gov't newspaper to find out those govt viewpoints). Pakistan is not even strong enough to say that openly, how can you say that "Israel" is holding back because of Pakistan? What is the basis for this highly illogical claim?

In reality, "Israel"s supplier, donor, cash-cow America itself is not strong enough to eliminate the entire Arab world and Middle Eastern militaries alone, by conventional warfare alone at once. The Arab world's major problems are internal lack of unity, lack of Islamic belief (all Arab wars against "Israel" or even by Saddam Hussein against America were led by secular regimes that in fact suppressed and worked against all sorts of genuine Islamic movements, for example). Saudi kingdom itself supports the devil Americans' dollar, or currency, as the benchmark for setting SR exchange rate (same as other Gulf Arab countries except Kuwait). All these Arab rulers are aligned with Americans because they are not Islamic at all, nor are their regimes. Their support of American dollar is one of the major reasons that American dollar maintains its position as the "reserve currency" even though there is no logical basis for such a distinction.

All those factors are not closely related to the Egyptian massive victory in the 1973 Ramadan or October war. You are wrong that "Israel" re-occupied Sinai in 1973, they could not move either the Egyptian 2nd or the 3rd Army one inch from the areas captured by Egyptians since 6th of October, 1973 in Sinai.

Their propaganda stunts about moving few military assets west of the canal were simply propaganda. It's like claiming Bangladeshis have surrounded all Western capitals (including Washington DC, London, Paris, Berlin, Rome, etc) and are about to capture them any moment now because there are a few thousand (or more) Bangladeshis in each of those capitals at the moment! The first and most basic requirement to continue any conventional war for any sustained period of time is to maintain supplies (of all sorts), which is maintained via supply lines.

For the same reason that Bangladesh (or any other country) can not claim that all Western capitals are about to be captured by Bangladeshi (or some other nations) but those Western nations are spared by the good will of the Bangladeshis (or other nations), "Israeli" propaganda stunt about cutting of Egyptian 3rd army is propaganda and nothing more.

Some Zionist quoted Saad El Shazly but Saad El Shazly also says Egypt won the war. Any extended war is bound to contain so many events that lengthy discussions, expositions, explanations become necessary, I have no time or intention of going that route, which is why I avoid it, but if there are any knowledgeable Egyptian/Arab/Muslim/other member on this matter, they can show you lots of videos (not "recreated" videos but actual ones during the war), pictures, maps, charts, and quote from actual commanders on the ground regarding the exact locations, nature of attacks and counterattacks etc etc.

If you eliminate Zionist propaganda from Zionist veterans' narratives (like Ariel Sharon the criminal's narratives), you can understand easily that Zionists were terribly defeated in that war which is why they not only gave up Sinai but Americans were up in arms, why American resupplied them so much and still could not turn the tide of the war that the Jewish Kissinger warned Anwar Sadat that liquidating the few propaganda stuntsmen from "Israel" west of the Suez Canal would make Americans intervene directly with troops and so on. American "equipment" lost once already, and Americans "could not allow" the same experience of defeat against Soviet weapons to happen again. Egypt was in quite a politically inconvenient position because only a few months (or maybe a year) back, Sadat had expelled all Soviet advisers, so the Soviets were never as forthcoming on their political aid to Egypt (like threatening to call any American "bluffs", if any, for example).

You need to read lots and lots of books, and volumes could be written about 1973 or any other war for that matter. One of the "first casualties" of any war is the "truth", so if you take all your information from Western/Zionist media and propaganda sources, you are going to be misled.

 

[500]

Actually 102 Israeli jets were shot down in the whole war not 90. I hope you get your info from unbiased sources. If I get my info from Arabic Wiki, it would be a totally different story.
Yom Kippur War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
[URL="http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf"]http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf[/URL]

Thats true, but virtually all of them were shot down by SAMs.

Egypt lost 235 jets and Syria - 135, virtually all of them in air combat.

 

[500]

Egyptian massive victory in the 1973 Ramadan or October war.

*Facepalm* Commander of Egyptian army admits defeat, but you still call it a great victory. What a joke.

 

[Banglar Lathial]

Actually 102 Israeli jets were shot down in the whole war not 90. I hope you get your info from unbiased sources. If I get my info from Arabic Wiki, it would be a totally different story.
Yom Kippur War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
[URL="http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf"]http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB98/octwar-56.pdf[/URL]

I do not believe the Zionist propaganda that only 102 "Israeli" jets were shot down in 1973. Just like there is no reason to believe American gov't provided casualty figures in their illegal terroristic invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, for example, or the African Union official casualty figures in Somalia, as another example. There is actually a lot of proof that totally falsifies all those bogus American and African Union "official casualty figures", and the same way, you can understand that the Zionists actually lost a lot more soldiers and equipment.

Their official number of casualties was 2000 or 2200 (something like that), but Ariel Sharon the criminal himself admits that he was so scared and struck by Egyptian soldiers and that on one night alone, Sharon's brigade (if I remember correctly) lost more than 300 soldiers and more than 1000 others were wounded. Imagine, that on one night alone, and only from Sharon's brigade, if 300+ soldiers are killed and more than 1000 wounded, how many Zionists were killed during the entire war across all sectors and on both fronts?

Usually, "modern" Western/Zionist official casualty figures need to be multiplied by 10 to 12 times, to arrive at a safe estimate of the actual number of casualties.

