Why Must Every Pakistani Minister Make A Threat Of Nuclear Strike

[CorporateAffairs]

Dear DRDO, whats the progress on our AMD? Speedup the process.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Hi,

Pakistan has nuclear weapons---so Pakistanis make statements of using them. It falls on the shoulders of every Pakistani minister and politician and others to use the option of nuclear threat under any conditions of hostilities.

Nuclear threats were okay when we were poor and destitute---we had no resources---there were sanctions on our military---and we had no choice but using it every time we got cornered.

Gen. Musharraf used it---PM Shaukat Aziz used it---Nawaz Sharif used it---the defense minsiters used it----railways minister used it----and every Durrani---Chaudhry and Syed used it----and it was used in the same context---that we are weaker than our enemy and we will not be able to withstand the military strike.

It has more or less become a habit of ours to use this threat all the time not understanding and not realizing that things have changed a lot.

Today's Pakistan is not the same Pakistan of the 90's or the 80's---. Today's Pakistan is a well off Pakistan---on the road to recovery and wel-being. The financial condition of Pakistan is much stronger today than before.

Pakistans must understand that a nuclear war will bring a total end of life on both the side as it exists today----they must also understand that they have options open to them now that they did not have before.

The options being that if they can strengthen their military a tad bit----they may not have as much of a concern for a war in the coming years. If I can show you the way that for around a sum of 10 billion dollars for the upgrade of the air force----Pakistan can bring down the perceived threat level to minscule.

Because---at current time---Pakistan air force is the real weakest link of the Pakistan military. From being an offensive force of the past----it has become a defensive force by poor management and poor leadership.

This defensive mindset of the air force needs to be changed---and for that---the procurement of the fighter aircraft needs to be taken away from them and be handed over to the commander in chief of the army---if the air force chief cannot make the right decision.

The commander needs to look into two different kinds of aircraft----one as a naval deep strike aircraft and also for Growler type capabilities----like the JH7B with AESA radar----and the second an air superiority---like the J11D or the SU35---. The goal is to have an aircraft that can carry a load of 8000---10000 KG of weapons and have a strike radius of around +- 2000 miles.

Next the investment needs to be in an air launch version of Babur cruise missile. The goal of Pakistan air force needs to be to have the ability to strike deep into the flank of the adversary from over the ocean----.

South India needs to be the target of conventional strikes---south India is the soft belly of Hindustan----that is where the industry is---that is where the money is coming into Hindustan---from south India----the indians control the IT industry----destroy the IT industry hubs of India----and you have hit at the jugular vein.

Hindustan is not concerned about the destruction of bordering states to Pakistan---it will sacrifice the states of Punjab and Gujrat---but if Pakistani deep strikes can reach Mumbai and down below----it is a game changer.

So---my suggestion to our leaders and military is---change your thinking---change your game plan---change according to the times----make changes in you life and death decisions----find ways to bring more destruction into the heart and lower gut of the enemy by conventional means rather than making threats of a nuclear strike.

The usage of these nuclear strike looks so passe and out dated---it looks like the Pakistani military and government has stopped to think about other ways and means to make an offensive move. It looks like that they are clueless and lost---and cannot see their way around---it looks like they have developed a tunnel vision---it looks like Pakistan has agreed to a fatalistic approach towards living.

And I can tell you---that we as a nation do not have to die and neither do our children----the does not need to be destroyed either---all we have to come up is about 2 Billion dollars for around 4 squadrons of JH7B's----around 4 Billion dollars of 3 to 4 squadrons of J11D's or the SU35---spend another 50 million on the Babur cruise missile so that it can be launched from a JH7B ( a current version of the air launched version of Babur cruise missile will give it a range of around 1300--1400 kilometers ).

The induction of these aircraft will give strength and energy to the armed forces---and the ministers will not have to declare a nuclear strike ever time there are hostilities---becuase we know---we can strike the enemy where it hurts the most.

S---let us do something---invest in the air force for these right kind of aircraft. Remember how Air Commodore suggested that India can strike us from the side of Iran with its deep strike capabilities---by flying deep over the arabian sea----let us use the same route but in reverse and strike back at the enemy.

Let us stop using this term of nuclear threat for good.

Again, a thoughtful, insightful piece by an original thinker.

