why was Sindh not "partitioned"??

[Armstrong]

Anyone who believes he is a Pakistani is a Pakistani, religion, is irrelevant in today's age. As for the population shrinkage, though there has been a trend towards emigration as well. The major reasons for decline in Hindu populations remains:

1. The breakaway of Bangladesh, chunk of Hindu population.
2. Massive growth rates in Muslim population, thus drowning out Hindu number.

Adding to that the population of Non Muslims in (West) Pakistan has grown since '47 like that of the rest of us heres a census to that effect: Welcome to Bhavnagar, where Muslims are free to live – as long as they change their name | Page 2

 

[Lord ZeN]

At what point in history are you actually referring to? Can you please clarify?
And as for the part in bold, lands were denied on one pretext or the other in many cases. Hyderabad, Junagarh, Assam Hill Tracts, Ghaziabad, these are only some of the areas that have seen the Pakistani flag being raised and then taken down.

During the Partition of course.
We could have brokered many more deals with all those in power during those days to deny Pakistan it's so called "Muslim dominated areas" just by using your logic of communal tensions being non-existent in those areas.
We could have even prevented the Birth of Pakistan by using force. But we never did. We were both Honorable & stupid. But i don't blame Pakistan as it was our mistake by which we lost entire Sindh. But Hindu Indian Sindhis still suffers & still remains the biggest loosers of Partition.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

During the Partition of course.
We could have brokered many more deals with all those in power during those days to deny Pakistan so it's called "Muslim dominated areas" just by using your logic of communal tensions being non-existent in those areas.
We could have even prevented the Birth of Pakistan by using force. But we never did. We were both Honorable & stupid. But i don't blame Pakistan as it was our mistake by which we lost entire Sindh. But Hindu Indian Sindhi's still suffers & still remains the biggest loosers of Partition.

honorable and stupid? prevent the birth of Pak? oh really?


nehru banging mountbatiens wife... swallowing princely states like junagarh,Kashmir,Hyderabad...cities like Gurdaspur etc and so on...where was the "honour" at that time? and how do you "think" you could stop the creation of Pakistan?

 

[Icarus]

During the Partition of course.
We could have brokered many more deals with all those in power during those days to deny Pakistan so it's called "Muslim dominated areas" just by using your logic of communal tensions being non-existent in those areas.

Well, as you might be aware, there wasn't much compensation given to either side during the partition due to the hostilities. Which is deplorable, however, it was hardly an affair that affected Hindus or Sindhi Hindus exclusively, Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus were all part of the great nexus of loss and suffering. My own grandfather, a revenue officer of the British Indian Civil Service lost his entire land holding in Mumbai and Nagpur, it was thus something that hurt everyone.

We could have even prevented the Birth of Pakistan by using force. But we never did. We were both Honorable & stupid. But i don't blame Pakistan as it was our mistake by which we lost entire Sindh. But Hindu Indian Sindhi's still suffers & still remains the biggest loosers of Partition.

India couldn't have suppressed the creation of Pakistan, it was the wish of the British and enjoyed the support of a large minority within India. Any attempt to suppress it would have torn the region apart.

 

[Levina]

Bored on the weekend?

Right!
Blame it on my injured hand. Lolzz

 

[Lord ZeN]

My own grandfather, a revenue officer of the British Indian Civil Service lost his entire land holding in Mumbai and Nagpur, it was thus something that hurt everyone.

Off-topic question : Were your grandparents from India like @haviZsultan ?

Well, as you might be aware, there wasn't much compensation given to either side during the partition due to the hostilities. Which is deplorable, however, it was hardly an affair that affected Hindus or Sindhi Hindus exclusively, Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus were all part of the great nexus of loss and suffering.

Many families & individuals from both sides suffered but in case of Sindhi Hindus the entire community suffered which never happened with either Punjabi or Bengali Muslims/ Hindus/Sikhs. In their case they got a fair share of their lands.

