Would Jinnah have lived as a Shia?

[Myth_buster_1]

All of this is a fact but I think if Jinnah would have been among us..there would have been no sectarianism.
And if you consider Jinnah to be just Shia not a Mulim then we people must be thankful to Shia muslims who gave us such a Great Leader.
Quaid had said clearly that this is a state where everyone would have right to live their lives according to their own teachings and their own religion.
Secondly It's not the time to discuss such topics,Its time to be united.So lets be united.We all are Pakistanis.
I say I am a Muslim,a true Pakistani.
Who else is there to say that he/she is a Muslim,a Pakistani,and don't believe in sectarianism??

Shai community has nothing to do with Jinnah, in fact he was a British product then anything else. Their is more agnostic about him then a Muslim.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

we pakistanis couldnt even solve the kashmir dispute , couldnt save east pakistan & barely holding together what is left of this nation ---- imagine the time when muslims were minorities & treated as 3rd rate citizens -- just think how this thin weak man suffering from TB politically out maneuvered all these indian/british power players -- to gain their trust , their respect & still was able to get a country for his countrymen -- if it was upto these narrow minded mullahs & indian politicians , we would be rotting somewhere under indian rule -- pakistanis as a whole is a thankless yet over emotional nation

It was a part of British exit policy to groom intellects who would serve their interests and so they did. Had Britain been reluctant to stay in India they would have slaughtered any resistance like the history tells us when Muslims Hindus and Sikhs planned war of independence which failed because of British tyranny.

 

[Redbull]

I want an Ummah too ! But it has to be a 'Buttt Sahiban Only' Ummah !

P.S I confess I'm a Pan-Islamist myself, in my own fashion, so the concept of 'We're One Nation because we're Muslims' as it is practiced in Pakistan means a lot to mean ! And if the Muslim World at large was able to adopt some form of unity (not necessarily one-state...!) then I'd be bursting with joy...perhaps a Muslim World only NATO or EU or on overarching Social Welfare Setup ! But...having said that its not going to happen in my life-time or yours young-man !

P.P.S Why the foOk do they have 'International Friendlies' ? I look forward to watching Premier League football on the weekends the whole week !

lolz, with the way liverpool are playing, I don't see why you are excited for another match so early.

Now regarding pan-Islamism, we have to be realistic, I don't see a Mahdi or any other person coming down and establishing an empire from Casablanca to Delhi----as they say--- rome wasn't built in a day.
Niether is it our duty to sit and wait for such a miracle to happen.

So what exactly is wrong with the Islamic republic, using states as a headquarters is the only thing we can do o.o....

Yes, A Muslim Union sounds great....but not a lot of countries to join with I'm afraid.... Afghans we already need to close the borders with imho and Iran will do the same because of Baloch insurgency

And all Pakistanis really shoudn't mind if it is "Buttt Sahiban" or any other people, but it has to be on merit, otherwise we know about all the other families Zardari, Shariff etc.

So yes Muslim brotherhood sounds good, but Pakistanis need to take care of their own interests first before worrying about other Muslims.

PS: Why the invisibility?

 

[Myth_buster_1]

True story, he wants an Ummah and doesn't accept the founder of Pakistan. So what's the point of having a Pakistani flag?

I will never understand these literalists, Hypocrites to the core.

The chain of events occurring in modern days (1800s-2***) is a result of prophecies. Once something has been for told by the Prophet saw then it will happen. Today Muslims are in terrible condition in terms of worldly life and spirituality which will only be revived after the arrival of Prophet Isa and mehdi.

 

[Zarvan]

Innovation? Are you claiming to know more than Iqbal? The empire and Khalifa you strive for does not exist, so is there a better alternative then an Islamic republic?




I am using the word 'secularism' as an alternative but the principles are the same. Can you justify the part in bold? From my understanding, Muslims and non-Muslims enjoyed equality and no one was given priority.

I'm glad you agree now that Jinnah did pray salaah.

Yes Sir secularism is kufr Islamic Laws are not secular and Muslims have priority in cases like running government but in other jobs and in majority jobs who ever will be competent will get the job but as main leader it will be only a Muslims and also Kafirs will not have to fight to defend the land instead they will give a Tax known as Jizya which will be used for their development and protection

 

[Agni5000]

Yes Sir secularism is kufr Islamic Laws are not secular and Muslims have priority in cases like running government but in other jobs and in majority jobs who ever will be competent will get the job but as main leader it will be only a Muslims and also Kafirs will not have to fight to defend the land instead they will give a Tax known as Jizya which will be used for their development and protection

Gone are days fighting with sward and horse. Muslims were successful because of brutality they used in war. Now it is different ball game.

