Why Economists Are Still Baffled by India’s GDP Growth

[Rasengan]

I have a few links - although a bit off topic....

Workers of the Central Pacific Railroad . Transcontinental Railroad . WGBH American Experience | PBS

Chinese Laborers and the Construction of the Central Pacific

Its amazing how these Chinese laborers worked extremely hard and built the foundation of the American dream of economic opportunity for the rest of the population. Obviously their generation has continued successfully and they are respected as accomplish businessman, henceforth its truly confusing to hear the notion that they are lazy from Asif Durrani.

Had attended a webinar on Saturday about how Chinese cooking of growth figures, internal debt etc. is currently the biggest crisis in the world. Thanks to Chinese "achievements", we all stand to lose. So feel proud of your "achievements".

The western propaganda cesspit is irrelevant and the days of manipulation in trying to weaken China are over, because the simple fact is your economy owes them $1.4 trillion. Therefore, if they want to you provide them entertainment in the form of a circus show, where you clap your hands and dance like a retard, then you better make sure that you heed their advice before they bounce you around like a yo-yo.

Hypocrisy is probably ingrained in the DNA of American's who love to preach on the internal affairs of other nations, but forget to mention the rising $19 trillion debt they owe to other countries. America has become a cancer and its effects have spread across the world as evident in the 2008 financial crisis, where generations upon generations will suffer the consequences. China still receives the largest amount of FDI in the world and unlike its western counter-parts the government will have a solution like it did in 2008, when instead of providing quantitative easing they changed the reserve ratio of banks. Yes every Chinese should be proud of their achievements, because within the space of 30 years they have become an economic giant and their name is respected in most countries who appreciate their help instead of conquering them and electing puppets. Have you ever traveled to China? 16,000 KM of High Speed Railway has already been added to China and the technology is so good that the British Chancellor himself came to visit China and personally asked them to invest in the HS2 project in Great Britain.

 

[Kambojaric]

Even after magically adjusting your growth from 4% to 7% overnight, you are still growing at the exact same speed as a $11 trillion economy.

But the economic indicators for India are still poor, same as before Modi's magic revisions.

0.9% increase in cement production? What are you building infrastructure with, coconuts?

Best post in this thread

 

[Rasengan]

The British similarly used Indian indentured labour to provide the world with sugar. Are the Indians supposed to be proud of their quasi-slave heritage on that account?
.

Read my previous correspondence with meticulous care. You specifically mentioned the idea that the Chinese are lazy, however most of the infrastructure produced in the Wild West was because of the laborers who were from the Chinese community, which propelled the advancement of America and made families such as the Rockefeller's and JP Morgan extremely wealthy. Thus you can hardly be in a position to call the Chinese diaspora lazy, because then you sound like a wounded jealous hypocrite. The Indians had a choice in becoming indentured laborers, however the same luxury was absent for the Chinese in America who were sold a fake dream in canton and were forced into servitude as laborers when they reached America.

No, Pakistanis are NOT enemies with the current or any Indian regimes, just as I am sure most Indians are not their enemies. Again, wouldn't it be better if you stayed on topic instead of tried stoking enmity between others? What does a Bangladeshi gain from that?

Clearly you have never been to Pakistan, because most of the population extremely hates the Indian regime with passion and the feeling is mutual from the perspective of India, because counter-arguing this point will simply suggest your naivety on the topic.

 

[Asif Durrani]

Read my previous correspondence with meticulous care. You specifically mentioned the idea that the Chinese are lazy, however most of the infrastructure produced in the Wild West was because of the laborers who were from the Chinese community, which propelled the advancement of America and made families such as the Rockefeller's and JP Morgan extremely wealthy. Thus you can hardly be in a position to call the Chinese diaspora lazy, because then you sound like a wounded jealous hypocrite. The Indians had a choice in becoming indentured laborers, however the same luxury was absent for the Chinese in America who were sold a fake dream in canton and were forced into servitude as laborers when they reached America.