 

[Icarus]

Many families & individuals from both sides suffered but in case of Sindhi Hindus the entire community suffered which never happened with either Punjabi or Bengali Muslims/ Hindus/Sikhs. In their case they got a fair share of their lands.

I am not sure dispossession at such an enormous scale could have been carried out by the nascent Pakistani state that had to request the Ruler of Bahawalpur to provide them with pencils as state offices had none but obviously, the suffering and forced migration of many communities was a huge issue. I myself am a Sethi, most of my clan were Hindu or Sikh and lived in places that today make up Pakistan, Bhera, Peshawar, Gujrat. After partition, the number of Sethis I have met, I can count on my fingers.

Off-topic question : Were your grandparents from India like @haviZsultan ?

No, my grandparents were from territories that would later go on to be added to Pakistan but they had settled in Mumbai and subsequently in Nagpur because that's where my grandfather was posted and spent most of his service.

 

[pursuit of happiness]

That is quite a lengthy assumption and somewhere along the way, it loses touch with reality. Though your argument makes sense on paper, it should be noted that diversity is global phenomenon and is accommodated in laws through exemptions and escape clauses. Europe is a largely irreligious society and going by your logic, since they so not assert any religious claim, they automatically end up persecuting those who do subscribe to a religion? That is not the case.
Pakistan is an Islamic State (by name), and yes Muslims do believe in One God but that does not mean that it becomes the core reality. Minorities are free to believe whatever they deem fit (except Ahmedis, they have it very bad) and often, they are granted state safeguards to ensure that their freedoms are observed.



Anyone who believes he is a Pakistani is a Pakistani, religion, is irrelevant in today's age. As for the population shrinkage, though there has been a trend towards emigration as well. The major reasons for decline in Hindu populations remains:

1. The breakaway of Bangladesh, chunk of Hindu population.
2. Massive growth rates in Muslim population, thus drowning out Hindu number.

---
Europe..
Europe till 17th century chruch ruled..
relgion first rest later..you get prist ruled become elit with kings so you french revlution to recity it
religion text first logic later.. so you get galeio and coperniuc hidding what was right but as per chruch -relgius text wrong.. they accpet that galioe and copernus was right after century..but they accepted.
ask any normal pakistani who is first islam or pakistan (cnsitution of pakistan ) ..ans will decide where it belong old eurpean cnetury or 2015..
nothing wrong with islam first.. but its form .. right meaning is missed .. unaccounted madardsas and poticl group use relgion for their aim which make things worst more for pak..
-----
Pakistan is an Islamic State and core
for any nation its core is their constitution.. its priniple guiding force and which give legitimacy to action of state..
as pak constitution itself full of contradiction..
its islamic state but dont implemten sharia
its islamic state but never accpeted in practics
its islamic state but never define waht kind of state
see indian preamble its cleary define waht it intends to in any difficulty SC or parliament see constitiution of india as guding force..
---
ahemadis..
though its not my prerogetive.. but
waht was jinnah view on ahemadi...
how suddenlty ahmedi become non muslim by one man idea i think in 1970
Persecution of Ahmadis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
pak is only state who declare them non muslim officilay what happned to SA.. malysia indensia.. qatar.. oic emmebr?
its not just abut sect.. its about role of state wrt to people..
---
Pakistani and religion
what you said is ideal..
see your own newspaper ... your polticis ...your state .. its all about religion if not less
-----
hindu population in pakistan
its decline.. but as you said it ws for bangaldesh ..
let me get more details..
--
thanks

 

[Armstrong]

I am not sure dispossession at such an enormous scale could have been carried out by the nascent Pakistani state that had to request the Ruler of Bahawalpur to provide them with pencils as state offices had none but obviously, the suffering and forced migration of many communities was a huge issue.

I remember my Grandfather telling me that initially they had to used the thorns of acacia trees to secure papers together because they hadn't any pins to pin them together. And they used to take out old files to find pages where only one side was used so as to use up the other side because of the scarcity of paper. But that people were so fueled by the promise that Pakistan held that they strove through all of that and much...much more with a smile.

