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Why I am not against granting citizenship to Banghalese / Biharise while opposing Afghans.

You are agree with me?

  • Yes

    Votes: 18 60.0%
  • No

    Votes: 8 26.7%
  • Can't say anything.

    Votes: 4 13.3%

  • Total voters
    30
I think there is a danger that Sindh could see a civil war in the future between the Israeli style settlers who think they blessed the land and the native 'Arabs' who are regarded as backward etc and are on way to become minority in their own land.

That is why Gwadar is vital to give norther Pakistan options of alternative routes for im/export. And importing Bihari's or Banglas is equivalent to Israel importing Ethopian Jews to change the demography in their favour making natives a tiny minority. .
Your racism is pathetic. Our ancestors sacrificed for this country as much as other ethnicities. This country was made in the name of Islam, and for Muslims of the entire sub continent, where Iqbal the Punjabi, Jinnah the Gujarati, and GM Syed the Sindhi, stood side by side tocreate it, it was not created in the name of Sindhis and Punjabis, and our ancestors moved here because of that. They were settled on land left behind by hindus, and not on the land of Sindhis. Businessmen like habibs, dawoods etc invested heavily in this country and helped develop its economy. It is the Sindhis who claimed we were land grabbers and outsiders first, we claimed to be Pakistanis. Mqm came wayyy later in late 70s.

First of all majority of Banglas in Karachi are post 1971. In fact mostly 1980s/90s. Under Gen. Zia significant migration took place from India/Bangla in a attempt to offset PPP in Sindh. This was when Gen. Zia nurtured MQM as a riposte to PPP. MQM brough in many thugs from India. Indian connection is well recorded and even RAW was involved. But of course you don't see any of this. Fact is they all hide under the pretext of the original wave of migrants and there is not much you can do to differantiate.

And if you ask any of these people of course they are going to sing pro-Pakistan songs.

First of all majority of Banglas in Karachi are post 1971. In fact mostly 1980s/90s. Under Gen. Zia significant migration took place from India/Bangla in a attempt to offset PPP in Sindh. This was when Gen. Zia nurtured MQM as a riposte to PPP. MQM brough in many thugs from India. Indian connection is well recorded and even RAW was involved. But of course you don't see any of this. Fact is they all hide under the pretext of the original wave of migrants and there is not much you can do to differantiate.

And if you ask any of these people of course they are going to sing pro-Pakistan songs.
Yes, mqm was funded by raw. So was ttp, made of indigenous pashtun tribals, so were baluchi and separatists, again sons of the soil. There are good and bad everywhere, but your hatred blinds you to this fact.
 
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I m sure there are good afghanis... but quiet alot are racial fascists...
I would say most are...

They have them selves to blame for response they are getting
 
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Your racism is pathetic.
It's very easy to shout out' racist'. So can I.

Our ancestors sacrificed for this country as much as other ethnicities.
Why so touchy about this? Did I say otherwise? Although running away from Hindoo's is not sacrifice in my book. Stand and fight is sacrifice. If all the Kashmiri's lock, stock and barrel headed south into Pakistan. I suppose they could also make us all feel guilty?

This country was made in the name of Islam
No it was not. That is just a soundbyte you people love to shout when it suits you. Read my signature. I have appropriated it as well.

Think of Islam. It is a religion. Not a fcukin geography, caste, tribe or ethnicity. It is unversal. It knows no boundaries. Now tell me id a Somali, Afghan, Sudani, Nigerian, Tatar Muslim allowed into the Pakistan of your soundbyte? Or is your Islam only for "Made In India". Your Islam is nothing but a racism dressed as 'Islam'.

You know those Sindhi's are deadbeats. They fought the British valiantly in 1843 but now seem to be sleep. Or I guess their elite have been bought out.
 
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It's very easy to shout out' racist'. So can I.

Why so touchy about this? Did I say otherwise? Although running away from Hindoo's is not sacrifice in my book. Stand and fight is sacrifice. If all the Kashmiri's lock, stock and barrel headed south into Pakistan. I suppose they could also make us all feel guilty?

No it was not. That is just a soundbyte you people love to shout when it suits you. Read my signature. I have appropriated it as well.

Think of Islam. It is a religion. Not a fcukin geography, caste, tribe or ethnicity. It is unversal. It knows no boundaries. Now tell me id a Somali, Afghan, Sudani, Nigerian, Tatar Muslim allowed into the Pakistan of your soundbyte? Or is your Islam only for "Made In India". Your Islam is nothing but a racism dressed as 'Islam'.

You know those Sindhi's are deadbeats. They fought the British valiantly in 1843 but now seem to be sleep. Or I guess their elite have been bought out.
Yeah, there would have been no need to run from the Hindus if Pakistan had not been created. They were angry precisely because India had been partitioned. The people who took part in creating it, migrated to it.l, and then contributed to its growth and prosperity.
And yes it was made in the name of Islam, just because you dont believe it, doesnt make it wrong.

You would probably say the same thing about the Prophet's migration and kuffar as well.