That has always been Pakistan's 'blind spot', her own little Belgium and the Netherlands combined, the vacant defenses of the Makran Coast. It has been because the laughable strategic thinking of both sides has increasingly concentrated on the obvious. First, it was a blatant and utterly selfish interest in Kashmir; then, it became a displacement southwards of a few hundred kilometres, to the general location Sialkot-Lahore on one side and Akhnur-Khem Karan on the other, one side possessed of internal lines of defence, the other ready poised to mount an attack in one sector or the other, or both; at the end, it became a muddled thought - on both sides, by both sets of deep and strategic thinkers - that perhaps avoiding each other's big toe and moving on to softer targets might be more convenient. As usual, as in the previous cases, Pakistan had the original strategic thought and was swiftly stalemated by the stifling superiority of the Indian Army. No move made went without a buttressing of forces in the opposite areas; no thrust, no initiative failed to gain a lumbering but definitive and final sealing of the defences opposite.

This was our own elephantine race to the sea, executed over decades instead of over weeks; perhaps a true reflection of the difference in strategic conception of the different cases under consideration.

Which leaves a massive gap in the Pakistani and the Indian defences.

India, strangely enough, explored this option first; very unusual. Admiral Kuruvilla showed the woeful inadequacy of Pakistan's strategic thought, a thought process in which nothing except the Pakistan Army matters, and the other two services are actually, from time to time, formally excluded from the military planning process. A more ridiculous state of affairs is difficult to find in history or in current times. Adding insult to injury, the Indian Air Force also claimed its own little bit of the action; it is still in dispute between the two services, with the Army looking on with a barely-concealed mixture of rank envy and indulgence, whether Osa-mounted missiles or airborne munitions should claim the Karachi oil farms. Pakistan's riposte cost the entire sub-continent a great deal; Bombay will neither be forgotten nor forgiven. This resort to non-conventional forces was probably the Pakistan Army's retort to Bangladesh 71. It has certainly had its psychological effect. What is stunning is that it had no strategic impact, none at all.

It is probably improper to take this line of thinking and extrapolate it. Those sensitive to such things and willing to look through published information and put down little marks on a map, even a very large-scale map, will readily join the dots and sit with their heads in their hands, although @MastanKhan has shown it as an opportunity, rather than a blanking out of the brain on two sides simultaneously, on a level that invites professional examination by a profession far removed from the military.

As to his overt suggestions of building parity in the large interval between armoured troops and terrorists at one level and a fighting fit air force slowly losing the battle of the budget and forced to look for deterrent capability where once it sought to rule the skies, there is merit, and there is enough merit to scare the willies out of anyone sensible on the other side ready to read the tea leaves. What will happen to this thought is another matter. There is a considerable amount of human psychology mixed into this porridge.

Hi,

An economic force needs a strong military force to protect its assets to project it to that point prosperity. Without a strong military force---we are at the whims of the enemy that can manipulate our situation and progress---twist things around and threaten us at will.

We can only progress if we can strike back at their weakest point---ie---south india and still stay conventional---. That is what my goal and target is.




Yeahhhhhhhh----see---Pakistanis-----now you hear the screams----economic hubs-----. Smash them to smithereens----. I guarantee that with just 5 to 10 strikes on day one of the war----on indian IT hubs----and Indian IT industry is history---. All the call centers and money will be gone just like that.

This Jinns life is hiding in the call centers----destroy the call centers and the Jinn will die.

As it happens, that has been noticed. Steps are being taken to, umm, 'de-risk' the situation, to use one of the smarmy phrases beloved of our IT gasbags.

Whole notion is ill conceived and very very short sighted.

1. Every country has plans and mechanism to safeguard it important centers in place. So its not like you jidhadi attack, that you walk in blow yourself to blow the city.
2. Any attack on economic hubs will mean that complete inhalation of Pakistan. Nothing will be left. Even if anything is left there would be nothing for them to live for.
3. Indian IT hubs are not only Indian business hub, but its now global business hub. If its goes into history the world economy will get jeopardize. And there is no nation in this world which can fill that gap in short term other than India. So before even pakistan can intent of any such action, global forces will take care of pakistan at large.
4. Indian IT hub is totally different from call center hubs, India has long back moved ahead from BPO base to KPO base in call center industry. They typical call center business is now hubbed into Philipines and not India, we have moved up the ladder. Where as IT hub is now global R&D,development and Delivery hub of technology. Please understand the difference between where is India power in IT vs typical mindset of Call center. Indian IT industry earns major money in its expertise of engineering, design and development and not from Call Centers.
5. Pakistan enjoys no place on global power as well as in economy might, so the only reason to do something like that would be kind of suicide mission.