No, I did not say that Chinese are lazy. It was meant as a joke, so stop finessing a point and grow a sense of humour, please. And really, this whole debate is meaningless. No one needs a certificate of being diligent and hard-working from another person. The overwhelming importance of hard work is a nice snake oil pitch for useful idiots, but it is intellectual freedom that has made everything meaningful in this world possible.

......
Clearly you have never been to Pakistan, because most of the population extremely hates the Indian regime with passion and the feeling is mutual from the perspective of India, because counter-arguing this point will simply suggest your naivety on the topic.

What you are doing here is a classic logical fallacy - argument from authority. All you have to support your claim of all-consuming Indo-Pak hatred is your own word and the word of some other hawks on this forum. Your word is not gospel. I know more Pakistanis and Indians personally than you do, and not just online like you, so stop lecturing me on self-evident truths about people who I happen to know more closely than you do.

You are playing a game as old as diplomacy and statecraft itself - divide and rule. Indian against Pakistani, Pakistani against the US, Bangladeshi against Indian. Try fooling those who are newer to these games than you are.

Its amazing how these Chinese laborers worked extremely hard and built the foundation of the American dream of economic opportunity for the rest of the population. Obviously their generation has continued successfully and they are respected as accomplish businessman, henceforth its truly confusing to hear the notion that they are lazy from Asif Durrani.



The western propaganda cesspit is irrelevant and the days of manipulation in trying to weaken China are over, because the simple fact is your economy owes them $1.4 trillion. Therefore, if they want to you provide them entertainment in the form of a circus show, where you clap your hands and dance like a retard, then you better make sure that you heed their advice before they bounce you around like a yo-yo.

Hypocrisy is probably ingrained in the DNA of American's who love to preach other the internal affairs of other nations, but forget to mention the rising $19 trillion debt they owe to other countries. America has become a cancer and its effects have spread across the world as evident in the 2008 financial crisis, where generations upon generations will suffer the consequences. China still receives the largest amount of FDI in the world and unlike its western counter-parts the government will have a solution like it did in 2008, when instead of providing quantitative easing they changed the reserve ratio of banks. Yes every Chinese should be proud of their achievements, because within the space of 30 years they have become an economic giant and their name is respected in most countries who appreciate their help instead of conquering them and electing puppets. Have you ever traveled to China? 16,000 KM of High Speed Railway has already been added to China and the technology is so good that the British Chancellor himself came to visit China and personally asked them to invest in the HS2 project in Great Britain.

Yes, Me-China-Know-Kung fu. I have been to China - Shanghai, Beijing, Shenzen, Dalian, Hong Kong, Macau, Kunming. I saw all the Potemkin villages with smog-filled skies that you so proudly show off to the world. India, and any other country that follows your so-called development model is doomed.
In 2008, when the whole world was contracting, China was doing quantitative easing. So stop lying as if it is one of your silly Party propaganda lectures. So how did you do that? By increasing domestic debt. China's domestic debt has grown from 125% to 207% of GDP (official figures, no doubt fudged) from 2008 to June this year. You keep talking about US treasuries as if you did the US a great favour by allowing for the consumption of goods which your export-driven economy would otherwise never be able to offload. Americans would have easily survived without your cheap TVs and minibars, but would your economy have done okay without the American export market?
Your banking sector is teetering due to its bad debts issue, and there is nothing we can do to help you. You have to stop treating every discussion as an opportunity to highlight the glorious People's Republic and start cleaning up your house.

 

[Rasengan]

No, I did not say that Chinese are lazy. It was meant as a joke, so stop finessing a point and grow a sense of humour, please. And really, this whole debate is meaningless. No one needs a certificate of being diligent and hard-working from another person. The overwhelming importance of hard work is a nice snake oil pitch for useful idiots, but it is intellectual freedom that has made everything meaningful in this world possible.

