Worldview: Pakistan's chief fear: India

[Tiki Tam Tam]

You deem East Pakistan as an Indian sovereign state so your army can freely "went into" and "came out"?

If this is not a wrap, what else will be?

East Pakistan an Indian sovereign state?

Oxymoron.

If it is "East Pakistan", I don't see any mention of the word "Indian"" in these two words.

I don't blame you for your intelligence dysfunction since you are trained to believe and speak in confusion by your ''esteemed" party.

Ambiguity is your party's staple so that avenues and highways are open to flip flop when caught out!

They believe in manufacturing only falsehood, duplicity, contradiction; they both conceal and disguise themselves from themselves.

Jester indeed!

 

[Zyxius]

It is newbies who come to the forum and act like knowall, when they know fanny adams of what has happened or is happening.

Everyone, but you, knows that I was in the Army.

The Army functions on intelligence reports and even on interaction with personnel in the field. Anything new in that?

One does not have to be on the spot to know what is happening in the world. If one had to do so, then every event of the world would have to be visited and that too exactly when it is happening! Omnipresent is the English word for such a state of affairs. God alone is supposed to be omnipresent. Do you think I am God for you?


So, you are amusing and illogical and as usual, you jump to wrong and fallacious conclusion.

So what are you saying? You Indian Military Intelligence? Or RAW?

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

So what are you saying? You Indian Military Intelligence? Or RAW?

Since it appears you have no clue as to how a military operates, it is futile to waste bandwidth to teach you from the basic upward.

Suffice it to say for your comprehension that all militaries, including the Pakistan military, operates on inputs. They don't operate in a vacuum!

These inputs are given by those in charge of Intelligence, be it military or civil.

One does not have to be in the Intelligence Corps to have access to such analysed information which is called ''intelligence''.

 

[Zyxius]

Since it appears you have no clue as to how a military operates, it is futile to waste bandwidth to teach you from the basic upward.

Suffice it to say for your comprehension that all militaries, including the Pakistan military, operates on inputs. They don't operate in a vacuum!

These inputs are given by those in charge of Intelligence, be it military or civil.

One does not have to be in the Intelligence Corps to have access to such analysed information which is called ''intelligence''.

Uhhhh huhhhh.... So you are saying thay every Indian soldier is shown copies of all intelligence reports in India? And you were one of those many sepois who got a chance to see the papers on sahib's desk?

Dude....just cut the bull. We all know you're probably an Indian kid in the IT industry who spends all his time on the comp. Most of what you say doesn't even add up.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Uhhhh huhhhh.... So you are saying thay every Indian soldier is shown copies of all intelligence reports in India? And you were one of those many sepois who got a chance to see the papers on sahib's desk?

Dude....just cut the bull. We all know you're probably an Indian kid in the IT industry who spends all his time on the comp. Most of what you say doesn't even add up.

Why don't you ask your Administrators and Moderators?

Neo, Asim, Agnostic?

I am sure you will believe them.

Most of what I say does not add up for you because you are quite unlettered to understand and not quite up with your addition skills. I wish I were a kid and live once again!

Sepoys don't get Intelligence reports to read, but officers, especially of the Flag rank surely do!

 

[Zyxius]

Why don't you ask your Administrators and Moderators?

Neo, Asim, Agnostic?

I am sure you will believe them.

Hmmmm....so you got together with these 3 guys and showed them your Indian military card which also stated that you had access to intelligence?

Most of what I say does not add up for you because you are quite unlettered to understand.

Quite unlettered to understand huh? That sounds like highly lettered English to me.

Sepoys don't get Intelligence reports to read, but officers, especially of the Flag rank surely do!

Ok...so you were an officer of the flag rank who got to see the intelligence reports. What was your rank? And where were you stationed?

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Hmmmm....so you got together with these 3 guys and showed them your Indian military card which also stated that you had access to intelligence?

If you wish to call them fools, then don't use my shoulders to fire the gun.

Tell then yourself.

Hopefully you have the guts.

Quite unlettered to understand huh? That sounds like highly lettered English to me.

That is because your grounding in the language is below average!

Ok...so you were an officer of the flag rank who got to see the intelligence reports. What was your rank? And where were you stationed?

Read the posts in this forum and the facts will be revealed. Laziness of the mind is the greatest infirmity anyoine can be afflicted with!

 

[Zyxius]

fools, use my shoulders to fire the gun.

Tell then yourself.

Hopefully you have the guts.




That is because your grounding in the language is below average!



Laziness of the mind is the greatest infirmity anyoine can be afflicted with!

Ok Salim, I think there is no need for you to gt so upset and make such personal attacks....it is just a discussion and if you are going to get so upset and start making threats and accusations, well, I guess we'll just have to assume that the Indian army/intelligence people don't get the sort of training that makes them amenable to society.

