Your desperation to raise a strawman is reaching new heights of absurdity. 'ORBATs, disposititioning of forces and their capabilities' or 'the difference between a RAPID and a standard infantry division' are just as relevant to the topic at hand as is the colour of Santa Clause's underwear.
This 'strawman' approach from my side was because of
your 'indepth' analysis and 'thorough understanding' of military affairs. Here's an instance where you informed us as regards to the 'insight' that you possess in such matters:
All of IA is not deployed along the Indo-Pak border. They are in their barracks far away from the borders. What else do you expect GoI to do? Dismantle it's war machine
Hence the simple question; "if you knew anything about:
1-'dispositioning of troops',
2-'employment of the same'
and the
3-'actual deployment of forces'...??"
Because, to me it seemed as if someone who thinks that an army sitting inside barracks and it's positioning 'away' from the border (the one where it is likely to employed and/or deployed) poses no threat to the other side, is stupid.
Armies dont stay at borders 24/7, unless the terrain is disputed (the LoC, LAC etc), if that's what you meant by saying that the IA poses no threat as it sits inside barracks without getting deployed!
It is the
positioning of troops,
their bias (towards a particular side/direction) and the
equipment/capability (Armour Divisions/Brigades, Engineer Stores (required for Bridging, Assault across water obstacles etc) they hold, DURING PEACE TIME that tells someone about the real intent and help them quantify the (volume of) threat. This understanding, my dear, was what you lacked and still do!
Troops positions (during peace time) are based on two notions:
1) They are positioned away from their likely deployment areas in terms of
TIME i.e. how much time they would take to reach the perceived deployment area (DA);
or either
2) They are positioned in terms of
SPACE i.e. ho much terrain is to be traversed when they finally has to move towards their DAs
To make it simple for your tiny brain to understand, here's a tip;
It is always advisable to position troops (away from the DA, if required) in terms of TIME in Mountainous Terrain as compared to in terms of SPACE, because a company/battalion may only be 4 kms (SPACE) away but it may take them days (TIME) to reach the DAs. Hence the calculation in terms of TIME and not SPACE.
Now, go back, rummage through the IA's peace time localities and then come back, because now (as more learned you are - say thanx to your teacher Ustad Xeric) you may be able to add something useful to this thread!
Ok.
The question regarding the difference between a RAPID and a Std Inf Div was also related. Because if you had known the difference (which i still presume you dont and thus the rants), you would have clearly known what (specific) message it would send across the border when if a RAPID is deployed/employed/poised (at a peace location) INSTEAD of a Std Inf Division.
To understand this, one need to understand the difference between the two (RAPID and Std Inf Division), so to quote it from an open source:
Indian RAPIDS
"The antecedents of the Reorganized Plains Infantry Division (RAPID) lie in decisions taken about 15 years ago. The bulk of the forces facing Pakistan in the plains were infantry. Army Plan 2000, formulated in 1985, called for the wholesale mechanization of all plains forces with the exception of seven divisions, which would consist of a mix of armor and infantry. These could be utilized in sectors unsuitable for pure mechanized/armor formations, for example, in the Jammu-Samba-Pathankot sector (Indian XVI Corps), and in the increasingly built-up areas of the North Punjab (Indian XI Corps). These divisions were called RAPID.......
.......The original RAPIDs concept, tested in Exercise Brasstacks (winter, 1986/87), made the following changes in a standard plains infantry division:
- Mechanizing one of the division's three brigades, by putting the division's tank regiment into the brigade, and adding a second tank regiment plus a BMP battalion.
- Adding a Reconnaissance and Support Battalion of two R and S companies and a Surveillance company.
- Exchanging the division artillery brigade's battery of 12 120mm mortars for an 122mm rocket battery.
- Adding an anti-aircraft gun battery.
- Attaching 3-4 heavy attack helicopters and an anti-tank company to the division.
- Adding a Surveillance and Target Acquisition Battery to Divarty, as well as boosting the capabilities of the HQ Battery.
These relatively small changes greatly enhanced the plains division's firepower, mobility, and surveillance capability,....."