Woh jazbaaa kahan chalaa giyaaa ?

I myself am a Sethi, most of my clan were Hindu or Sikh and lived in places that today make up Pakistan, Bhera, Peshawar, Gujrat. After partition, the number of Sethis I have met, I can count on my fingers.

So Sethis and Butts are endangered species ?

 

[pursuit of happiness]

Adding to that the population of Non Muslims in (West) Pakistan has grown since '47 like that of the rest of us heres a census to that effect: Welcome to Bhavnagar, where Muslims are free to live – as long as they change their name | Page 2

--
if this true.. it bad and codemnable..
we are not perfectsciety.. leanring to be it..
but our constitution, lesgilation. judicary . executive arm dont discriainte on relgion for wrong reason..
that i can gurantee

I remember my Grandfather telling me that initially they had to used the thorns of acacia trees to secure papers together because they hadn't any pins to pin them together. And they used to take out old files to find pages where only one side was used so as to use up the other side because of the scarcity of paper. But that people were so fueled by the promise that Pakistan held that they strove through all of that and much...much more with a smile.

Woh jazbaaa kahan chalaa giyaaa ?



So Sethis and Butts are endangered species ?

--
those were hard times for both side people
hard time for hard people.. cant even think of that level of choas now..
but they surivied and grown..
both side needed that jazab but pak neede more looking current status of today

 

[mujhaidind]

We already had Gujratis and Marwaris. Then came the Sindhis too. All three good at exploiting others.

 

[Armstrong]

--
if this true.. it bad and codemnable..
we are not perfectsciety.. leanring to be it..
but our constitution, lesgilation. judicary . executive arm dont discriainte on relgion for wrong reason..
that i can gurantee

Oh bhai I'm not talking about the thread in that link....I think @Icarus mistook it for the same. The thread contained a post about the census of West Pakistan through the years where the population of Non Muslims hasn't been declining but is on the rise just like that of every other community !

And the presence of absence of implied biases in one's constitution mean very little when both Pakistan and India are more or less one up, the same or one down with respect to each other according to PEW's Social Hostility Involving Religion Index - Appendix 3: Social Hostilities Index | Pew Research Center's Religion & Public Life Project

 

[Icarus]

---
Europe..
Europe till 17th century chruch ruled..
relgion first rest later..you get prist ruled become elit with kings so you french revlution to recity it
religion text first logic later.. so you get galeio and coperniuc hidding what was right but as per chruch -relgius text wrong.. they accpet that galioe and copernus was right after century..but they accepted.
ask any normal pakistani who is first islam or pakistan (cnsitution of pakistan ) ..ans will decide where it belong old eurpean cnetury or 2015..
nothing wrong with islam first.. but its form .. right meaning is missed .. unaccounted madardsas and poticl group use relgion for their aim which make things worst more for pak..
-----
Pakistan is an Islamic State and core
for any nation its core is their constitution.. its priniple guiding force and which give legitimacy to action of state..
as pak constitution itself full of contradiction..
its islamic state but dont implemten sharia
its islamic state but never accpeted in practics
its islamic state but never define waht kind of state
see indian preamble its cleary define waht it intends to in any difficulty SC or parliament see constitiution of india as guding force..
---
ahemadis..
though its not my prerogetive.. but
waht was jinnah view on ahemadi...
how suddenlty ahmedi become non muslim by one man idea i think in 1970
Persecution of Ahmadis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
pak is only state who declare them non muslim officilay what happned to SA.. malysia indensia.. qatar.. oic emmebr?
its not just abut sect.. its about role of state wrt to people..
---
Pakistani and religion
what you said is ideal..
see your own newspaper ... your polticis ...your state .. its all about religion if not less
-----
hindu population in pakistan
its decline.. but as you said it ws for bangaldesh ..
let me get more details..
--
thanks

Most of your argument is infallible but like it does not take into account the paradox of religion in Pakistan and it is a situation that is awkward to explain. Religion does get a lot of press, and people do pledge loyalty to Islam over the state. However, at the same time, we see that the TTP has so far failed to attract large scale support to their cause even though they expound the spread of Islam and the Islamic system as their primary agenda.
So you see, what you have said is absolutely correct and it is bound to be interpreted as such by someone who is living outside of Pakistan but the inner workings of the state are paradoxical at best.