Like I said, your hatred blinds you
 
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Your racism is pathetic. Our ancestors sacrificed for this country as much as other ethnicities. This country was made in the name of Islam, and for Muslims of the entire sub continent, where Iqbal the Punjabi, Jinnah the Gujarati, and GM Syed the Sindhi, stood side by side tocreate it, it was not created in the name of Sindhis and Punjabis, and our ancestors moved here because of that. They were settled on land left behind by hindus, and not on the land of Sindhis. Businessmen like habibs, dawoods etc invested heavily in this country and helped develop its economy. It is the Sindhis who claimed we were land grabbers and outsiders first, we claimed to be Pakistanis. Mqm came wayyy later in late 70s.

Yes, mqm was funded by raw. So was ttp, made of indigenous pashtun tribals, so were baluchi and separatists, again sons of the soil. There are good and bad everywhere, but your hatred blinds you to this fact.

No need to bring old migrants. Its clear bengolis, biharis and afghanis who can’t get citizenship are recent migrants.

Yes some afghanis got illegal CNIC but trust me I doubt they are sleeping well at night. We can cancel their CNIC anytime like already have been done in many cases.
 
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No need to bring old migrants. Its clear bengolis, biharis and afghanis who can’t get citizenship are recent migrants.

Yes some afghanis got illegal CNIC but trust me I doubt they are sleeping well at night. We can cancel their CNIC anytime like already have been done in many cases.
Read his post about old migrants being like Israelis. I was replying to him
 
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Well i have no hate and feeling of disgust for bengalis because it was also our own mistakes and attitude which caused 1971 tragedy.But again granting one a citizenship requires a loyalty to the nation and the spirit of nationalism.Even the most migrant based countries do not grant citizenship if one does not show a loyalty to nation or have any record of hate or dislike towards the host country.Those who are born out of the war from pakistan will never become loyal to Pakistan.
But afghans are our enemies for several decades and we suffered by them for no reason .We did not deserve all what happened to us.
 
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Banghalese and Biharis who choose to stay Pakistanis must be granted citizenship, Afghans are in million while other two in thousands and quite loyal to Pakistan.
If I'm correct Bangalis who were here prior to 1971 retained their citizenship. These illegal Bangladeshis are recent migrants who entered the country illegally.
 
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I think there is a danger that Sindh could see a civil war in the future between the Israeli style settlers who think they blessed the land and the native 'Arabs' who are regarded as backward etc and are on way to become minority in their own land.

That is why Gwadar is vital to give norther Pakistan options of alternative routes for im/export. And importing Bihari's or Banglas is equivalent to Israel importing Ethopian Jews to change the demography in their favour making natives a tiny minority. Interstingly religion is the excuse used.
Thanks for letting people like my family know.. those who literally dropped the first bomb on India in 65 and provided navigational planning for dwarka that we are usurpers. Glad to know our value.
 
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Thanks for letting people like my family know.. those who literally dropped the first bomb on India in 65 and provided navigational planning for dwarka that we are usurpers. Glad to know our value.
You know Oscar, that was not directed at you. Sometimes in these discussions we end up making running statements but please don't take that personally. I have a issue with people who use this "we made Pakistan thing" and think everyone else is indebted to them.
 
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You know Oscar, that was not directed at you. Sometimes in these discussions we end up making running statements but please don't take that personally. I have a issue with people who use this "we made Pakistan thing" and think everyone else is indebted to them.
It may not be “we made Pakistan” but definitely had a big chunk- although in frankness the big chunk came from the part which was ruled like Brown sahibs and subjected to racists like Ayub Khan.

There is no doubting that the migrants formed the core of the educated class, and hence the key bureaucratic structure of early Pakistan. Ethnic manipulation in subsequent years changed that and Bhutto is responsible for the degradation more than anyone.
If the rest of the ethnic class no matter in majority were by nature sheep due to their lack of education, it isn’t the fault of the ethhnic categories that were not sheep and player their part.
Bengalis had a major input into Pakistan versus Punjab, simply because their leadership was more effective at garnering support- that does not mean that Punjabis did or did not want Pakistan but it does mean that Punjabi leadership was not effective or not as dedicated and still playing options. Whether they represented Punjabi sentiments accurately or not is also questionable, but what matters are the key contributors to the cause which every study and book on the subject not
Embellished by the state shows where the core of the movement was and where the push remained.

By that standard, we should state that most of KPK was not for Pakistan due to their reds. Does it reflect on the ethnicity today? No, but it does reflect on history and if one does not acknowledge history, then we are bound to repeat the mistakes as a nation and while it does not effect expats with foriegn citizenships like you and me as compared to someone who may experience the fallout of ethnic hatred properly, it does end up having an impact on our identities.
The same Bengalis against whom rape was used as a tool by certain officers would now laugh if they saw that in the 92 operation against MQM, rape was used again against familes of militant workers.
Did a woman deserve rape because her husband decided to put his party orders above country- orders that may have come from leaders working at the behest of foriegn intelligence agencies but that does not justify raping the wife of that man. These were all brushed under the carpet in the usual mohibbul watani and everyone is a brother.
Manzoor pashteen is only the latest in the long lasting ethnic tensions that rise due to inequality in resource distribution and development, and then hearing sentiments like what you stated.