Inhalation? What a way to go!

Nice to see your ratings record.

Why Must Every Pakistani Minister Make A Threat Of Nuclear Strike against India?

Two reasons:

1. Lack of confidence.
2. Playing to their constituencies for brownie points.

I thinks all politicians must be given a crash course on the effects and horrors of a nuclear war.

Balls.

It's lack of brains.

Sry,I jumped the gun and went on elaborating Nuclear option. I did get your point, long story short, you are taking about a low blow to Indians with dedicated long range squadrons or atleast show of force. I am pretty sure PAF have already evaluated all their options and might have some plans for it. Even Gen Hamid Gul talked about this many times. So your suggestion isn't something new. In current scenario, credible nuclear defiance serves Pakistan well and saves us money.

Talk is cheap. Please don't take that personally, it is intended to convey a general weariness with jingoism on the wide screen which makes not the slightest effort to examine the realistic steps to carry out intentions.

@MastanKhan was evaluating realistic options.

Very well said awsome planning this is what i was saying if PAF become defencive force let let coas take the charge and buy fighter jets for paf current paf planners are no more kids

Yes we need to hit enemy where it hurt the hardest if we hit 1000 targets in border areas it wont hurt india but if we hit banglore and mumbai india will be down in its knees

Once india knows we have capability to hit them inside india where ever we want they will be on negotiation table

India in last 15 years inducted all types of SAM system just to counter F 16 which was threat now F 16 became a defencive jet rather than hit enemy where it hurts india know our F 16 capability is down to 20 percent and they have control over it how to tackle

Yet paf inducting F 16 which is no more threat to india

Countries like egypt uae indonedia malaysia oman kuwait etc are inducting twin engine fighter jet all these countries dont have threat as pakistan do yet stupidity of PAF prevails

I challange any paf officer come and debate on this issue at the dnd he will agree our paf is at mercy of IAF with Phalcon awacs IAF ruling the skies with quality and quantity of fighter jets

Last 3 decades paf only bought f 16 and jf 17 both share most of sane capability and both armt sea will be prey for IN sam

This is why jh 7 f 18 f 14 were made becoz j 10 and f 16 are at nercy at sea of adversary

J 10 induction also gone to drums

PAF become more of building homes and making promo songs there focus on real job is diverted

Watching this happen in real time has been an astonishing experience.

10MT device? Have you tested it? Nope!

Tactical nukes? How many are you going to use to stop an Indian thrust? Here's the maths...

For a max 5KT warhead (max 5KT warhead on Nasr which is between 1 to 5 KT)

– Blast and fireball radius 500m or approx < 2 sq km

Integrated Combat Group frontage < > 10 km with two combat teams up. Depth < > 5 km. Total area covered approx 50 sq km.

How many tactical nukes would be required to destroy one CG? - 25 Nasrs (with 5KT warhead. 125 nukes with 1KT warhead).

Initial strike with 10 -15 combat groups simultaneously. Total area covered < > 500 sq km.

Minimum battlefield nukes needed to destroy the CGs > 250 Nasrs with 5KT warhead or 1250 Nasrs with 1KT warhead!

That’s a hell of a lot of Nasrs required! Remember, all tanks and personnel carriers are protected from nuclear radiation. There will be no infantry out in the open.

So, going a step further, 250x5 KT = 1250 KT ie, equal to the yield of 65 Hiroshima atom bombs on Pakistani territory (as these will be employed only after the CGs have penetrated deep into Pakistan and would be used as a last resort!!) And I haven't even got started on an Indian nuclear riposte! Add that to the mix and....Curtains!

What would be left of Eastern Pakistan?

It’s like cutting off your nose to spite your face!

Bottom line: Use of tactical nukes? Bad idea!

Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.

10MT device? Have you tested it? Nope!

Tactical nukes? How many are you going to use to stop an Indian thrust? Here's the maths...

