Yemen: Talks Collapse Over Houthi Demands

[Frogman]

Talks on new Yemeni goverment collapse over Shi'ite Houthi subsidy demands
BY MOHAMMED GHOBARI

SANAA Sun Aug 24, 2014 12:29pm BST

(Reuters) - Talks on forming a new Yemeni government collapsed on Sunday over demands by Shi'ite Muslim Houthis to restore fuel subsidies cut by President Abd-Rabbu Mansour Hadi, officials said, and further demonstrations in the capital Sanaa were expected.

The Houthis, who have been fighting for years for more power for their Zaydi Shi'ite Muslim sect in north Yemen, have massed tens of thousands of supporters on the outskirts of Sanaa to press the government to quit and to restore fuel subsidies.

The government offered on Saturday to resign within a month to pave the way for a technocrat administration that would review the fuel subsidy issue, but officials said the Houthis had demanded an immediate reinstatement of the subsidies.

The standoff has raised fears for the stability of Yemen, a majority Sunni Muslim country of 25 million that is allied with the United States and borders major oil exporter Saudi Arabia.

The government blamed the Houthis for the failure of talks.

"The Houthis have reneged on all previous understandings, including joining a new government and an offer to reduce the price of oil products, at the first government meeting," Abdel Malek al-Mekhlafi, a spokesman for the government committee assigned to negotiate with the Houthis, told Reuters.

"They have threatened to escalate (their protests) if the decision to raise fuel prices is not cancelled," he added.

Daifallah al-Shami, a leader of the Houthi group, made clear the demand for reinstating fuel subsidies was non-negotiable for his side and said the peaceful protests would continue.

"(Reversing the increase in fuel prices) is a popular demand and cannot be abandoned," Shami told Reuters. "No other issues can be discussed."



MORE RALLIES PLANNED

Rival demonstrations are scheduled to take place in Sanaa later on Sunday, one by Houthi loyalists and one by supporters of President Hadi, but residents said they did not expect the two to come into contact with each other.

Hadi has put the army on a state of heightened alert to tackle any resort to violence during the Sanaa demonstrations.

The Houthis have been emboldened by recent military gains against rival Sunni Muslim tribesmen and allied government troops north of the capital.

In a report on their website on Sunday, the Houthis said that one of their members had been killed and three wounded in an attack by Sunni Islamist gunmen on one of their offices in eastern Sanaa on Saturday.

The al-Qaeda-affiliated Ansar al-Sharia said in messages posted on social media that two of its members had been killed in the incident.

Yemen's Gulf neighbours and Western partners, which helped the country stave off civil war in 2011, have watched the dispute between Sanaa and the Houthis with mounting concern.

Last week, they urged the Houthis to stop trying to gain territory by force and to engage in a political transition process.

The government's decision last month to raise fuel prices was part of efforts to rein in its budget deficit and helped the impoverished Arab state to conclude talks on a $560 million (337.9 million pounds) loan from the International Monetary Fund (IMF)..

Last year, it spent about $3 billion on the fuel subsidies, nearly a third of all state revenues.

The Houthis, whose protests began last Monday, have pitched tents on a road leading to the airport near to key ministries. Their protests have tapped into wider public anger among Yemenis over the subsidy cuts.

A previous attempt to cut subsidies, in 2005, led to unrest in which about 20 people were killed and more than 200 wounded. The reform was cancelled.

Talks on new Yemeni goverment collapse over Shi'ite Houthi subsidy demands| Reuters

 

[HAIDER]

Democracy is best and quick solution. Fail to understand why so much love to dictatorship in arab world. Its people who don't deserve this freedom of thought or its ruling families. ?

 

[Frogman]

Democracy is best and quick solution. Fail to understand why so much love to dictatorship in arab world. Its people who don't deserve this freedom of thought or its ruling families. ?

What I think a lot of people misunderstand in the Muslim and Arab world is that the introduction of democracy will radically change our societies, it wont.