Well technically you advocated the assumption that the Chinese diaspora in the United States is lazy, because they exhibit the nature of utilization an iPhone for shopping and your attempted gesture of amusement seems unwarranted since nobody shares your dry tasteless humour. You have initiated this particular debate by putting the Indian community in the United States on the pedestal and showing contempt to the success achieved by the Chinese. You have boldly articulated the conjecture that no one needs a certificate of being diligent and hard-working from another person, however practice what you preach because you will sound like a hypocrite. So now you are riposting the notion that hard-work is only useful to idiots, while intellectual freedom has made everything meaningful in this world, which clearly has worked out tremendously for America where obesity and debt levels are extraordinarily high. Intellectual freedom is a myth which even in western countries does not exist properly, due to the intervention of government's to silence the voice of the proletarians.

What you are doing here is a classic logical fallacy - argument from authority. All you have to support your claim of all-consuming Indo-Pak hatred is your own word and the word of some other hawks on this forum. Your word is not gospel. I know more Pakistanis and Indians personally than you do, and not just online like you, so stop lecturing me on self-evident truths about people who I happen to know more closely than you do.

You are playing a game as old as diplomacy and statecraft itself - divide and rule. Indian against Pakistani, Pakistani against the US, Bangladeshi against Indian. Try fooling those who are newer to these games than you are.

Pakistani Public Opinion Ever More Critical of U.S. | Pew Research Center

When your knowledge is zilch on a particular topic, then the next logical step is to research more and then respond adequately to another person, instead of making irrelevant causal remarks of a clown jester. The poll conducted by Pew Global demonstrates the outcome, that the majority in Pakistan regard India as its traditional enemy and this perception has drastically increased further since 2012. Therefore, I will hardly take preaching lessons, from a person who has an identity crisis and is advocating sermons from America. Then you proclaim an illogical analysis of knowing more Pakistani's and Indians than me and have actually become a hypocrite, because you have fallen from the classic logic fallacy- argument from authority. Their is a old Chinese proverb which can describe you perfectly "People with no brain have no cure, when they attempt to catch a fish from a tree". Personally I don't give a flying hoot in who you know, because you don't speak for the whole of Pakistan, when clearly our citizens have no positive view on the Indian Government.

Furthermore, your last paragraph can be summarized by a proverb spoken by Chairman Mao, which has its roots from the Tang dynasty: "Big head with weak legs and sharp tongue with empty stomach". I am playing no game of diplomacy and statecraft, which is linked to divide and rule because my opinion is the ground realities of Pakistan and its citizens who hate the Indian Government. Where exactly did I write that the Pakistani Government is against the United States and Bangladesh? Do you have a fetish for concocting gibberish nonsense and presuming things on others

 

[Asif Durrani]

Well technically you advocated the assumption that the Chinese diaspora in the United States is lazy, because they exhibit the nature of utilization an iPhone for shopping and your attempted gesture of amusement seems unwarranted since nobody shares your dry tasteless humour. You have initiated this particular debate by putting the Indian community in the United States on the pedestal and showing contempt to the success achieved by the Chinese. You have boldly articulated the conjecture that no one needs a certificate of being diligent and hard-working from another person, however practice what you preach because you will sound like a hypocrite. So now you are riposting the notion that hard-work is only useful to idiots, while intellectual freedom has made everything meaningful in this world, which clearly has worked out tremendously for America where obesity and debt levels are extraordinarily high. Intellectual freedom is a myth which even in western countries does not exist properly, due to the intervention of government's to silence the voice of the proletarians.

Are you sure you are not a Communist Party bot prepping to attempt the Turing Test? You do realize that your standard propaganda jargon from the Little Red Book has been the butt of jokes for several decades now, and still you persist....

The comment about Chinese obsession with the iPhone was a) a joke; b) made in response to the initial generalization about Indians being lazy and undisciplined. It's called depiction by example. You see - generalization in return for a generalization. Now I have contributed something to your memory bank, so that you may just pass that Turing test after all!

About the rest of your Little Red Book speech, yes, I also love Mao. Happy?