 

[Zyxius]

fools, use my shoulders to fire the gun.

Tell then yourself.

Hopefully you have the guts.




That is because your grounding in the language is below average!



Laziness of the mind is the greatest infirmity anyoine can be afflicted with!

Ok Salim, I think there is no need for you to gt so upset and make such personal attacks....it is just a discussion and if you are going to get so upset and start making threats and accusations, well, I guess we'll just have to assume that the Indian army/intelligence people don't get the sort of training that makes them amenable to society.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Ok Salim, I think there is no need for you to gt so upset and make such personal attacks....it is just a discussion and if you are going to get so upset and start making threats and accusations, well, I guess we'll just have to assume that the Indian army/intelligence people don't get the sort of training that makes them amenable to society.

Sorry my man.

You are the one who is doing personal attack.

Now that you have got cold feet, you are doing a back flip!

It is time you educate yourself on how militaries around the world function and then come back.

You are quite a coward. You lampoon the Moderators and Administrators as fools and then when I dare you, you slink like a coyote or release offensive odour like skunks do when cornered.

You even had the audacity to insult Asim when his post contained nothing to cause you to do so!

Are you a human being?

Or have you come to mess up this forum with your Salafi thoughts and abuse all and sundry?

If you think those who run this Forum, the Administrators and Moderators are fool be bold to tell so to their face.Don't use me!

I think they are doing a great job!

 

[Zyxius]

Now that you have got cold feet, you are doing a back flip!

It is time you educate yourself on how militaries around the world function and then come back.

You are quite a coward. You lampoon the Moderators and Administrators as fools and then when I dare you, you slink like a coyote or release offensive odour like skunks do when cornered.

You even had the audacity to insult Asim when his post contained nothing to cause you to do so!

Are you a human being?

Or have you come to mess up this forum with your Salafi thoughts and abuse all and sundry?

If you think those who run this Forum, the Administrators and Moderators are fool be bold to tell so to their face.Don't use me!

I think they are doing a great job!

Take it easy man. You'll have a heart attack.


What's your beef with Salafi's though? Why do you hate them? It doesn't sound very educated and tolerant to automatically be against a group just because they happen to be Salafi like about 100 million other people on the face of this earth.

 

[muse]

Speak loudly and carry a little stick - Can that really be the Indian way??


Delhi carries a small stick
By Chietigj Bajpaee

Israel bombs the Osirak nuclear research facility in Iraq in 1981 after it alleges that Iraq is using the facility to develop a nuclear weapons program. China seizes and dismantles a United States EP-3 aircraft after it allegedly ventures into Chinese airspace in 2001. The US invades Afghanistan after the terrorist attacks on September 11, 2001.

And then there is India. An attack on the Indian parliament in December 2001; hijacking of Indian Airlines 814 to Afghanistan in 1999, which was released only after the exchange of three terrorists, including one who was later responsible for the execution of US journalist Daniel Pearl; terrorist attacks in Jaipur in May 2008, Hyderabad in August 2007, Mumbai in July 2006, Varanasi in March 2006, Bangalore in December 2005, Delhi in October 2005 and Ayodhya in July 2005; a recent surge in infiltration across the Line of Control in Kashmir; and this week's attack on the Indian Embassy in the Afghan capital Kabul. India's reaction: point fingers at political opponents and turn the other cheek.

India's burgeoning economic growth, growing foreign exchange reserves, and expanding middle class are necessary but insufficient conditions for India's emergence as a great power. This will require certain fundamental shifts in strategic thinking both internally and on the world stage.

Internally, overcoming India's growth in spite of the government rather than because of it through tackling corruption and inefficient bureaucracy and regulations will be necessary to attract the US$500 billion in infrastructure investment that is necessary to sustain India's development. Overcoming outdated social, religious and cultural practices, which relegate women, tribal communities, religious minorities and lower castes as second-class citizens, is also necessary to fully utilize the country's productive capacity.

Externally, India needs to develop a more assertive and aggressive foreign policy. Part of this requires India to develop a long-term strategic doctrine, upgrade its military and adopt more proactive and well-coordinated diplomacy. However, more fundamentally, it requires a change in mentality.

China was an influential world power long before it became an economic power. Its status as a modern-day great power was not cemented with Deng Xiaoping's economic reforms in the late 1970s but rather in 1950 when China faced off against the military might of the United States in the Korean War. This set the stage for China's importance in the Cold War framework of triangular diplomacy between the United States and Soviet Union.

Significantly smaller states such as Singapore have developed a more strategic foreign policy than India, by defining their place in Asia and the world and orchestrating major shifts in response to changes in the international system.