Democracy is only a mechanism by which representatives or the people are elected, now the problem is that the Arab and Muslim world have not adopted liberal ideas and as a result the same actions we see in nations run by dictatorships will occur in nations that have only adopted elections as a means of providing a government. These governments will continue to rule by decree rather than consensus (as dictators do) and will ignore or persecute minorities just as much as the current regimes do, however, they will argue they are the legitimate and democratically elected representatives of the nation, to them (them being Islamists and conservative/partially secular politicians which dominate the political arena in these nations) democracy is only a tool to be used to achieve political office, they will laud it when it grants them the power they require and will just as easily damn it if it does not (for example some Islamists denounce democracy as Kufr yet will use it if it means gaining power).

The Arab and Muslim world needs a liberal democracy and not just the mechanism, that will only happen when the societies themselves adopt liberal ideas and values (separation of powers, rule of law, seperation of Church and state,civil rights, freedom of speech and press etc.).

 

[Falcon29]

@Frogman

For me I see that we must resolve all these conflicts(including the I/P conflict) before we can think of changing our society. Right now, everyone has their own perspective on society. Most of it is rooted into Arab culture or tribal culture.

I don't see how the Arab world could change any time soon regarding the authoritarian culture/approach. Liberties are another issue, if anything I doubt our leaders care about our liberties. They prefer even lead a non-politicized secular lifestyle but want to retain authoritarian privileges.

 

[al-Hasani]

Time to carpet bomb the few minority Houthi sect members once and for all and level their mountains to the ground. Those rascals are not representing the Zaydi Muslims who are otherwise wonderful people that are extremely close to Sunni Muslims especially of the Shafi'i fiqh which is the predominant fiqh of Yemen.

Might as well take AQAP with them in the process.

Oh, Yemen has a pretty long history with democracy in the ME and Southern Yemen is to this day still the only Muslim country that willingly elected communist leaders. I don't consider imposed Soviet communism on Albanians, Kazakhs, Turks, Kyrgyz, Azeris and Uzbeks for chosen.

Anyway at least the protests are peaceful so no big deal. A solution should be found but that Houthi sect really need to get removed first as they don't represent the Zaydi's at all. Just like AQAP are not representing the Sunnis of Yemen.

What I think a lot of people misunderstand in the Muslim and Arab world is that the introduction of democracy will radically change our societies, it wont.

Democracy is only a mechanism by which representatives or the people are represented, now the problem is that the Arab and Muslim world have not adopted liberal ideas and as a result the same actions we see in nations run by dictatorships will occur in nations that have only adopted elections as a means of providing a government. These governments will continue to rule by decree rather than consensus (as dictators do) and will ignore or persecute minorities just as much as the current regimes do, however, they will argue they are the legitimate and democratically elected representatives of the nation, to them (them being Islamists and conservative/partially secular politicians which dominate the political arena in these nations) democracy is only a tool to be used to achieve political office, they will laud it when it grants them the power they require and will just as easily damn it if it does not (for example some Islamists denounce democracy as Kufr yet will use it if it means gaining power).

The Arab and Muslim world needs a liberal democracy and not just the mechanism, that will only happen when the societies themselves adopt liberal ideas and values (separation of powers, rule of law, seperation of Church and state,civil rights, freedom of speech and press etc.).

We need to embrace the Mu'tazila fiqh, bro and liberal conservatism at the same time. This will be the solution.

 

[Falcon29]

Time to carpet bomb the few minority Houthi sect members once and for all and level their mountains to the ground.

No need for these comments.

 

[al-Hasani]

No need for these comments.

I am of the opinion that both the Houthis and AQAP need to be carpet bombed as this will solve most of Yemen's political problems. Once this happens the attention towards the economy and other issues can be prioritized. How can a people in a constant state of conflict and political disunity progress? It's almost impossible. Especially a country of some 26-28 million people (by now) of which 75% or so are under the age of 27 if I recall.