........
When your knowledge is zilch on a particular topic, then the next logical step is to research more and then respond adequately to another person, instead of making irrelevant causal remarks of a clown jester. The poll conducted by Pew Global demonstrates the outcome, that the majority in Pakistan regard India as its traditional enemy and this perception has drastically increased further since 2012. Therefore, I will hardly take preaching lessons, from a person who has an identity crisis and is advocating sermons from America. Then you proclaim an illogical analysis of knowing more Pakistani's and Indians than me and have actually become a hypocrite, because you have fallen from the classic logic fallacy- argument from authority. Their is a old Chinese proverb which can describe you perfectly "People with no brain have no cure, when they attempt to attack a fish from a tree". Personally I don't give a flying hoot in who you know, because you don't speak for the whole of Pakistan, when clearly our citizens have no positive view on the Indian Government.

Furthermore, your last paragraph can be summarized by a proverb spoken by Chairman Mao, which has its roots from the Tang dynasty: "Big head with weak legs and sharp tongue with empty stomach". I am playing no game of diplomacy and statecraft, which is linked to divide and rule because my opinion is the ground realities of Pakistan and its citizens who hate the Indian Government. Where exactly did I write that the Pakistani Government is against the United States and Bangladesh? Do you have a fetish for concocting gibberish nonsense and presuming things on others

There are also Pew research polls that show how Chinese people resent their totalitarian government. I don't see you posting those....

The fact that you post a quote from Tinpot Mao, murderer of 45 million Chinese, tells me all I want to know. Now go away Chinese autobot!!!

..........

QUOTE]

Actually don't go away as yet. I changed my mind. Just that I have never actually had a discussion with a CPC/PRC bot before. So just assume I am giving you the aforementioned Turing test.

Riddle me this:
1. What would someone acting as a spokesperson for a totalitarian dictatorship know about public opinion?
2. Why is China a totalitarian dictatorship? In which exercise of public franchise did the CPC find out that the Chinese people do not need democracy like the rest of the civilized world does?

Your time starts now....

Well technically you advocated the assumption that the Chinese diaspora in the United States is lazy, because they exhibit the nature of utilization an iPhone for shopping and your attempted gesture of amusement seems unwarranted since nobody shares your dry tasteless humour. You have initiated this particular debate by putting the Indian community in the United States on the pedestal and showing contempt to the success achieved by the Chinese. You have boldly articulated the conjecture that no one needs a certificate of being diligent and hard-working from another person, however practice what you preach because you will sound like a hypocrite. So now you are riposting the notion that hard-work is only useful to idiots, while intellectual freedom has made everything meaningful in this world, which clearly has worked out tremendously for America where obesity and debt levels are extraordinarily high. Intellectual freedom is a myth which even in western countries does not exist properly, due to the intervention of government's to silence the voice of the proletarians.

.............

When your knowledge is zilch on a particular topic, then the next logical step is to research more and then respond adequately to another person, instead of making irrelevant causal remarks of a clown jester. The poll conducted by Pew Global demonstrates the outcome, that the majority in Pakistan regard India as its traditional enemy and this perception has drastically increased further since 2012. Therefore, I will hardly take preaching lessons, from a person who has an identity crisis and is advocating sermons from America. Then you proclaim an illogical analysis of knowing more Pakistani's and Indians than me and have actually become a hypocrite, because you have fallen from the classic logic fallacy- argument from authority. Their is a old Chinese proverb which can describe you perfectly "People with no brain have no cure, when they attempt to attack a fish from a tree". Personally I don't give a flying hoot in who you know, because you don't speak for the whole of Pakistan, when clearly our citizens have no positive view on the Indian Government.

Furthermore, your last paragraph can be summarized by a proverb spoken by Chairman Mao, which has its roots from the Tang dynasty: "Big head with weak legs and sharp tongue with empty stomach". I am playing no game of diplomacy and statecraft, which is linked to divide and rule because my opinion is the ground realities of Pakistan and its citizens who hate the Indian Government. Where exactly did I write that the Pakistani Government is against the United States and Bangladesh? Do you have a fetish for concocting gibberish nonsense and presuming things on others

Actually don't go away as yet. I changed my mind. Just that I have never actually had a discussion with a CPC/PRC bot before. So just assume I am giving you the aforementioned Turing test.