It is personal, and while most can be objective if sentiments are discussed with logic , not all will take disparaging comments against their ethnicity especially when all they see is metro trains and glitter in one city when their areas lie in deplorable conditions or not even if the fault truly lies with the leadership of those areas.

If you keep calling an ethnic group Indians despite all their contributions then they WILL reach out to external forces who offer “assistance”. If you keep crying regarding leadership of those people when even the leadership of your own ethnicity focuses on stealing and giving privileges to only a few, then those are stones from glass houses.
This country does not change by snide comments on origin or blaming communities on poor leadership but by creating greater harmony at the roots level. I used to laugh at people in Islamabad while I lived there who never visited Karachi and referred to it like some city in another country.

The same applies to other places as well, do we know the conditions of people living in basti malook? Or naudero? Or Hoshab?
Heck do the people of F-8 sector even know about troubles in Awan town?
Or those in DHA Lahore of people in ferozwala?

If we are unable to connect with a community on a level where we see their conditions or work with them to improve it, then what is to be said of leadership?
Leadership broke down in Pakistan when Liaqat Ali Khan could not wait till the Quaid was dead..
so if it is a leadership issue causing ethnic tensions and there are people who can see it, even if they are 2% it falls on them to help the other 98% see it.
 
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It may not be “we made Pakistan” but definitely had a big chunk- although in frankness the big chunk came from the part which was ruled like Brown sahibs and subjected to racists like Ayub Khan.

There is no doubting that the migrants formed the core of the educated class, and hence the key bureaucratic structure of early Pakistan. Ethnic manipulation in subsequent years changed that and Bhutto is responsible for the degradation more than anyone.
If the rest of the ethnic class no matter in majority were by nature sheep due to their lack of education, it isn’t the fault of the ethhnic categories that were not sheep and player their part.
Bengalis had a major input into Pakistan versus Punjab, simply because their leadership was more effective at garnering support- that does not mean that Punjabis did or did not want Pakistan but it does mean that Punjabi leadership was not effective or not as dedicated and still playing options. Whether they represented Punjabi sentiments accurately or not is also questionable, but what matters are the key contributors to the cause which every study and book on the subject not
Embellished by the state shows where the core of the movement was and where the push remained.

By that standard, we should state that most of KPK was not for Pakistan due to their reds. Does it reflect on the ethnicity today? No, but it does reflect on history and if one does not acknowledge history, then we are bound to repeat the mistakes as a nation and while it does not effect expats with foriegn citizenships like you and me as compared to someone who may experience the fallout of ethnic hatred properly, it does end up having an impact on our identities.
The same Bengalis against whom rape was used as a tool by certain officers would now laugh if they saw that in the 92 operation against MQM, rape was used again against familes of militant workers.
Did a woman deserve rape because her husband decided to put his party orders above country- orders that may have come from leaders working at the behest of foriegn intelligence agencies but that does not justify raping the wife of that man. These were all brushed under the carpet in the usual mohibbul watani and everyone is a brother.
Manzoor pashteen is only the latest in the long lasting ethnic tensions that rise due to inequality in resource distribution and development, and then hearing sentiments like what you stated.

It is personal, and while most can be objective if sentiments are discussed with logic , not all will take disparaging comments against their ethnicity especially when all they see is metro trains and glitter in one city when their areas lie in deplorable conditions or not even if the fault truly lies with the leadership of those areas.

If you keep calling an ethnic group Indians despite all their contributions then they WILL reach out to external forces who offer “assistance”. If you keep crying regarding leadership of those people when even the leadership of your own ethnicity focuses on stealing and giving privileges to only a few, then those are stones from glass houses.
This country does not change by snide comments on origin or blaming communities on poor leadership but by creating greater harmony at the roots level. I used to laugh at people in Islamabad while I lived there who never visited Karachi and referred to it like some city in another country.

The same applies to other places as well, do we know the conditions of people living in basti malook? Or naudero? Or Hoshab?
Heck do the people of F-8 sector even know about troubles in Awan town?
Or those in DHA Lahore of people in ferozwala?

If we are unable to connect with a community on a level where we see their conditions or work with them to improve it, then what is to be said of leadership?
Leadership broke down in Pakistan when Liaqat Ali Khan could not wait till the Quaid was dead..
so if it is a leadership issue causing ethnic tensions and there are people who can see it, even if they are 2% it falls on them to help the other 98% see it.
I am aware that you are part of the admin so I am caught between speaking freely or redacting my thoughts. At present I choose to reserve my thoughts but let's see if I can keep that up.
 
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I am aware that you are part of the admin so I am caught between speaking freely or redacting my thoughts. At present I choose to reserve my thoughts but let's see if I can keep that up.
Depends on your thoughts- whether you truly hold ethnic hatred/superiority or ofherwise or simply dispute contributions and events.
 
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Depends on your thoughts- whether you truly hold ethnic hatred/superiority or ofherwise or simply dispute contributions and events.
I will reply to you later as it deserves a considered post as opposed to just shooting of ......
 
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