WIKILEAKS: Leaked diplomatic cables reveal that China is ready to abandon North Korea

[T-Rex]

No, China will never give up NK.

A stable, peaceful and independent Korea Peninsula is extremely crucial to China's national security. When mentioning "War to Resist US Aggression and Aid Korea" in Chinese history book, the Chinese idiom "唇亡齿寒" is used to describe the importance of NK to China, which translates loosely into "The lips being lost, the teeth feel cold". It is a Chinese way to tell people that if you attack NK, you are also attacking me.

China could fight a war for NK in 1950s, China can certainly do it again.

China's quiet stand in this regard is giving a wrong message to the so-called champions of democracy. These crusaders might start a war , thinking that China would not back DPRK.

 

[T-Rex]

Just becuase a wolf puts on sheeps clothing, he is still a wolf.

It doesn't matter what label the party uses. the fact is it was based on Marxism/Leninism. KimII-sung was trained and served under Stalin as a Captian in the Red Army. many of the policies he instituted under his regime where based on what he learned under stalin. And from Stalins politcal advisors after he was in power. Most of those policies survive today. The hereditary thing is unique and is a result of the effectivness of what extreme propoganda can accomplish promoting hero worship. Stalins propoganda people did similar things but were never as effective as Kim II-sung was.

'A wolf '!!!!! Now don't you think you can confuse the sheep by crying wolf. The sound 'wolf' coming form the mouth of a wolf doesn't sound good. This big bad wolf is spreading unrest all over the world.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

China's quiet stand in this regard is giving a wrong message to the so-called champions of democracy. These crusaders might start a war , thinking that China would not back DPRK.

The problem is that Kim Jung-Il is a big problem for China as well.

China wants to keep the status quo, Kim Jung-Il wants to provoke instability.

Kim Jung-Il wants to detonate nuclear weapons (despite China telling them it was unacceptable), he refuses to go back to six-party talks, and his reckless actions in the peninsula are increasing the probability of a war.

That is completely contrary to China's interests.

 

[T-Rex]

The problem is that Kim Jung-Il is a big problem for China as well.

China wants to keep the status quo, Kim Jung-Il wants to provoke instability.

Kim Jung-Il wants to detonate nuclear weapons (despite China telling them it was unacceptable), he refuses to go back to six-party talks, and his reckless actions in the peninsula are increasing the probability of a war.

That is completely contrary to China's interests.

What DPRK has been doing is nothing compared to what israel has been doing for the last half a century. Now, do you see uncle sam ever stopping its blind support to israel for all the crimes against humanity committed by that terrorist state? That is what a solid ally is, this the difference between uncle sam and other major powers. What other major powers are embarrassed to do, uncle sam simply does that without any hesitation. Perhaps that's why uncle sam dominates other powers.

 

[below_freezing]

The problem is that Kim Jung-Il is a big problem for China as well.

China wants to keep the status quo, Kim Jung-Il wants to provoke instability.

Kim Jung-Il wants to detonate nuclear weapons (despite China telling them it was unacceptable), he refuses to go back to six-party talks, and his reckless actions in the peninsula are increasing the probability of a war.

That is completely contrary to China's interests.

the obvious solution is to remove kim and keep north korea as a state. let it remain nuclear too, without kim they won't use it, and we're in no danger from their nukes since they know it will be the end of their fun and games if they use it on anyone but especially us. with the nukes, it ensures that korea is permanently divided, keeps japan on its toes, and attracts US attention and military power away from where we don't want it to go. maybe even give power back to the korean worker's party instead of having it as kim's powerless puppet. when we're dealing party to party, as opposed to party to dictator, we'll get progress.

 

[T-Rex]

the obvious solution is to remove kim and keep north korea as a state. let it remain nuclear too, without kim they won't use it, and we're in no danger from their nukes since they know it will be the end of their fun and games if they use it on anyone but especially us. with the nukes, it ensures that korea is permanently divided, keeps japan on its toes, and attracts US attention and military power away from where we don't want it to go. maybe even give power back to the korean worker's party instead of having it as kim's powerless puppet. when we're dealing party to party, as opposed to party to dictator, we'll get progress.