Riddle me this:
1. What would someone acting as a spokesperson for a totalitarian dictatorship know about public opinion?
2. Why is China a totalitarian dictatorship? In which exercise of public franchise did the CPC find out that the Chinese people do not need democracy like the rest of the civilized world does?

Your time starts now....

 

[Rasengan]

Yes, Me-China-Know-Kung fu. I have been to China - Shanghai, Beijing, Shenzen, Dalian, Hong Kong, Macau, Kunming. I saw all the Potemkin villages with smog-filled skies that you so proudly show off to the world. India, and any other country that follows your so-called development model is doomed.
In 2008, when the whole world was contracting, China was doing quantitative easing. So stop lying as if it is one of your silly Party propaganda lectures. So how did you do that? By increasing domestic debt. China's domestic debt has grown from 125% to 207% of GDP (official figures, no doubt fudged) from 2008 to June this year. You keep talking about US treasuries as if you did the US a great favour by allowing for the consumption of goods which your export-driven economy would otherwise never be able to offload. Americans would have easily survived without your cheap TVs and minibars, but would your economy have done okay without the American export market?
Your banking sector is teetering due to its bad debts issue, and there is nothing we can do to help you. You have to stop treating every discussion as an opportunity to highlight the glorious People's Republic and start cleaning up your house.

The Shaolin Monks and the priest of Wudan School must have thrashed you thoroughly, when you attempted to make a pathetic dry joke Clearly you have never been to Dalian because its a famous summer resort city, where retired general often live there and pollution is not considered terrible. You cannot preach to the Chinese that their cities are polluted because the same accusation can be applied to America, which has some of the worst polluted cities in the world.

11 U.S. Cities With the Worst Air Pollution - Health.com

Well clearly your knowledge on India is severely lacking because their cities are also full of pollution where their citizens breath in harmful air. Lets also not forget the river Ganges, which is regarded as one of the most polluted rivers in the entire world. The development model of China has worked splendidly where 600 million citizens have arisen from poverty over a span of 30 years and the level of infrastructure development has been top class. 16000 KM of High Speed Railway, the amount of expressway's even eclipses America and in general the transportation system is in very good condition.


India's Air Pollution Is So Bad It's Causing Lung Damage in Kids

For your kind information I am a proud Pakistani One of the main differences between China and its western counter-parts during the financial crisis can be observed when the Chinese Central Bank changed the regulation of reserve ratios, which was a unique policy at the time. Furthermore the Chinese Government did major structural reforms in its economy by shifting its attention to 10 main industries to increase internal demand rather than the reliance on just external demand. In addition the Government of China initiated the internalization of the Renminbi in 2009-10, which had positive effects on the economy. The Chinese Government did fiscal expansion of $4 trillion Yuan in which most of it was allocated to construction projects instead of bailing out companies like in America and this generated millions of jobs. Most of the money was generated by local banks and provincial governments who used the money for appropriate project schemes. Well clearly the American's were interested to purchase export-driven products from China, because your government opted to buy from the Chinese and playing the hypothesis game is useless, because history clearly favored the Chinese and your whining did not change that particular outcome. Some of the biggest banks in the world reside in China and they generate good profits. In fact Agricultural Bank of China who I worked for previously had the biggest IPO in the world in Hong Kong and this was only eclipsed by Alibaba, which is also another Chinese company China Construction Bank, ICBC, China Bank and Agricultural Bank of China have the one best profit sheets in the banking sector. ICBC has a profit margin of 275.8 billion yuan in 2014.

 

[GreenApple]

Oh yeah anything critical about Modi is against India... Right

No....but 99%of the time..Modi and India are on the same side..
..but because of your narrow or Islamist haven't appreciated him for the hundred of good he has done.
..Stop workshiping fallwn Gods..
..

 

[Rasengan]

Are you sure you are not a Communist Party bot prepping to attempt the Turing Test? You do realize that your standard propaganda jargon from the Little Red Book has been the butt of jokes for several decades now, and still you persist....
..