Another clue. If "Israel" actually lost only 102 aircrafts on both fronts during the entire war, do you think they would have needed American resupplies (of aircrafts) as early as 14th of October, 1973 or earlier when most "Israeli" leaders including Moshe Dayan (I still find his facial expressions at the time of that war very funny, because they were so afraid and shocked) were in disbelief at the swift Egyptian and Syrian/other combined thrust?

*Facepalm* Commander of Egyptian army admits defeat, but you still call it a great victory. What a joke.

Are you talking of Zionists? Saad El Din Shazly said it was a massive Egyptian victory and critized Sadat for not liquidating the Zionost propaganda stuntsment west of the canal which Egypt could easily do to make the Egyptian triumph more emphatic. Sadat did not take that route because Jewish Kissinger warned that Americans weapons lost against Soviet weapons in "modern times" once already and America "can not allow" that to happen again.

Let me find Saad El Din Shazly's quote that Egypt won.

Here (an American website, from a country that has always been a good servant of Zionism).
Saad El-Shazly

"It was a victory, the most outstanding feat of Arab armies in modern times."
The Economist


This brilliant military victory, was turned into a political defeat, when Egypt was removed from the camp of resistance, to Israeli occupation of Arab lands to the camp of appeasement.

Saad El Din Shazly criticizes Sadat's decision to make peace with "Israel" (which most Egyptians, Arabs and Muslims also criticize and those that support the agreement also said it was never a genuine peace but only a "cold peace"/temporary stoppage in war for Egyptians and Arabs to strengthen their economy etc).

Thank you.

 

[500]

Saad El Din Shazly said it was a massive Egyptian victory and critized Sadat for not liquidating the Zionost propaganda stuntsment west of the canal which Egypt could easily do to make the Egyptian triumph more emphatic.

Seems you really believe in fairy tales you invent. Here what Shazly really wrote:

25 Oct 1100 hours: A meeting of the Armed Forces Supreme Council, the first since the outbreak of war. ...The main topic was, of course, how to open the road to Third Army. But though everyone spoke with passion, nobody could come up with a realistic plan.

...the plight of Third Army was desperate... It was a catastrophe

Super great victory, indeed.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

I do not believe the Zionist propaganda that only 102 "Israeli" jets were shot down in 1973. Just like there is no reason to believe American gov't provided casualty figures in their illegal terroristic invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, for example, or the African Union official casualty figures in Somalia, as another example. There is actually a lot of proof that totally falsifies all those bogus American and African Union "official casualty figures", and the same way, you can understand that the Zionists actually lost a lot more soldiers and equipment.

Their official number of casualties was 2000 or 2200 (something like that), but Ariel Sharon the criminal himself admits that he was so scared and struck by Egyptian soldiers and that on one night alone, Sharon's brigade (if I remember correctly) lost more than 300 soldiers and more than 1000 others were wounded. Imagine, that on one night alone, and only from Sharon's brigade, if 300+ soldiers are killed and more than 1000 wounded, how many Zionists were killed during the entire war across all sectors and on both fronts?

Usually, "modern" Western/Zionist official casualty figures need to be multiplied by 10 to 12 times, to arrive at a safe estimate of the actual number of casualties.

Another clue. If "Israel" actually lost only 102 aircrafts on both fronts during the entire war, do you think they would have needed American resupplies (of aircrafts) as early as 14th of October, 1973 or earlier when most "Israeli" leaders including Moshe Dayan (I still find his facial expressions at the time of that war very funny, because they were so afraid and shocked) were in disbelief at the swift Egyptian and Syrian/other combined thrust?



Are you talking of Zionists? Saad El Din Shazly said it was a massive Egyptian victory and critized Sadat for not liquidating the Zionost propaganda stuntsment west of the canal which Egypt could easily do to make the Egyptian triumph more emphatic. Sadat did not take that route because Jewish Kissinger warned that Americans weapons lost against Soviet weapons in "modern times" once already and America "can not allow" that to happen again.

Let me find Saad El Din Shazly's quote that Egypt won.

So, where should people get the true story? Both sides exagerate, and even Syria annually celebrates 1973 "victory" although it was a very clear defeat to Syrian Army. I believe that neither Egypt nor Israel were defeated in that war in fighting terms but wars get measured by achieving its goals and Egypt got what they want while Israel got nothing but lost Sinai.

 

[Farhad Hassan]

But dont forget
egypt was fighting both USA and Israel, victory was not possible
you were able to get early gains until uncle Sam joined the war fully.
Still egypt did well in the war.

Umm my dear proud Muslims, Egypt AND Russia were fighting Israel AND USA, if you want to take it like that.

 

[Farhad Hassan]

And guys seriously, Arabs lost that war BADLY, and I must say they deserved it. I have read Israeli history. I know what Jews have done in last 60 or so years wasn't so good as well. They diverted even from the real Zionist goal. Which was actually a secular idea. But oh well Muslims deserved when they ruled and they lost it when they deserved it no longer. It was justice imho. Otherwise there was the time of Umar ibn al khattab and Saladin when they conquered Jerusalem WITH the help of Jews against Christians. And it was during time that there was actual piece in the Israel with all communities living peacefully and WHEN the Muslims started prosecuting the Jews and Christians there (I am not saying what the Crusaders did was right, it was even worse) that was the time Muslims should have and actually did lose Jerusalem.

 

[Major Shaitan Singh]

IF US supplied Weapons to Israeli the Soviet too supplied weapon too.... but the Egyptian choose wrong person to trust.... I heard that Russian Pilot flew MiG for Egyptian, they could have gained more.