Yemen as one of the most ancient civilizations on earth and a beautiful country with lovely people and talented people deserve much, much better. Yemen has a lot of potential yet for those well-known reasons its hard if not impossible to turn them into a reality. The Yemeni diaspora is successful everywhere they are. They are the oldest Muslim community in the UK, have given dozens of presidents and prime ministers in South East Asia and are among the leading businessmen in the Arab world, South East Asia, Swahili coastline as a diaspora.

You as a Palestinian know what wars, conflicts, political disunity etc. can do of damage to a people and country.

Iraq or Syria will never progress for real ether before all those terrorist groups, militias, dictators etc. are gone. Once that happens people can focus on what really matters.

Same in Libya.

 

[Falcon29]

I am of the opinion that both the Houthis and AQAP need to be carpet bombed as this will solve most of Yemen's political problems. Once this happens the attention towards the economy and other issues can be prioritized. How can a people in a constant state of conflict and political disunity progress? It's almost impossible. Especially a country of some 26-28 million people (by now) of which 75% or so are under the age of 27 if I recall.

Yemen as one of the most ancient civilizations on earth and a beautiful country with lovely people and talented people deserve much, much better. Yemen has a lot of potential yet for those well-known reasons its hard if not impossible to turn them into a reality. The Yemeni diaspora is successful everywhere they are. They are the oldest Muslim community in the UK, have given dozens of presidents and prime ministers in South East Asia and are among the leading businessmen in the Arab world, South East Asia, Swahili coastline as a diaspora.

You as a Palestinian know what wars, conflicts, political disunity etc. can do of damage to a people and country.

Iraq or Syria will never progress for real ether before all those terrorist groups, militias, dictators etc. are gone. Once that happens people can focus on what really matters.

Same in Libya.

And then you look at their families and beautiful children. Violence isn't worth it internally. Stability doesn't seem to help in the Arab world. It is management of resources which we need to focus on. It is sad that some of these once great nations are poor today. But, it seems much of our Arab world is becoming this way.

Now after the refugee crisis due to Syria/Iraq prices are sky-high in Jordan and elsewhere. I don't want to sound weird, although if it keeps staying this way we may need to change our whole economic/social approach. It's funny, but the way ISIS for example is managing resources/general welfare for people may be how some portions of our nations will become. The areas that are prone to instability/lack of development need to adopt new means for the well being of the people.

For us Palestinians, disunity is a problem when you have a cause to struggle for. For people without a cause it is also a problem but in different ways. Times of crisis for us unite us. Times of crisis in internal affairs seem to only fuel the fire in our region.

I fear the political disunity in Iraq and areas of 'Sham' are too great for us to bear. If we manage one crisis at a time and interconnect the gulf world with this 'Sham' I think we can benefit. This requires real consensus which no legislators/political bodies in the Arab world put forth.

 

[al-Hasani]

The main worry for the average Iraqi, Syrian, Yemeni, Palestinian, Iranian, Afghan, Pakistani etc. and dozens of other Muslims of today is how to survive the next day and how to provide for ones children. They don't even have time to discuss all that we discuss. For them it does not matter who rules them, what political party etc. Their life is not going to change much due to this unless those huge changes occur.

You never start building a house without a solid fundament. If you attempt to do so it often falls apart in the process. What I am saying is that something as crucial as security and political stability are a MOST for countries and people to progress on all fronts. Yes for each year things get better, the average Joe gets richer etc. but it still a slow development.

Why? Because of all that nonsense.

But how can it be any different when the current generation (people born after WW1) don't know anything other than problems mostly? Aside from a few good and stable decades here and there. Goes for most of the Muslim world and the ME.

It's an unfortunate part of the MOST RECENT cultural heritage that hopefully will die out by the new generation or the next one:

Cultural heritage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's why it is so crucial to prevent this shit as soon as possible to make this process quicker.

All those militant groups, religious parties etc. don't want this process to occur but just want to stay in power. I am yet to see any real movement that can inspire people regardless of their political beliefs but unites them DESPITE of their political differences.