 

[Zaidi 12]

*flirt mode on*

Hello ! *says in a deep, dreamy voice*



P.S Joke thaaa....!

P.P.S Jokes aside, what you, ma'am, and what Abu Z, said are exactly the line of reasoning we must follow if we are to survive. Whatever we maybe, whatever our ideological differences (within Islamic Thought) we are first and last - Muslims and we must act as such.

Good day, ma'am.

Thanks a lot

 

[ice_man]

Gone are days fighting with sward and horse. Muslims were successful because of brutality they used in war. Now it is different ball game.

brutality? i think you forgetting the crusades,the nazis or the first world war! or Ashoka! & let's not forget BAALI chahiyaay KAALI MAA ko or SAATI (burning of wife alive with dead husband)!

the world should read history to know which religion has been brutal!

 

[Zarvan]

Shai community has nothing to do with Jinnah, in fact he was a British product then anything else. Their is more agnostic about him then a Muslim.

Mr Jinnah was never agnostic yes he was born in Shia Family Isamali to be more precise but later he became pretty much a sunni

 

[Icarus]

He would have lived as a Muslim................................

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Innovation? Are you claiming to know more than Iqbal? The empire and Khalifa you strive for does not exist, so is there a better alternative then an Islamic republic?

Iqbal was a intellect poet and a politician but not a rasool or nabhi so it means their is a huge room of mistakes in him and his words can not be trusted like that of the prophets. Mirza ahmed was also a very intellect man who had memorized quran hadiths and sunnah and could use it in just about any debate meaning he had more knowledge then any of us but his arrogance led him to astray. Syed ahmed ali khan was another intellect who is a founder of modern education in Indo Muslim society, little do you know that he was a freemason! So the concept of "Islamic states" is bidah because no where in Islam = quran + Hadith + sunnah can we find this concept as a matter of fact it is highly against it.

I am using the word 'secularism' as an alternative but the principles are the same. Can you justify the part in bold? From my understanding, Muslims and non-Muslims enjoyed equality and no one was given priority.

Secularism is different like i have mentioned before which you have failed to grasp. Read about the constitution of medina in which the prophet saw established a governance system based on Islamic principles (absent in Secularism) however the minorities were allowed to practice their religion as long as it did not interfere with the government.

I'm glad you agree now that Jinnah did pray salaah.

Did i say that? no

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Mr Jinnah was never agnostic yes he was born in Shia Family Isamali to be more precise but later he became pretty much a sunni

His grand father was a hindu, his father was a Ismaili and he was born as a ismaili however he later claimed to fallow shia teachings. If he was indeed Shai then he would have a concession with all Shia on ahmadi as non muslim and as a matter of fact he not only he appointed ahmadis in high posts he refrained from declaring them non muslims.

Gone are days fighting with sward and horse. Muslims were successful because of brutality they used in war. Now it is different ball game.

How can Muslims be so brutal when they used top layer of soil "grass" = sward?

 

[ajtr]

Who is listening?

— Meher Hasan

For the past several years, all I have ever seen Shias do is risk their lives to carry out an obligation, cry for loved ones lost in a heartless, shameful terrorist attack, or beg for justice

There is no need for an introduction. You do not need to know my background. You do not need to know anything. You do not need to know whether I am Deobandi, Shia, Sunni, Wahabi, Ahmedi, Bohri or anything for that matter. Pretend I do not have a sect. Pretend you do not know me at all. I am going to get to the point right away.

Shia killings. Ooh. Controversial.

I really need to put this out there, because no one else seems to be doing it. And I know that if I get enough people to see this, maybe someone will notice yet another cry for help by a distressed human being and give the issue the attention it deserves. I am also sick of watching it in silence like the rest of this nation and not doing anything about it. I never realised how serious things had become until today.

The world is a terrible place. Shia Muslims are being killed because of their beliefs and actions. Because they exist, basically. The way they have been killed, without any reason, without any justification, might just be the only reason why I have completely lost my faith in humanity. Men. Women. People with families, homes, places to see, ambitions. Doors to unlock, lights to turn on, relatives waiting anxiously, food to eat, jobs to return to. Going back to their homes, going somewhere important to them, excited about Eid, about meeting someone they missed after several reassurances on the phone, or by post, yes, yes, I am on way, I can’t wait to see you.

Pilgrimage. Thank you so much Allah, thank you Maula Ali, thank you Bibi, these are your doings, you have blessed me and my family. I have collected money for this. I have rounded up my family in a bus and I am on my way to you.

Like a man wrenches chickens out of a cage to slaughter them. Jo haath main aajaye (whoever you can grab).

An old man was begging for his life, reciting the Kalima, “Main Musalman hoon, main Musalman hoon” (I am a Muslim, I am a Muslim). They killed him.