Now assuming that you have understood the difference between a RAPID and a Std Inf Div (though i doubt it), i will go a bit further. Now what difference could possibly the deployment or peace locationing of a RAPID would make instead of a Std Inf Div? So, one of a very basic assessment (a very very basic one which dont require a rocket scientist but a mota dimagh like myself)
can be;
that if a RAPID is poised against an enemy as opposed to a Std Inf Div, it may mean that the IA may plan on taking/retain the capability to undertake a
limited offensive (Limited to the particular theater of war, not your COAS' brain-fart regarding THE Limited Offensive - Gosh! it seems as if i am teaching Kindergartens!!!) , say thanks to the
2 x armored regiments and
2 x mechanized battalions, an
122mm rocket battery, and additional an
anti-aircraft gun battery, an additional
3-4 heavy attack helicopters and an
anti-tank company - which are missing in a SID, and which a SID is not capable of doing!!!
So see, how knowing about ORBAT, positioning, dispostioning and capabilities can help someone make use of his brain in a better way and actually talk in terms of tangibles and not brain-farts (re-the 'irrelevant question of mine regarding "the colour of Santa Clause's underwear.")
So now you got it, eh?
No?
This is just one example and a very basic analysis (though you can confirm it from the likes of Tik Tama Toya - oops he's banned
), but the you get the overall picture, right?
This was just to put across my point that WITHOUT having knowledge about the capabilities and limitation of forces and the equipment they hold (for instance the question of difference between RAPID and a SID), it is naive of you to come here and debate this topic out!
So, let's repeat what we have learned today, here;
- It is NOT the deployed forces that poses a threat, ONLY.
- The dispositioning of troops during peace time, their bias towards a particular sector and the equipment/capability (hint: the difference of tanks, anti-taank weapons, anti aircraft weapons, artillery fire power etc between a RAPID and SID) that it holds, is the foot-rule that is made use for threat assessment. (Please counter-check this from other militaries before come back and rant you way out.)
To understand this better, see the following (ignore the news and just concentrate, if you can, on the bold parts, they amply explain how 'dispositions' work):
www./iaf-to-deploy-two-squadrons-of-su-30mki-fighter-near-pakistan-border
"The Indian Air Force will deploy two squadrons of Su-30MKI fighters near the Pakistani border said South Western Air Command chief Air Marshal A K Gogoi. AM Gogoi gave a time frame of 2 years for the completion of the deployment. The two air bases are Jodhpur in Rajasthan and Halwara air base in Punjab. Jodhpur is scheduled to be the first Su-30MKI base near the Pakistan border. IAF has also begun regular Su-30 MKI practice flights from Leh air base in Jammu and Kashmir said AM Gogoi. Leh is a high altitude air base.
IAF has deployed SU-30 MKIs in Lohegaon and Bareilly, which can also cover Pakistan. On the Chinese front, the SU-30 MKIs have been deployed in Tezpur and Chabua in Assam. Su-30 MKIs also operate from Andaman and Nicobar Islands."
This is a repeat announcement, but with a time frame. In 2008, similar announcement was made and no time frame was given. Last year, IAF had inaugurated the Phalodi air field in Rajasthan and mentioned that SU-30 MKIs will be stationed in the base. This time, there was no reference to it.
i hope this would give you some insight to as to how "peace time" localities, "inside the barracks" and "not deployed troops" actually pose a threat to someone!!
That is an uncannily accurate self-assessment. Congratulations.
i'll take it as a compliment. Also, please feel free to quote me on this.
OK, I will spoon feed you. But be warned that the following passage might just be a little too lengthy for your attention span.
^^Spoon feed...yeah right! (see above)
The argument forwarded by a member was that since '80%' of IA is Pakistan oriented, India therefore is a threat. It was explained that India has its reasons. There is a genuine and severe trust deficit against Pakistan, accumulated for over 60 years, through some well documented Pakistan initiated conflicts, and unless it is addressed to the satisfaction of GoI, '80%' of IA will not move from where they are. And, right on cue, began the goal post shifting. It was asked, perhaps in a poor attempt at cynicism, when PA is busy somewhere else, with 'significant' reduction of troops in it's east, what's the point of having '80%' of IA reserved for Pakistan? It was in this context that the earlier comment was made to illustrate the point, in not so many words, that '80%' of IA are where they have always been during peace time - which incidentally never thwarted Pakistan from indulging in pointless adventurism - with no demonstrable evidence or indication that they are in any way preparing to sneak an attack. That specific question therefore is moot, in the context of Pakistan's perception of India being the primary threat, because India is diligently maintaining the status quo.
Bottomline: IA will continue to be reserved for Pakistan till the trust deficit has been made good of, or at least an honest attempt in that direction has been made, by Pakistan.
Try reading these and it may shove some sense into your brains:
http://www.pakdef.info/pids/pids2/research/indiaswarplan.html
Pakistan Centric: 'The Indian Army' - Analysis