For a max 5KT warhead (max 5KT warhead on Nasr which is between 1 to 5 KT)

– Blast and fireball radius 500m or approx < 2 sq km

Integrated Combat Group frontage < > 10 km with two combat teams up. Depth < > 5 km. Total area covered approx 50 sq km.

How many tactical nukes would be required to destroy one CG? - 25 Nasrs (with 5KT warhead. 125 nukes with 1KT warhead).

Initial strike with 10 -15 combat groups simultaneously. Total area covered < > 500 sq km.

Minimum battlefield nukes needed to destroy the CGs > 250 Nasrs with 5KT warhead or 1250 Nasrs with 1KT warhead!

That’s a hell of a lot of Nasrs required! Remember, all tanks and personnel carriers are protected from nuclear radiation. There will be no infantry out in the open.

So, going a step further, 250x5 KT = 1250 KT ie, equal to the yield of 65 Hiroshima atom bombs on Pakistani territory (as these will be employed only after the CGs have penetrated deep into Pakistan and would be used as a last resort!!) And I haven't even got started on an Indian nuclear riposte! Add that to the mix and....Curtains!

What would be left of Eastern Pakistan?

It’s like cutting off your nose to spite your face!

Bottom line: Use of tactical nukes? Bad idea!

Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.

Pakistani fighters planes will not be able to cross their own borders in case of war with India, forget about deep strike.

Pakistan has a new illusion now a days that its economy is doing good as compared to past. Look at your economy objectively & you will see that you are doing as bad as earlier.

India is growing at 3% more than Pakistan with an economy 8 times larger. In future we will be 10 times, then 15 times, then 20 times bigger than Pakistan.

Stop competing with India.

Something tells me that you have crossed a threshold and are now fit to take up ministerial responsibility in Pakistan.

Or in India.

 

[Spectre]

Steps are being taken to, umm, 'de-risk' the situation

Does it matter? In presence of nuclear deterrent is there any risk of Pakistan attempting aerial bombing on Bangalore and Chennai?

If we follow a logical chain of events such attacks would happen in response or in pre-emption of massive Indian attack deep inside Pakistan which in itself would cross their self imposed nuclear threshold.

If such an attack is without provocation - then it would initiate a chain of events crossing the nuclear threshold.

This is well observed and already discounted hence doesn't serve the deterrence purpose.

P.S. My personal opinion.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Does it matter? In presence of nuclear deterrent is there any risk of Pakistan attempting aerial bombing on Bangalore and Chennai?

If we follow a logical chain of events such attacks would happen in response or in pre-emption of massive Indian attack deep inside Pakistan which in itself would cross their self imposed nuclear threshold.

If such an attack is without provocation - then in itself it would lead to chain of events crossing the nuclear threshold.

This is well observed and already discounted hence doesn't serve the deterrence purpose.

I believe that this is a real potential threat, which will not be an effective threat at the moment because of the inability of the other side to do anything about it. Not because it is likely to be ineffective in principle.

It does not have to be linked to prior deep strikes by India. Not at all.

Barak 8 can shoot down Bhramos so it can easily shoot down Nasr.

Sure.

And if 1.2 billion (or 1.3 billion, take your pick) line up on the border and pee simultaneously, we might seriously dislocate Pakistan's hydrological resources.

Good thinking.

 

[indushek]

Hi,

Pakistan has nuclear weapons---so Pakistanis make statements of using them. It falls on the shoulders of every Pakistani minister and politician and others to use the option of nuclear threat under any conditions of hostilities.

Nuclear threats were okay when we were poor and destitute---we had no resources---there were sanctions on our military---and we had no choice but using it every time we got cornered.

Gen. Musharraf used it---PM Shaukat Aziz used it---Nawaz Sharif used it---the defense minsiters used it----railways minister used it----and every Durrani---Chaudhry and Syed used it----and it was used in the same context---that we are weaker than our enemy and we will not be able to withstand the military strike.

It has more or less become a habit of ours to use this threat all the time not understanding and not realizing that things have changed a lot.

Today's Pakistan is not the same Pakistan of the 90's or the 80's---. Today's Pakistan is a well off Pakistan---on the road to recovery and wel-being. The financial condition of Pakistan is much stronger today than before.

Pakistans must understand that a nuclear war will bring a total end of life on both the side as it exists today----they must also understand that they have options open to them now that they did not have before.

