Where is Terrorist ? As a war against Islam !

[PeaceGen]

There is no such thing as a peaceful translation or non-peaceful translation. Translation is simply what the text says.

there is. translation is simply what the text says. if that translation ends up not calling for violence towards other religions, and allows their followers to start living according to what another translation or even religion recommends, then it's a non-peaceful translation.

if the translation has language in it that is clearly hate-mongering or even the approval of conversion-by-force towards muslims who follow another translation, or the approval of religious violence of any kind (including stoning as punishment for adultery for instance), then i'm going to call that translation and all it's followers a non-peaceful flavor of Islam, possibly an oppressive flavor of Islam.

Just cut out the 'peacefully-living' part and you are right.

People who follow a peaceful Quran translation, usually end up actually peaceful people.
I've noticed this on a several forums with large Muslim audiences.

BS.

Discussing the evidence and it's validity / trust-worhty-ness, is going to take a month out of my life at least.
I'll just leave you your opinion, and stick to my own opinions over here.

But feel free to prove your claim of 'BS'.

Those states are all Western puppets.

Western allies. Hardly puppets.

 

[GiannKall]

Colonialism... Let's hope you're mis-informed, and not actually lying out of your own choice.

When you indefinitely occupy countries like Afghanistan and Somalia, this is colonialism.

Every escalation in the war on terror was initiated by muslims.
Ever since we (agreed, mostly western nations and their many allies) decided to hand the Israelis their home country as defined in THEIR holy book.

And do you mind if we retain our ability to supply our supermarkets and run the rest of our economies?
Muslims should, especially by now, know better than to (threaten to) use the price of oil as "leverage" like they've tried too many times.

I can write a "holy book" and claim that all Europe is mine and all Europeans should be kicked out. The book makes my argument valid? Israel is a colonial British invention that was created in order for them to have a base in Middle East

 

[PeaceGen]

When you indefinitely occupy countries like Afghanistan and Somalia, this is colonialism.

There's a peace proces going as we speak in Afghanistan, with direct talks between the Taliban and the USA now becoming regular.

I can write a "holy book" and claim that all Europe is mine and all Europeans should be kicked out. The book makes my argument valid? Israel is a colonial British invention that was created in order for them to have a base in Middle East

not all holy books are valid of course.
but holy books actually used to live their daily lives with, for over thousands over years, and recognized by other major faiths as being an acknowledged Holy Book,
like the one the Jews have,
that's gotta be treated much differently from some holy book that's cooked up yesterday.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Only Muslims who know the original Arabic of the Quran can comment on translations of the original text.

There is no such thing as peaceful/non-peaceful translation.

Non-Muslims should cease trying to create new categories for Muslims or our holy texts.

All such nonsense terms like Islamist, Islamism, Jihadist, Fundamentalist, Moderate, Extremist should be thrown into oblivion.

There are only Muslims who follow the Quran and Hadith, and those who do not.

Sunni, Shia, Sunni, Salafi fall in the first category.

Daesh and it’s ilk fall in the second.

When you indefinitely occupy countries like Afghanistan and Somalia, this is colonialism.

100%. Yet to some people drone attacking toddlers is freedom.

 

[gambit]

Non-Muslims should cease trying to create new categories for Muslims or our holy texts.

All such nonsense terms like Islamist, Islamism, Jihadist, Fundamentalist, Moderate, Extremist should be thrown into oblivion.

Ain't gonna happen.

For starter, if you -- meaning the Muslims collective and not YOU personally -- are able to control the various diversities within your community, then the non-Muslims would follow your admonition.

But that control is also ain't gonna happen. Simply put, Muslims are as human as non-Muslims. Some inevitably will have their own interpretations of the Quran and go their own ways. We -- the non-Muslims -- are under no obligations to even try to distinguish out who is/are the 'real' Muslims and who is/are not. You can yell at us until you are blue in the faces and we will still call you and them 'Muslims'. We have enough problems with our own religionists and we also categorize ours in the same terms that you called 'nonsense'.

 

[Adonis]

Until we realize the truth that every Muslim is and only ever be the loyal supporter of another Muslim, we will keep facing humiliations due to our own worldliness and cowardice. We have to unite together, its the only way.

That's is the biggest problem...seeing everyone from the lens of religion. Why can't you see other non-Muslim as a human being but as a Christian, Jew, Buddhist etc etc.....

Fact is all humans are born with some sinful attributes, such as greed,lust, envy, anger, ego etc...so irrespective of ones religion, these traits are common among us...and they are going to stay...they drive us all.. These attributes in a man has led to Rise and fall of empires, driven progress, economic system, wars, conflicts etc.....If you are asking them to be suppressed/controlled using any religion teachings..not gonna happen.

And these very attributes inside a man (call them Muslims) makes Iran fight with Iraq, Sunni with Shia, create sects within Islam....Make one king or mullah envy other, fuels their egos..make Muslim feel superior to non-Muslims based on their believes thus creating rift between religions. The way is to treat everyone as human and keen religion inside your house ...don't judge the world based on your believes.

 

[YeBeWarned]

It was about Islam from the beginning ..

 

[KhalaiMakhlooq]

Bush should have bombed Saudi Arabia (fifteen 9/11 hijackers), United Arab Emirates (two 9/11 hijackers), Lebanon (one 9/11 hijacker) and Egypt (one 9/11 hijacker). Not Afghanistan.