Where is the Martin Luther King, Nelson Mandela, Gandhi etc. of the Arab world/ME that can unite people regardless of their nationality, sect, tribe, political beliefs, social status etc.? It's always my way or the highway.

It's getting pathetic. Come on, man. The last I remember was King Faisal although if he lived in this modern era he should preferably have been more flexible in his view of non-Muslims or people who not necessarily want an Islamic solution to everything. At least he was a visionary, a man of principle that spoke his mind openly and defied the great powers whenever he felt like it. Nasser was another such person.

Where are such persons today? Either on forums, blogs or in coffee or tea houses in the Arab world. Not in the parliaments or shuras. That's for sure. Sad but true.

I want to see someone of influence/stature to stand up and speak the truth. Like what I just wrote. Hell even important clerics. That could change a lot I believe.

Of course somehow this will not happen anyway. Even if WW3 erupted before our eyes we would still be blind.

 

[Falcon29]

The main worry for the average Iraqi, Syrian, Yemeni, Palestinian etc. and dozens of other Muslims of today is how to survive the next day and how to provide for ones children. They don't even have time to discuss all that we discuss. For them it does not matter who rules them, what political party etc. Their life is not going to change much due to this unless those huge changes occur.

Very well said here. For many people I know in Gaza their main worry is the next pay check to be able to buy water. During this assault people are struggling to find water to bathe in. This is also prevalent in Syria.

I want you to look at my idea. I think the way to solve these crisis's is to be proactive as communities and take different methods. We may just need to exploit our resources without looking ahead in the future or putting forth a national budget, etc..

If you know what I mean. I'm having a hard time explaining it.

Basically dissolving our currency and trying to get to everybody what they're in need of.

If our Arab world doesn't take up the future issues facing us. Such as water resources/agriculture mainly. If we can fund these massive projects/implement them then we could have a better future.

Without this though, it will happen as I said. Keep in mind there is much competition in the region for water. I remember Israel wouldn't agree to Jordan's plan for the Dead Sea or something like that.

@al-Hasani

I know this sounds repetitive but regional projects usually need to be approved by the West/Israel. For the most part that is. So if we can't grow a spine it won't change.

 

[al-Hasani]

Very well said here. For many people I know in Gaza their main worry is the next pay check to be able to buy water. During this assault people are struggling to find water to bathe in. This is also prevalent in Syria.

I want you to look at my idea. I think the way to solve these crisis's is to be proactive as communities and take different methods. We may just need to exploit our resources without looking ahead in the future or putting forth a national budget, etc..

If you know what I mean. I'm having a hard time explaining it.

Basically dissolving our currency and trying to get to everybody what they're in need of.

If our Arab world doesn't take up the future issues facing us. Such as water resources/agriculture mainly. If we can fund these massive projects/implement them then we could have a better future.

Without this though, it will happen as I said. Keep in mind there is much competition in the region for water. I remember Israel wouldn't agree to Jordan's plan for the Dead Sea or something like that.

This goes for every country where there is poverty, misery, political, social, economic etc. problems. People in stable countries don't experience that. The worst a Saudi Arabian and Emirati can complain about is him paying a too big rent, not doing well in school, not being able to marry because of the dowry, not being able to drive his favorite car, not being able to attend the best universities or go abroad, having a tiring job etc. Aside from problems that hit all people, countries, societies. Of course there are also poor in KSA (not really in UAE among the locals for real) but they are still better of in KSA than those countries I mentioned among the poor.

That is why we powerful countries need to help the smaller ones and less fortunate ones just like we should help less fortunate people if we can help.

@Hazzy997 I want to apologize for my rant the earlier day. Of course I support Palestine and Palestinians and I am not a fan of Israel as you already know here. I might not agree with everything that Hamas is doing nor do I necessarily think that all Jews are evil or want us Arabs and Muslims bad. Regardless of you changing opinions often.

I am saying this as I believe that you are a clever young man that has the potential. You like many others in your age group are just emotional and seeing what is going on in Gaza I don't blame you.