If the enemy knows that you're never going to use your nukes then it loses its value as a deterrent. In other words, just having nukes isn't enough, you have to have the guts to use it if the situation calls for. The US is quite willing to use its nukes under certain conditions. So, the important question is what are those conditions? DPRK certainly has those conditions, so it is not fair to think that Kim is itching to use his nukes on the US. This is certainly what the great satan wants the world to believe.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

the obvious solution is to remove kim and keep north korea as a state. let it remain nuclear too, without kim they won't use it, and we're in no danger from their nukes since they know it will be the end of their fun and games if they use it on anyone but especially us. with the nukes, it ensures that korea is permanently divided, keeps japan on its toes, and attracts US attention and military power away from where we don't want it to go. maybe even give power back to the korean worker's party instead of having it as kim's powerless puppet. when we're dealing party to party, as opposed to party to dictator, we'll get progress.

Good post.

That would be the best solution.

 

[GUNS-N- ROSES]

The problem is that Kim Jung-Il is a big problem for China as well.

China wants to keep the status quo, Kim Jung-Il wants to provoke instability.

Kim Jung-Il wants to detonate nuclear weapons (despite China telling them it was unacceptable), he refuses to go back to six-party talks, and his reckless actions in the peninsula are increasing the probability of a war.

That is completely contrary to China's interests.

what is the possiblity of china helping some other person/general in becoming prez of NK. a person with a stable head. surely SK/japan/US wont mind that. do chineese have that kind of control over north korean govt.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

what is the possiblity of china helping some other person/general in becoming prez of NK. a person with a stable head. surely SK/japan/US wont mind that.

do chineese have that kind of control over north korean govt.

China doesn't have that much control over North Korea.

We can certainly "help" the process along though, if it becomes necessary.

 

[Hyde]

lol wikileaks was working fine for me until yesterday

stopped now..... is it working for you?

 

[mehboobkz]

Chinese had “pretty much” said a year ago that if the U.S. ratifies the CTBT, China would follow suit. Further, China has “dumped” Pakistan in the Conference on Disarmament (CD), which is a “good sign.” US Under Secretary Tauscher urged P5 action to get Pakistan to stop blocking progress in the CD on the Fissile Material Cut-off Treaty (FMCT).

WikiLeaks India : UK and US discuss China vs India nuclear arms race and Indian vs Pakistan cold war

 

[sensenreason]

Chinese had “pretty much” said a year ago that if the U.S. ratifies the CTBT, China would follow suit. Further, China has “dumped” Pakistan in the Conference on Disarmament (CD), which is a “good sign.” US Under Secretary Tauscher urged P5 action to get Pakistan to stop blocking progress in the CD on the Fissile Material Cut-off Treaty (FMCT).

WikiLeaks India : UK and US discuss China vs India nuclear arms race and Indian vs Pakistan cold war

Can you provide a link? Its tough to sift through so much data...

 

[mehboobkz]

¶3. (C) Zardari agreed dialogue is the only way forward. However, he justified continued suspicion of India, citing recent "confirmation" that there was Indian involvement in the Mumbai attacks. He claimed India had increased its military spending 30 percent this year and described this as a direct threat to Pakistan. When Kerry pointed out the Chinese threat to India, Zardari responded that Indian tanks cannot operate in the Chinese border region and could only be intended for an attack on Pakistan. India has 4,700 tanks, he explained, while Pakistan has only 2,600. "Capability creates a fear," he added.

http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/cable/20 ... AD428.html

 

[below_freezing]

If the enemy knows that you're never goig to use your nukes then it loses its value as a deterrent. In other words, just having nukes isn't enough, you have to have the guts to use it if the situation calls for. The US is quite willing to use its nukes under certain conditions. So, the important question is what are those conditions? DPRK certainly has those conditions, so it is not fair to think that Kim is itching to use his nukes on the US. This is certainly what the great satan wants the world to believe.

sorry i put it unclearly: with kim personally around, the probability that he will use nukes for his own benefit but not for the benefit of north korea, is higher than when power is less centralized and held by a party, which will only use nukes to prevent north korea's conquest and occupation, and not for more personal reasons. this is nothing against north korea the country, north korea is much more than just kim family.

 

[Thomas]

the obvious solution is to remove kim and keep north korea as a state. let it remain nuclear too, without kim they won't use it, and we're in no danger from their nukes since they know it will be the end of their fun and games if they use it on anyone but especially us. with the nukes, it ensures that korea is permanently divided, keeps japan on its toes, and attracts US attention and military power away from where we don't want it to go. maybe even give power back to the korean worker's party instead of having it as kim's powerless puppet. when we're dealing party to party, as opposed to party to dictator, we'll get progress.

Explaine why it is in China's benefit to keep Korea divided? If you want U.S. bases out of Korea then the only way to acomplish that is through a unified Korea. Not to mention the much expanded trade China will do with a unified prosperous Korea. If China wants to be a responsible world leader then they should set an example