Confucius had a famous proverb which can describe your emotional mindset: "We should feel sorrow, but not sink under its oppression, the heart of a wise man should resemble a mirror, which reflects every object without being sullied by any". In your blind rage of failing to counter-argument by viewpoint, you have accused me of being a member of the Communists Party of China You do realize that in America and in Pakistan in particular you are regarded as a coconut, where you attempt to act and behave more white than the white man itself, hence why you have an identity crisis and need to see a psychiatrists before you go crazy and take a machine gun to a school and kill innocent people and your self in the process.

 

[HariPrasad]

LOL, Indian members are always questioning our GDP figures.

Now the whole world is questioning India's GDP figures.

IMF to examine India’s ‘puzzling’ growth data | The Financial Express

Modi's "special revisions" did not actually change any of the underlying economic indicators, which are performing poorly as usual. It just marked up the overall growth rate significantly.

Overnight, his revisions changed India's growth rate from 4% to around 7%. But none of the actual economic indicators changed at all, they are still the same as they were when India's growth was 4%.

Is this something we have questioned>

Local governments inflated China’s GDP by $900 billion last year—and that’s not going to stop soon - Quartz

 

[Rasengan]

The comment about Chinese obsession with the iPhone was a) a joke; b) made in response to the initial generalization about Indians being lazy and undisciplined. It's called depiction by example. You see - generalization in return for a generalization. Now I have contributed something to your memory bank, so that you may just pass that Turing test after all!

About the rest of your Little Red Book speech, yes, I also love Mao. Happy?
.

The initial generalization made by Bilal about Indians being lazy and undisciplined was in reference to Indians in India and not the diaspora in America who have citizenship in your country. Its funny and extremely amusing that you regard me as Chinese, when I am a proud patriotic Pakistani. You don't have to love Chairman Mao, because even in China some of his policies have been criticized. Their is a famous proverb in respect to this notion: "Mao gave China revolution, while Deng Xiaoping put food on the table".

 

[HariPrasad]

Reported.

India does not have a democracy. It has a semblance of a democracy meant to prop up extremists. Enough said.

We have a democracy but the people living in great democracy like Bd will see semblance democracy in India. naturally.

Well you have to have regard for poor people. You have to have kindness in your heart for those less fortunate than you and a desire to uplift your poor so they can live for a better day. In India nobody gives two hoots for poor people who are the lower caste and minorities mostly.

They are however busy with useless showcase projects like MARS and LUNAR missions. These projects are great for ministers getting kickbacks.

The poverty reduction, sanitation improvement and micro-finance movements were started in Bangladesh more than some twenty years ago. The idea was that you have to build up your human resources along with your infrastructure - otherwise development will only benefit the rich. The gap between rich and poor is so high in the subcontinent. We all know about the horrible poverty and starving masses. At least in Bangladesh we try to do something about it.

The Nobel prize winner Amartya Sen had an interview which is very interesting (with English subtitles) where he spoke about the differences between India and Bangladesh,

I remember when I was in eighth grade I had an assignment to go to the slums to teach kids basic math. It was part of my grade. Then in tenth grade I had to buddy up with another kid from a disadvantaged family and make sure he graduated with me.

Look at infant mortality alone,

This article was published in 2012 in 'The Hindu' - a leading Daily in India by Jairam Ramesh, Union Minister for Rural Development in India back then.

Heard of the ‘Bangladesh shining’ story?

The country has shown that it is possible to have superior social outcomes at lower per capita incomes and rates of economic growth.

Bangladesh is very much in the news these days in our country, but for the wrong reasons. In the unfortunate Bangladesh-bashing that seems to have become somewhat of a pastime, we seem to have failed to notice the striking developmental success that it has had in the last few decades, compared with some high-profile Indian States.