People can say whatever they want about you but when we discuss issues like we do right now and other serious issues you always have interesting things to tell considering your age and I can feel that you really want the pest for our region which I respect and admire.

If we want to make our Arab world and even the ME as a whole better (because we don't live on a tiny island in the Pacific) we should look at the region as one body. The concept of an Ummah has been ridiculed and polluted by people but it's still valuable as ever. Prophet Muhammad (Saws) message is the correct message in this regard and undoubtedly the best one like that of other Prophets and wise people. Unfortunately we are people and are experts in screwing up.

My two cents before I depart to bed. Tired after a long day.

Take care.

PS: I can come across as a hothead sometimes but I am not really serious when I write anything here of such things. Even when I discuss with Farsis that hate Arabs and Sunni Muslims and start the provocations..It's just the effect of PDF.

 

[Falcon29]

@al-Hasani

No problem, I apologize too and know we are all concerned. Although I am obsessed concerned which is why I get very heated from time to time.

I see that it is difficult to get out of this. Which is why I read hadith, if this is the era we were told of unfortunately it won't get any better. I just hope this is as bad as it can get.

We all want a solution but they have managed pitching us against each other and we are in a bad fitnah(not just violently). It may get a little worse but it has almost reached its peak. But, I also can't be certain of that sadly.

 

[al-Hasani]

@al-Hasani

No problem, I apologize too and know we are all concerned. Although I am obsessed concerned which is why I get very heated from time to time.

I see that it is difficult to get out of this. Which is why I read hadith, if this is the era we were told of unfortunately it won't get any better. I just hope this is as bad as it can get.

We all want a solution but they have managed pitching us against each other and we are in a bad fitnah(not just violently). It may get a little worse but it has almost reached its peak. But, I also can't be certain of that sadly.

Well, that's also why I get hotheaded. I think that the situation of the region especially the recent events in Iraq and elsewhere have had a bad impact on me. I think that I have reached a point where I have had enough. I think I would have acted differently if I had no connection to the ME other than some family visits every 1-2 years for 1 month or 2. Unfortunately I have to deal with the region much more often than that on all levels.

I see you changing opinions (I did once too) as a sign of you thinking about things and analyzing them and caring about them. If you only had 1 interest (for instance soccer in Palestine) you could not change opinions at all mostly. It shows that you are engaged in what is going on which is a very good sign. Only people that really care can often change things.

All I know is that it was never like this before. I have discussed this with older people and they don't recall something like that. They just recall struggle against oppressors, colonialism, the Islamic/Arab nationalism divide (nothing like we see today) etc. They don't remember anything about sects at all.

I hear that Sunnis and Shias of Madinah used to pray side by side in the streets before 1979 and now this is rare and mostly only happens in Al-Masjid an-Nabawi where nobody ask about your sect and where everyone is just a Muslim.

I see this as something very bad.

Also why are they not closing all those idiotic channels in the Arab world and ME that are broadcasting from the UK, West or sometimes ME countries?

 

[Falcon29]

Well, that's also why I get hotheaded. I think that the situation of the region especially the recent events in Iraq and elsewhere have had a bad impact on me. I think that I have reached a point where I have had enough. I think I would have acted differently if I had no connection to the ME other than some family visits every 1-2 years for 1 month or 2. Unfortunately I have to deal with the region much more often than that on all levels.

I see you changing opinions (I did once too) as a sign of you thinking about things and analyzing them and caring about them. If you only had 1 interest (for instance soccer in Palestine) you could not change opinions at all mostly. It shows that you are engaged in what is going on which is a very good sign. Only people that really care can often change things.

All I know is that it was never like this before. I have discussed this with older people and they don't recall something like that. They just recall struggle against oppressors, colonialism, the Islamic/Arab nationalism divide (nothing like we see today) etc. They don't remember anything about sects at all.

I hear that Sunnis and Shias of Madinah used to pray side by side in the streets before 1979 and now this is rare and mostly only happens in Al-Masjid an-Nabawi where nobody ask about your sect and where everyone is just a Muslim.