We are a nation that values Islam as the way of honesty but will go to a Sikh businessman because he will never cheat.
We are a nation where men and women are often called to be segregated but mixed groups are the norm.
We are a nation where terrorism and gun culture is ripe, yet except for Karachi, no city makes the global top 20 for gun crimes.

You see, its not that simple to explain Pakistan and how it works, even I as a Pakistani am sometimes baffled about the volte face of our people.

I remember my Grandfather telling me that initially they had to used the thorns of acacia trees to secure papers together because they hadn't any pins to pin them together. And they used to take out old files to find pages where only one side was used so as to use up the other side because of the scarcity of paper. But that people were so fueled by the promise that Pakistan held that they strove through all of that and much...much more with a smile.

Woh jazbaaa kahan chalaa giyaaa ?

True, things changed, we became complacent, the state was hijacked.

So Sethis and Butts are endangered species ?

Sethis maybe, Butt toh jahan gari ka sheesha tootay mil jaata hai

 

[Armstrong]

You see, its not that simple to explain Pakistan and how it works, even I as a Pakistani am sometimes baffled about the volte face of our people.

Volte Face ?

Banda U-Turn ya About-Face keh deitaa haiii Shakespeare Sethi !

And don't worry young man; when you've advanced in years as I have (though I'm 24) you would understand and appreciate the dynamics of the Pakistani State !

 

[pursuit of happiness]

Most of your argument is infallible but like it does not take into account the paradox of religion in Pakistan and it is a situation that is awkward to explain. Religion does get a lot of press, and people do pledge loyalty to Islam over the state. However, at the same time, we see that the TTP has so far failed to attract large scale support to their cause even though they expound the spread of Islam and the Islamic system as their primary agenda.
So you see, what you have said is absolutely correct and it is bound to be interpreted as such by someone who is living outside of Pakistan but the inner workings of the state are paradoxical at best.

We are a nation that values Islam as the way of honesty but will go to a Sikh businessman because he will never cheat.
We are a nation where men and women are often called to be segregated but mixed groups are the norm.
We are a nation where terrorism and gun culture is ripe, yet except for Karachi, no city makes the global top 20 for gun crimes.

You see, its not that simple to explain Pakistan and how it works, even I as a Pakistani am sometimes baffled about the volte face of our people.



True, things changed, we became complacent, the state was hijacked.



Sethis maybe, Butt toh jahan gari ka sheesha tootay mil jaata hai

---
this may be crux
what you have said is absolutely correct and it is bound to be interpreted as such by someone who is living outside of Pakistan but the inner workings of the state are paradoxical at bes
like black hole as simple as black but as complex as galaxy.. those inside only know how it feels

Oh bhai I'm not talking about the thread in that link....I think @Icarus mistook it for the same. The thread contained a post about the census of West Pakistan through the years where the population of Non Muslims hasn't been declining but is on the rise just like that of every other community !

And the presence of absence of implied biases in one's constitution mean very little when both Pakistan and India are more or less one up, the same or one down with respect to each other according to PEW's Social Hostility Involving Religion Index - Appendix 3: Social Hostilities Index | Pew Research Center's Religion & Public Life Project

--
ok

@lcarus
what you have said is absolutely correct and it is bound to be interpreted as such by someone who is living outside of Pakistan but the inner workings of the state are paradoxical at bes
--
if above is true.. then still its bad for pak..
in todays world peceprtion as imp as reality..
from internal politics to internatila diploacy to economy.. its game of pereception .
--
pak may be doing 10 good thng and 15 bad .. but those 10 lsot for 15 ..
a nation cant go so worng...
even to domolist struct you need enegery and resoure ... if not constrcutuing
@lcarus
thanks for positive rating