The options being that if they can strengthen their military a tad bit----they may not have as much of a concern for a war in the coming years. If I can show you the way that for around a sum of 10 billion dollars for the upgrade of the air force----Pakistan can bring down the perceived threat level to minscule.

Because---at current time---Pakistan air force is the real weakest link of the Pakistan military. From being an offensive force of the past----it has become a defensive force by poor management and poor leadership.

This defensive mindset of the air force needs to be changed---and for that---the procurement of the fighter aircraft needs to be taken away from them and be handed over to the commander in chief of the army---if the air force chief cannot make the right decision.

The commander needs to look into two different kinds of aircraft----one as a naval deep strike aircraft and also for Growler type capabilities----like the JH7B with AESA radar----and the second an air superiority---like the J11D or the SU35---. The goal is to have an aircraft that can carry a load of 8000---10000 KG of weapons and have a strike radius of around +- 2000 miles.

Next the investment needs to be in an air launch version of Babur cruise missile. The goal of Pakistan air force needs to be to have the ability to strike deep into the flank of the adversary from over the ocean----.

South India needs to be the target of conventional strikes---south India is the soft belly of Hindustan----that is where the industry is---that is where the money is coming into Hindustan---from south India----the indians control the IT industry----destroy the IT industry hubs of India----and you have hit at the jugular vein.

Hindustan is not concerned about the destruction of bordering states to Pakistan---it will sacrifice the states of Punjab and Gujrat---but if Pakistani deep strikes can reach Mumbai and down below----it is a game changer.

So---my suggestion to our leaders and military is---change your thinking---change your game plan---change according to the times----make changes in you life and death decisions----find ways to bring more destruction into the heart and lower gut of the enemy by conventional means rather than making threats of a nuclear strike.

The usage of these nuclear strike looks so passe and out dated---it looks like the Pakistani military and government has stopped to think about other ways and means to make an offensive move. It looks like that they are clueless and lost---and cannot see their way around---it looks like they have developed a tunnel vision---it looks like Pakistan has agreed to a fatalistic approach towards living.

And I can tell you---that we as a nation do not have to die and neither do our children----the does not need to be destroyed either---all we have to come up is about 2 Billion dollars for around 4 squadrons of JH7B's----around 4 Billion dollars of 3 to 4 squadrons of J11D's or the SU35---spend another 50 million on the Babur cruise missile so that it can be launched from a JH7B ( a current version of the air launched version of Babur cruise missile will give it a range of around 1300--1400 kilometers ).

The induction of these aircraft will give strength and energy to the armed forces---and the ministers will not have to declare a nuclear strike ever time there are hostilities---becuase we know---we can strike the enemy where it hurts the most.

S---let us do something---invest in the air force for these right kind of aircraft. Remember how Air Commodore suggested that India can strike us from the side of Iran with its deep strike capabilities---by flying deep over the arabian sea----let us use the same route but in reverse and strike back at the enemy.

Let us stop using this term of nuclear threat for good.

Just two questions will these deep strikes be retaliatory or pre emptive.

What will be the rationale if pre emptive in nature.

Thanks for your reply in advance

 

[Donald Trump]

Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.

You mean Lanchester’s equations for battle, which are a military analysis of reliably predicting the outcome of military encounters?

Like if two armies fight, with x(t) troops on one side and y(t) on the other, the rate at which soldiers in one army are put out of action is proportional to the troop strength of their enemy, which gives rise to the system of differential equations as below:

x′(t) = −Ay(t), x(0) = x0,
y′(t) = −Bx(t), y(0) = y0,
where A > 0 and B > 0 are constants (called their fighting effectiveness coefficients) and x0 and y0 are the initial troop strengths.
Bl00dy complex and confusing stuff!

 

[Joe Shearer]

We can have cloud seeding in Gujrat, Rajasthan so that monsoon do not reach Pakistan. We can starve them to death.

This is beginning to border on outright genius.

Would someone kindly introduce the concept of a wind rose here? Please? My sides are aching, and I need a break.

Pakistani fighter planes cannot cross their border in a war with India. This article is stupidity.

Of course.

Our speed-breakers will do the trick.

Stupid Pakistanis.

You mean Lanchester’s equations for battle, which are a military analysis of reliably predicting the outcome of military encounters?