Even India's traditional nemesis, Pakistan, has developed a more proactive foreign policy, as the country was able to lead a major reorientation of its foreign policy following September 11. Even before this, Pakistan was able to constantly reinvent itself as a US ally as a member of SEATO (Southeast Asia Treaty Organization) and CENTO (Central Treaty Organization) during the Cold War; as a leader in the Islamic world with its support for the Afghan mujahideen during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan and development of an "Islamic nuclear bomb" in 1998; as an "all-weather" ally of China; and by developing relations with Central Asia in order to gain "strategic depth" in its rivalry with India.

India could play a more proactive role in regional and international security. If not for the greater good, then for its own selfish motives to stabilize its periphery and gain access to natural resources and markets on its doorstep. While China has "shelved" tensions with all countries along its borders, India has active conflicts along almost all of its borders.

No country in history has risen to great power status with instability on all of its borders and active insurgencies in over half of its states (Naxalite, northeast, Kashmir). Despite its growing energy needs, which are necessary to sustain its growth and development needs, India has been unable to gain access to natural gas supplies on its doorsteps in Bangladesh and Myanmar to its east and Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran and Central Asia to its west, due to a mix of tense bilateral relations, instabilities in these states and competition from China.

India is in an ideal position to address instabilities in these states, given the benign view of India in some of these states and India's "soft power" influence through its longstanding historical, cultural and political links and credentials as a democracy. For instance, India could play the role that China plays in the six-party talks on North Korea's nuclear program with respect to Iran's nuclear program, given its well-established relationship with Iran and rapprochement with the United States.

Similarly, India has the potential to adopt a "middle path" in dealing with Myanmar's military junta between diplomatic isolation and sanctions imposed by the West and the aid "without conditions" from China. Finally, India should be a party to talks between Afghanistan and its neighbors, given that Afghanistan borders Pakistan's northern areas, which are claimed by India as part of the disputed region of Kashmir.

Indian policymakers need to remind themselves of US president Theodore Roosevelt's saying to "speak softly and carry a big stick". Instead, they appear to have been doing the opposite: bragging of India's status as one of the world's oldest civilizations, leader of the Non-Aligned Movement, the world's largest democracy, and now rising economic power under the motto of "India rising", while showing little substance. For too long there has been discussion on the gap between the India's potential, capabilities and accomplishments. Only when India stands up on the world stage will it receive the respect that it deserves.

Chietigj Bajpaee is a research analyst for Asia in the Country Intelligence Group at Global Insight. He has been a research associate for the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington, DC, a research assistant for the London-based International Institute for Strategic Studies and risk analyst for a New York-based risk management company. The views here are his own. He can be reached at cbajpaee@hotmail.com.

 

[nitesh]

muse, a humble request. people are not blind here, can't you keep the things in plane fonts and if something is important just make it BOLD.

 

[gpit]

This is a very good article.

“China was an influential world power long before it became an economic power. Its status as a modern-day great power was not cemented with Deng Xiaoping's economic reforms in the late 1970s but rather in 1950 when China faced off against the military might of the United States in the Korean War.”

China is not a world super-power given it’s backwardness in many aspects. But China is unique and influential, culturally, militarily, politically and economically. As this article rightly points out, influence has to be earned by deeds not by mere words. Facing-off with US in Korea is arguably the crucial step in establishing China as an influential world figure. Up to date, no country in the world has achieved up to this point. Frankly, China has earned the respect from US because of this.

I always feel sorry for Nehru, his followers, and “hijacked” Indians in general, when he turned a blind eye to what demonstrated by the Chinese in Korea War and unfortunately advocated “forward policy” northwards.


“While China has "shelved" tensions with all countries along its borders, India has active conflicts along almost all of its borders.”

This August will testify the final settlement of Russia-China boarder dispute once forever (hopefully). It is not happy news to everyone on both countries, but to many others. This is a painful task.

This should also signify the fact that China has solved all its land disputes with its neighbor countries except India.

Has India settled any border disputes with any of its neighbors since its 1947 independence? At least not yet with those major neighbors such as China, Pakistan, BD.

“For instance, India could play the role that China plays in the six-party talks on North Korea's nuclear program with respect to Iran's nuclear program, given its well-established relationship with Iran and rapprochement with the United States.”

Probably not, due to both geopolitical and economical differences when compared with China NK scenario.

“Similarly, India has the potential to adopt a "middle path" in dealing with Myanmar's military junta between diplomatic isolation and sanctions imposed by the West and the aid "without conditions" from China.”

India has already been doing this by lowering its flag of “democracy” and “human rights”. The return is hefty.

Finally, for a country to be world influential, a collision and a proper handle of the collision with an established world power (or powers) seems required, as revealed by the world history.

 

[gpit]

East Pakistan an Indian sovereign state?

In your imperialistic mentality, you have already subconsciously merged the two into your one so your army freely “went into” and “came out of”.

Jester indeed!