Consider this. Bangladesh is considerably “poorer” than India going by GDP alone — its GDP per capita (adjusted for purchasing power parity) in 2010 was only $1,585, roughly half of India’s ($3,419) and less than a third of Gujarat’s ($5,098) and Haryana’s ($5,434). But how is Bangladesh doing on social dimensions compared to some of our “richer” States?

Let us start with the status of children. In almost every standard indicator of child development, Bangladesh is doing better than some of the richer Indian States.

The infant mortality rate and the under-five mortality rate in Bangladesh is better than 13 large Indian States, including much richer Indian States like Gujarat, Haryana and Himachal Pradesh.

The proportion of children that are underweight is also lower in Bangladesh compared to six Indian States, including richer Gujarat where the Chief Minister has now come up with a truly bizarre explanation for the prevalence of malnutrition there.

Interestingly, Bangladesh’s Total Fertility Rate, which measures the children born per woman, is 2.2 (which is nearly the “replacement rate”) and lower than 10 large Indian States, including Gujarat (2.5) and Haryana (2.3). Even when it comes to access to improved sanitation, Bangladesh again does better than every large Indian State other than Kerala, Punjab, Himachal Pradesh and West Bengal.

What does all this data tell us? Clearly, Bangladesh demonstrates that it is possible to have superior social outcomes at lower per capita incomes and lower rates of economic growth. There is more to social development than just GDP. So why has Bangladesh done so well?

TWO ARGUMENTS

Let us first examine the arguments of the naysayers. One set of sceptics would argue that Bangladesh simply “exports its poverty” to India, especially to our Northeast. But even if one believes the most exaggerated statistics of Bangladeshi migration to India, not more than five to six per cent of Bangladeshis seek their livelihoods in our country.

The second argument of the naysayers is that Bangladesh’s data is fudged or exaggerated by the donor community to justify its larger than life presence in the country. However, doctoring national data at such scale is simply not possible in today’s day and age of scrutiny by academics, researchers and sceptics.

So how might have Bangladesh done it? Spending has something to do with it. As Jean Drèze has argued, the public health expenditure as a proportion of the GDP in Bangladesh has been much higher than in India until a few years ago.

Another clear lesson is that grassroot institutions seem to matter. One of the major reasons for the success of Bangladesh has been social mobilisation at the local level, such as through women’s self-help groups (SHG), which has led to increased public awareness and greater accountability in service delivery. A lot of this has been facilitated by robust and effective development NGOs that have achieved scale — in fact, Bangladesh is perhaps the best case study of NGO success anywhere in the world. As scholars have argued, NGOs are involved at scale in virtually every development activity in the country, including education, health, poverty alleviation, etc. NGOs may have “broad-based” social development in Bangladesh, as some have argued, since they have primarily worked with the poor through social campaigns, but this phenomenon may be unique to Bangladesh, as state institutions may be weaker, as compared to countries like India, and NGOs may be filling up that space.

Nevertheless, there are lessons for India — effective grassroot institutions matter for service delivery. In the Indian context, financially and administratively empowering the Panchayati Raj institutions, with their 2,50,000 gram panchayats, and 30 lakh elected representatives (of which 12 lakh are women) is critical. This is not happening on any significant scale. Similarly, the 30 lakh women’s SHGs (that we hope to increase to 70 lakh in the next five years through the National Rural Livelihoods Mission — Aajeevika), could play a major role in improving social outcomes. But for this to happen, we will need to ensure that these SHGs are linked to banks and involved in service delivery, as in Andhra Pradesh.

ENHANCING CONNECTIVITY

Currently, 80 per cent of all credit to SHGs goes to the four southern States of India — Andhra Pradesh, Tamil Nadu, Karnataka and Kerala — and this needs to be broad-based nationally. In addition, we need to enhance rural connectivity — the Pradhan Mantri Gram Sadak Yojna (PMGSY), a major success in connecting habitations above 500 population with pucca roads, needs to scaled up to connect smaller habitations. Sanitation and hygiene have to undergo a veritable revolution, given their multiplier effects on reducing child mortality and malnutrition, enhancing economic productivity, and upholding the dignity of women.