Like if two armies fight, with x(t) troops on one side and y(t) on the other, the rate at which soldiers in one army are put out of action is proportional to the troop strength of their enemy, which gives rise to the system of differential equations as below:

x′(t) = −Ay(t), x(0) = x0,
y′(t) = −Bx(t), y(0) = y0,
where A > 0 and B > 0 are constants (called their fighting effectiveness coefficients) and x0 and y0 are the initial troop strengths.
Bl00dy complex and confusing stuff!

Glad to see you on board. Really seriously pleased.

You might like to go a wee bit further; look at artillery firing patterns and the opposing troop deployment patterns.

 

[Spectre]

I believe that this is a real potential threat, which will not be an effective threat at the moment because of the inability of the other side to do anything about it. Not because it is likely to be ineffective in principle.

It does not have to be linked to prior deep strikes by India. Not at all.

Sir

There are two aspects to it:

1. Strategic Deterrence: Pakistan wants deep aerial strike option against India to raise their nuclear threshold which is only higher than North Korea at the movement. The availability of such an option as a deterrence supporting measure can be looked at from purely strategic perspective and this what I attempted to address.

All deterrence based analysis follow a cause and effect approach hence it is necessary to establish a context or linkage to some instigating event.

2. Actual Effectiveness: As I said my argument was from a purely strategic perspective and strategic opinions are offered by every Tom, Dick and Harry. The analysis of actual effectiveness of such a strike and tactical benefits is in the domain of defense professionals.

Regards

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sir

There are two aspects to it:

1. Strategic Deterrence: Pakistan wants deep aerial strike option against India to raise their nuclear threshold which is only higher than North Korea at the movement. The availability of such an option as a deterrence supporting measure can be looked at from purely strategic perspective and this what I attempted to address.

All deterrence based analysis follow a cause and effect approach hence it is necessary to establish a context or linkage to some instigating event.

2. Actual Effectiveness: As I said my argument was from a purely strategic perspective and strategic opinions are offered by every Tom, Dick and Harry. The analysis of actual effectiveness of such a strike and tactical benefits is in the domain of defense professionals.

Regards

Er, yes, precisely.

 

[indushek]

Pakistani fighter planes cannot cross their border in a war with India. This article is stupidity.

Well nothing wrong in discussing the topic when we comment on the thread right.

So called 'Freedom fighters' come to 'opressed land' knowing their lasting period is around two to three weeks until detected. Does it stop them from coming. Be prepared is always better.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Well nothing wrong in discussing the topic when we comment on the thread right.

So called 'Freedom fighters' come to 'opressed land' knowing their lasting period is around two to three weeks until detected. Does it stop them from coming. Be prepared is always better.

Look at your message count. You shameful fellow!

Where have you been and how have you been?

 

[indushek]

Sir

There are two aspects to it:

1. Strategic Deterrence: Pakistan wants deep aerial strike option against India to raise their nuclear threshold which is only higher than North Korea at the movement. The availability of such an option as a deterrence supporting measure can be looked at from purely strategic perspective and this what I attempted to address.

All deterrence based analysis follow a cause and effect approach hence it is necessary to establish a context or linkage to some instigating event.

2. Actual Effectiveness: As I said my argument was from a purely strategic perspective and strategic opinions are offered by every Tom, Dick and Harry. The analysis of actual effectiveness of such a strike and tactical benefits is in the domain of defense professionals.

Regards

Have an alternative theory

Pakistani army is currently still beseiged from many sides. Its thinkers have understood this fact that their international diplomatic works have been woefully inadequate. A deep strike capability puts doubts in the enemy camp raising this threshold u talk of. Gives them confidence, another matter do they happen or not. Any additional capability is a advantage.

I repeat myself, the going time for 'freedom fighters' in 'opressed land' is 2 to 3 weeks i hear or read. Does it stop them from coming. This line was for the argument where u talk of effectiveness of this strike. Think of the number of troops amassed at our 'opressed state' to counter these 'expendables'. Can you risk such amassing at our deep states? and the resultant economic burden for added fighters, infra etc?

Look at your message count. You shameful fellow!

Where have you been and how have you been?

Sorry sirji office politics are right now more interesting and engaging

 

[I S I]

I totally agree. We should stop with this Nuclear threats. This looks kind of a desperate move always.