I see this as something very bad.

Also why are they not closing all those idiotic channels in the Arab world and ME that are broadcasting from the UK, West or sometimes ME countries?

It is indeed depressing. But, we have to learn to deal with it as much as possible and keep struggling each day. We've reached a point where as you said the only concern is about surviving let alone thinking about development.

I never discussed this with older people. No one seems to be able to explain it with clarity. Although during friday prayers I have seen well though out khutbaahs. Most lectures these days are about the situation overseas. It helps people calm down.

I've yet to speak with someone with enough wisdom to explain the current situation and the exit strategy for it. Even during this still a good portion of our people are paying attention to music/drama. It's not the time for that.

Only time we had a situation like this was during the time of Ali(RA). We are going backwards now and that means we will start off as we first did during the Prophet(SAW)'s time. In my opinion.

 

[al-Hasani]

@Hazzy997

If you got the time then please watch this excellent documentary. It really shows the impact of revolutions, what can unite people, the everyday worries of ordinary Arabs and people of our region and what should we done, what should not and what we can learn from such events and political transformations.

It's absolutely genial that documentary. One of the best I have seen about the ME from the West. The leading person makes it this way I believe as he is a wise man.

​

Sean McAllister, The Reluctant Revolutionary (2012)

"McAllister has achieved something incredible here. The Reluctant Revolutionary is a stunningly humane portrait that shows vividly what's at stake before leaving it bloody on the Formica floor of a battered concrete building." [Cole Abaius, Film School Rejects]

An intimate portrait of Yemen as the revolution unfolds, told through the eyes of tour guide leader Kais, an intelligent commentator on the changing times in Yemen, offering poignant moments of reflection, loss, anger and hope on the unknown road to revolution. Filmed over the course of the past year we see Kais's journey from pro-President to reluctant revolutionary, joining angry protesters in the increasingly bloody streets of Sana'a.

Kais is a 35 year-old tour guide from Sana's, the Yemeni capital, struggling to make ends meet and working in his father's travel agency. He is philosophical, articulate and reflective but as the story begins he is cynical about the undercurrents of dissent in his country and supposrtive of the President.

When one of his tours has to be cut short due to the instability and increased danger for tourists, Kais returns to Sana'a to find 2 permanent camps in the city centre: one for the President and one against. Kais is adamant that protests wont solve anything, that the President is doing his best and that violence will never be used to quash the protests. At first, he refuses to enter the anti-president camp, but is convinced by sean to have a look one night. Over a number of visits we see Kais change, "I never imagined seeing rival tribes coming and sitting here in peace, without their Kalashnikovs" he declares.

As the protest camp grows from 'Change Square' to take over the surrounding streets we see that like Kais, many other people are also being converted to the movement. Kais embraces the revolution as each Friday gets bigger, and bloodier. Through his eyes, we see the events unfolding in the peace camps - the reactions to killings, defections, the President's failure to sign a peace deal - and understand what the revolution means to ordinary Yemenis. Sean shows us a revolution in the making through the eyes of ordinary Yemeni citizens, and paints a subtle picture that shows us the very root of people's discontent and their demands from the government.

Meanwhile, foreign journalists are being tracked down and sent out of the country, and soon Sean is the only remaining foreigner in his hotel.​

​

Additional reading about Yemen (short overview): You need to read hundreds of pages to get to understand the complicity and history of every historical region/country in the Arab world and most others of the world.

History of Yemen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ancient history of Yemen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Islamic history of Yemen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Modern history of Yemen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is another excellent and award-winning documentary about Yemen. It's about 15 years old so it's a good thing to watch both so one can see what has happened in the country in the past 15 years.

As partially Yemeni this will interest you I imagine if you got the time. I promise that you will not regret it.

The English guy is this one below in that 15 year old documentary:

Tim Mackintosh-Smith - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Those two documentaries will help you understand what is going on in Yemen and why.