Clearly we must not settle for lower GDP growth rates in India. Indeed, the data shows that there is a clear positive correlation between GDP and social development indicators. More importantly, continued high rates of GDP growth are required for generating resources to invest in health and education, and sustaining the investments on the required scale.

But what Bangladesh’s experience shows is that we don’t have to wait for that high economic growth to trigger social transformations. Robust grassroot institutions can achieve much that money can’t buy.

Heard of the ‘Bangladesh shining’ story? - The Hindu

Take back your 20 mn refugees who have crossed the border for 2 time food. We shall praise your economic development.

 

[Rasengan]

There are also Pew research polls that show how Chinese people resent their totalitarian government. I don't see you posting those....

The fact that you post a quote from Tinpot Mao, murderer of 45 million Chinese, tells me all I want to know. Now go away Chinese autobot!!!..

Your knowledge reminds me of a peasant in a village who has no clue and intellectual understanding on the world around him. Chairman Mao was extremely famous for his poetry because most of his proverbs have deep rooted links to the scholars of the Tang Dynasty. His polices may have indirectly or directly murdered millions during the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution, however it cannot be denied that he was gifted with his poetry. Go and serve a client in your taxi in America, instead of wasting precious internet bandwidth

Actually don't go away as yet. I changed my mind. Just that I have never actually had a discussion with a CPC/PRC bot before. So just assume I am giving you the aforementioned Turing test.

Riddle me this:
1. What would someone acting as a spokesperson for a totalitarian dictatorship know about public opinion?
2. Why is China a totalitarian dictatorship? In which exercise of public franchise did the CPC find out that the Chinese people do not need democracy like the rest of the civilized world does?

Your time starts now....

Now Mr. Coconut you sound like a petulant child who did not receive a lollipop from the teacher I am a proud Pakistani and I will never hide my appreciation of China, because some of my best friends who I regard as my brothers come from Chengdu, Shanghai, Kunming, Dalian, Beijing, Guangzhou, Dangdong, Suzhou ect.

1. This is your perception that the CCP government is a totalitarian regime, when clearly even within the party itself their are three main factions. The Chinese have democratic elections at the grass root level of village politics where people are elected by the people. Why Should China follow a system based on western ideology when it can implement a system based on Chinese characteristics that have been used for the last 5000 years.

2. This is where your knowledge is very limited and its best to be silent on the subject. China follows the philosophy of legalism which was introduced during Emperor Huang Di era, while Confucius is focused on morality, attitudes, behavior, manners of the general public in reference to their government. Until your tiny electron brain cannot understand this assumption, then its best to do more research on the topic. There was no difference between Chiang-Kai-Shek and Chairman Mao, because both were the students of Sun-Yat-Sen and both were totalitarian in nature.

 

[hexagonsnow]

I've been to Beijing, Shanghai and Guangdong mostly - on business. Been to Kunming also for a few days - passing through on my way to Dhaka.

In China people are very hospitable to Bangladeshi people and I reciprocate their good gesture and fellow-feeling.

A lot of uneducated extremist Indian posters here have never seen China, they have no clue - so I was trying to tell them what China has become....




How old are you kid?

Pitching some residential towers up 60 floors (that too only in a few places like Gurgaon or north of Mumbai) does not equate to progress. This has got to be a joke with the pictures you showed - because that last bridge is not in India. And those shopping places and office towers are common across all our countries.

Progress means -

1. The rate of education,
2. The rate of sanitation (Bathrooms),
3. The rate of immunization to common diseases (polio etc.), and
4. The rate of mortality

is better than your neighbor (Bangladesh) with half your GDP.

Progress also means that farmers don't have to kill themselves with pesticide because they could not pay their loans.

In any case - I don't like measuring progress by pictures of buildings and bridges.

Talk with some arrogant indians need time ,maybe they just poor guy ,didnt know how the world is going to change rapidly.

 

[CHN Bamboo]

all the Potemkin villages with smog-filled skies

Recently changed a lot,thx.
※However,India remain what it is,dirty air and polluted water.