 

[Srinivas]

South India is not a soft belly of India, Indian Navy along with air bases which have Su 30 MKI are there to counter any aggression from outside.

With the rise of Indian Navy along with Naval aviation, India can project power from straits of Malacca to Horn of Africa.

Indian navy will protect South India and other Islands located in IOR.

IT infrastructure is nothing but buildings with some computers, even if the cities are damaged, India can recover in no time.

Infosys started in a small room with less than 10 computers.

Regarding the economic activity, with the establishment of DMIC and Eastern corridors the economic activity is going to be spread all across the country.

The attack on any of the cities will evoke a strong response from India.

It is the drug menace that is originating from Afghanistan and fake currency coming from BD, Nepal that are real threat to the future of India along with people who are threatening to go to war with India.

 

[Genghis khan1]

Hi,

This is not a new suggestion---this has been out there for 10 + years---. Next time I am in pakistan---I will see if I can get to meet Raheel Sharif---I will find out what the real issues behind this procurement.

Again, a thoughtful, insightful piece by an original thinker.

That has always been Pakistan's 'blind spot', her own little Belgium and the Netherlands combined, the vacant defenses of the Makran Coast. It has been because the laughable strategic thinking of both sides has increasingly concentrated on the obvious. First, it was a blatant and utterly selfish interest in Kashmir; then, it became a displacement southwards of a few hundred kilometres, to the general location Sialkot-Lahore on one side and Akhnur-Khem Karan on the other, one side possessed of internal lines of defence, the other ready poised to mount an attack in one sector or the other, or both; at the end, it became a muddled thought - on both sides, by both sets of deep and strategic thinkers - that perhaps avoiding each other's big toe and moving on to softer targets might be more convenient. As usual, as in the previous cases, Pakistan had the original strategic thought and was swiftly stalemated by the stifling superiority of the Indian Army. No move made went without a buttressing of forces in the opposite areas; no thrust, no initiative failed to gain a lumbering but definitive and final sealing of the defences opposite.

This was our own elephantine race to the sea, executed over decades instead of over weeks; perhaps a true reflection of the difference in strategic conception of the different cases under consideration.

Which leaves a massive gap in the Pakistani and the Indian defences.

India, strangely enough, explored this option first; very unusual. Admiral Kuruvilla showed the woeful inadequacy of Pakistan's strategic thought, a thought process in which nothing except the Pakistan Army matters, and the other two services are actually, from time to time, formally excluded from the military planning process. A more ridiculous state of affairs is difficult to find in history or in current times. Adding insult to injury, the Indian Air Force also claimed its own little bit of the action; it is still in dispute between the two services, with the Army looking on with a barely-concealed mixture of rank envy and indulgence, whether Osa-mounted missiles or airborne munitions should claim the Karachi oil farms. Pakistan's riposte cost the entire sub-continent a great deal; Bombay will neither be forgotten nor forgiven. This resort to non-conventional forces was probably the Pakistan Army's retort to Bangladesh 71. It has certainly had its psychological effect. What is stunning is that it had no strategic impact, none at all.

It is probably improper to take this line of thinking and extrapolate it. Those sensitive to such things and willing to look through published information and put down little marks on a map, even a very large-scale map, will readily join the dots and sit with their heads in their hands, although @MastanKhan has shown it as an opportunity, rather than a blanking out of the brain on two sides simultaneously, on a level that invites professional examination by a profession far removed from the military.

As to his overt suggestions of building parity in the large interval between armoured troops and terrorists at one level and a fighting fit air force slowly losing the battle of the budget and forced to look for deterrent capability where once it sought to rule the skies, there is merit, and there is enough merit to scare the willies out of anyone sensible on the other side ready to read the tea leaves. What will happen to this thought is another matter. There is a considerable amount of human psychology mixed into this porridge.



As it happens, that has been noticed. Steps are being taken to, umm, 'de-risk' the situation, to use one of the smarmy phrases beloved of our IT gasbags.



Inhalation? What a way to go!

Nice to see your ratings record.



Balls.

It's lack of brains.



Talk is cheap. Please don't take that personally, it is intended to convey a general weariness with jingoism on the wide screen which makes not the slightest effort to examine the realistic steps to carry out intentions.