Women afraid of being dishonoured actually committed suicide — women who might or might not have children, little babies, teenagers.

Have you ever heard of a Shia appearing at someone’s doorstep with a gun threatening to kill him or her for his or her beliefs? I have not. Have you ever heard of a group of Shias open fire on innocent people, because of their names on the ID card? No? Me neither. Have they ever stood up and denied someone else to practice their own religion? Exactly.

For the past several years, all I have ever seen Shias do is risk their lives to carry out an obligation, cry for loved ones lost in a heartless, shameful terrorist attack, or beg for justice. Beg. So they can practice. I have not heard of Shias shoving their faith down someone’s throat, forcing someone to convert, hurting someone else intentionally whilst carrying out a procession. Never.

Imagine living in perpetual fear because of your beliefs. Even those jawans (soldiers) who brace themselves for martyrdom, who have been prepared to flaunt their Shia-ness, who seem unafraid of dying in the name of their religion, have a little bit of fear in them. Everyone does. All those tearful mothers proud of their sons attending their first procession with their fathers have fear in them. Every child reaching out a hand from the suffocating throng of people to touch the Zuljinah has fear in them. Every soldier standing at the borders of their respective countries, armed with the most sophisticated of weapons, have fear in them.

Everyone does.

But only some people manage to understand that fear. Some people don’t want to understand it, but they are forced to. Like Shias. They are aliens in their own country. Imagine. Wake up, leaders. Your own citizens are seeking asylum in another country. Why don’t they leave, then? Media is so silent about it. It is too controversial, too dangerous. No, no, tiptoe around this one. Be tactful, now, don’t say something wrong.

But you’re talking about Burma, aren’t you?

People are so clueless. If they actually knew what was going on, maybe some of the hatred and selfishness would subside and everyone would be more compassionate towards their own countrymen. Only if they knew the gory details. If they realised that they are not just ‘other people’, that they are other people with lives very similar to our own, with parents who brought them into this world, with food in their tummies and ambitions and a language to speak and a religion to follow and choices to make, weddings to attend, people to meet, a world to see.

Forget about which sect you belong to for a minute. Forget about the beliefs your parents follow, or what you believe, or what your Qari sahib (Quranic teacher) has told you. Think about it like a human being.

Life goes on.

Meanwhile, hatred for the Shia ‘kaafir’ grows stronger and stronger every day. Hopefully, they will all be wiped out from this country very soon, and everything will be okay again. Everything will be normal and fine because Shias and their existence is a problem. Once they are gone, something great will happen. Something wonderful. Everything will be normal. The goal that I am trying to achieve will be fulfilled, the goal that only I can understand, the goal that requires ultimate pitilessness. Your own view is superior to that of the rest. Something that someone might have said to you once, many, many years ago, changed your perspective and made you think, think, think, overthink too much. Thinking you are powerful, wealthy and prestigious among some people might well change their point of view too, turning them all into ruthless, mindless, heartless creatures.

Shameful.

The writer is a freelance columnist and can be reached at katakho@gmail.com

He would have lived as a Muslim................................

By which Pakistani definition of "Muslim" he would have lived as mMuslim?When people are ready to declare as kafir at the drop of a hat.You never know one moment you are a Muslim and very next moment you are declared as kafir and killed.

 

[S.M.R]

You can't generalize the whole nation. What you think when Grand Shia Clergy order the shia of all over the world ' it harm to curse or use insulting lingo against any Sahaba ' ....well if somone is doing wrongful act , then that particular individual is responsible of his act. Do you think I being a shia should be punished by a wrongful act of someone else, even I openly condemn those speakers who who use profane language against any Muslim sect icons . (These speakers are not alim, they don't have any religious decree....).......Do you think it was right when Burmese Bhudidist religious leaders order the tribes to kill Muslims, because Taliban destroy the religious icons in Bamian province in Afghanistan.....??????..

it is like if someone says "liquor" is halaal in islam" and for evidence he shows few people sitting in a 5 star hotel drinking it ghata gut.

Secularism is different like i have mentioned before which you have failed to grasp. Read about the constitution of medina in which the prophet saw established a governance system based on Islamic principles (absent in Secularism) however the minorities were allowed to practice their religion as long as it did not interfere with the government.

Did i say that? no

How many sects where there during the era of Rasool e Akram?

 

[Icarus]

By which Pakistani definition of "Muslim" he would have lived as mMuslim?When people are ready to declare as kafir at the drop of a hat.You never know one moment you are a Muslim and very next moment you are declared as kafir and killed.

Let's not generalize here, there's a vast difference between an extremist minority and the peaceful majority.