@MastanKhan was evaluating realistic options.



Watching this happen in real time has been an astonishing experience.



Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.



Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.


Something tells me that you have crossed a threshold and are now fit to take up ministerial responsibility in Pakistan.

Or in India.

Again, a thoughtful, insightful piece by an original thinker.

That has always been Pakistan's 'blind spot', her own little Belgium and the Netherlands combined, the vacant defenses of the Makran Coast. It has been because the laughable strategic thinking of both sides has increasingly concentrated on the obvious. First, it was a blatant and utterly selfish interest in Kashmir; then, it became a displacement southwards of a few hundred kilometres, to the general location Sialkot-Lahore on one side and Akhnur-Khem Karan on the other, one side possessed of internal lines of defence, the other ready poised to mount an attack in one sector or the other, or both; at the end, it became a muddled thought - on both sides, by both sets of deep and strategic thinkers - that perhaps avoiding each other's big toe and moving on to softer targets might be more convenient. As usual, as in the previous cases, Pakistan had the original strategic thought and was swiftly stalemated by the stifling superiority of the Indian Army. No move made went without a buttressing of forces in the opposite areas; no thrust, no initiative failed to gain a lumbering but definitive and final sealing of the defences opposite.

This was our own elephantine race to the sea, executed over decades instead of over weeks; perhaps a true reflection of the difference in strategic conception of the different cases under consideration.

Which leaves a massive gap in the Pakistani and the Indian defences.

India, strangely enough, explored this option first; very unusual. Admiral Kuruvilla showed the woeful inadequacy of Pakistan's strategic thought, a thought process in which nothing except the Pakistan Army matters, and the other two services are actually, from time to time, formally excluded from the military planning process. A more ridiculous state of affairs is difficult to find in history or in current times. Adding insult to injury, the Indian Air Force also claimed its own little bit of the action; it is still in dispute between the two services, with the Army looking on with a barely-concealed mixture of rank envy and indulgence, whether Osa-mounted missiles or airborne munitions should claim the Karachi oil farms. Pakistan's riposte cost the entire sub-continent a great deal; Bombay will neither be forgotten nor forgiven. This resort to non-conventional forces was probably the Pakistan Army's retort to Bangladesh 71. It has certainly had its psychological effect. What is stunning is that it had no strategic impact, none at all.

It is probably improper to take this line of thinking and extrapolate it. Those sensitive to such things and willing to look through published information and put down little marks on a map, even a very large-scale map, will readily join the dots and sit with their heads in their hands, although @MastanKhan has shown it as an opportunity, rather than a blanking out of the brain on two sides simultaneously, on a level that invites professional examination by a profession far removed from the military.

As to his overt suggestions of building parity in the large interval between armoured troops and terrorists at one level and a fighting fit air force slowly losing the battle of the budget and forced to look for deterrent capability where once it sought to rule the skies, there is merit, and there is enough merit to scare the willies out of anyone sensible on the other side ready to read the tea leaves. What will happen to this thought is another matter. There is a considerable amount of human psychology mixed into this porridge.



As it happens, that has been noticed. Steps are being taken to, umm, 'de-risk' the situation, to use one of the smarmy phrases beloved of our IT gasbags.



Inhalation? What a way to go!

Nice to see your ratings record.



Balls.

It's lack of brains.



Talk is cheap. Please don't take that personally, it is intended to convey a general weariness with jingoism on the wide screen which makes not the slightest effort to examine the realistic steps to carry out intentions.

@MastanKhan was evaluating realistic options.



Watching this happen in real time has been an astonishing experience.



Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.



Very interesting arithmetic, although honestly speaking, I haven't validated it yet. Have you read about Lanchester diagrams? Do you know about their military applications? Just curious.


Something tells me that you have crossed a threshold and are now fit to take up ministerial responsibility in Pakistan.

Or in India.

You got A for English and B for military philosophy, but this over confidence will seriously hurt you Indians one day. After reading your analysis it felt like Pakistani defense experts are roasting nuts all day. I am quite confident individuals siting in Rawalpindi and Islamabad aren't only eating nuts, they have plans in place too and their plans are apparently successful. There is a reason, despite being 5x larger in size and quite hateful, Indian are still siting with such Shanti. I like how Indian expert boast about their calculations of possible war scenario while miscalculating many factors.