 

[gambit]

Bush should have bombed Saudi Arabia (fifteen 9/11 hijackers), United Arab Emirates (two 9/11 hijackers), Lebanon (one 9/11 hijacker) and Egypt (one 9/11 hijacker). Not Afghanistan.

So far, the governments listed were not involved in any official capacity.

Al-Qaeda is a transnational organization whose memberships came from many source countries. Afghanistan under Mullah Omar gave Al-Qaeda refuge and protection.

According to common understanding of the rules of war, which eventually codified into the Geneva Convention, a claimed neutral state lose protected status the moment it allowed its territory to be used by any belligerent in a conflict.

https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/appl...85e344e491c102e5c125641e003934b7?OpenDocument

Article 1. The territory of neutral Powers is inviolable.

Art. 2. Belligerents are forbidden to move troops or convoys of either munitions of war or supplies across the territory of a neutral Power.

Art. 3. Belligerents are likewise forbidden to:
(a) Erect on the territory of a neutral Power a wireless telegraphy station or other apparatus forthe purpose of communicating with belligerent forces on land or sea;
(b) Use any installation of this kind established by them before the war on the territory of a neutral Power for purely military purposes, and which has not been opened for the service of public messages.

Art. 4. Corps of combatants cannot be formed nor recruiting agencies opened on the territory of a neutral Power to assist the belligerents.

Art. 5. A neutral Power must not allow any of the acts referred to in Articles 2 to 4 to occur on its territory.
It is not called upon to punish acts in violation of its neutrality unless the said acts have been committed on its own territory.

Article 1 is nulled if any article from 2-5 is acted upon.

Al-Qaeda is a belligerent against US. The US is a belligerent against Al-Qaeda.

Mullah Omar, in allowing Al-Qaeda to conduct its operations according to articles 2-5 in Afghanistan, made Afghanistan a co-belligerent against US. Afghanistan was no neutral state.

This understanding have always been so throughout the history of war. Claimed neutral states must do everything they can to prevent any belligerent from using their territories in a war. If a neutral state is too weak to prevent such violations, that would be incompetence and still would not protect its territorial integrity.

 

[KhalaiMakhlooq]

codified into the Geneva Convention

My friend, we both know Geneva conventions go out the window during war.

 

[gambit]

My friend, we both know Geneva conventions go out the window during war.

If so, there would be far worse casualties. Please do not engage in casual and convenient shallow cynicism.

 

[Falcon29]

War on Terror, first of all was an idiotic and unhelpful name to the campaign in Afghanistan, should have been named something else. Second of all, it initially began as a campaign in Afghanistan. Then it has been extended in duration and operations spread elsewhere in region due to broad policy definition by the US. Then it has been useful for many oppressive and non-oppressive regimes as a means to target or criminalize opposition. It has been used wrongfully by so many actors.

So yeah, at this point 'war on terror' has negative connotations and made the ME and areas in Asia a much more dangerous and tense place to live in. The US should end this war and instead pledge to support the Afghani government and help secure its future. It should not continue to beat a dead horse and try utilizing this campaign still.

Once the Mahdi and the Mujahideen establish a Caliphate in the near future, he will be responsible for the internal security of all those nations. Thus he will ask all foreign actors to refrain from any operations in any of those nations and possibly close down those military bases of foreign nations. Since they are at request of certain governments, but if those governments no longer exist in the near future, then that commitment is void. Will be interesting time to see how the foreign actors will work with that. The Mahdi will not allow foreign actors any excuse to operate on the Caliphate's land.

The Mahdi will play the enemies of Allah so hard, those who threaten the divine right to establish Islam on Muslims lands will be in in disarray. Alhamdillah, Allah(SWT) raises among us leaders who will bring us back to what we should be and strongly defend our right to worship God from the relentless attack from the people around the world who hate God and want us to worship Satan.

 

[KhalaiMakhlooq]

The US should end this war and instead pledge to support the Afghani government and help secure its future.

I agree

Mahdi and the Mujahideen establish a Caliphate

Do you actually believe that because on this thread not many people have that stance https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-allah-swt-sent-the-mahdi-next-year-would-you-follow-him.585692/

 

[Falcon29]

I agree



Do you actually believe that because on this thread not many people have that stance https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-allah-swt-sent-the-mahdi-next-year-would-you-follow-him.585692/

That was just for example sake(the timing, no one knows but Allah), but yes, every major Islamic scholar has agreed this is something that is bound to happen and there are many narrations of various Sahaba(RA) that confirm it so it is true and very real. And it will happen to our generation. I have more to say about that when we get closer, until then we should be firm our beliefs and attachment to Allah(SWT) and be patient.

Regarding people's stances, I was surprised to see that. Every scholar and all the Salaf(first generations) are in agreement in belief of the Mahdi.

 

[KhalaiMakhlooq]

That was just for example sake(the timing, no one knows but Allah), but yes, every major Islamic scholar has agreed this is something that is bound to happen and there are many narrations of various Sahaba(RA) that confirm it so it is true and very real. And it will happen to our generation. I have more to say about that when we get closer, until then we should be firm our beliefs and attachment to Allah(SWT) and be patient.

Regarding people's stances, I was surprised to see that. Every scholar and all the Salaf(first generations) are in agreement in belief of the Mahdi.

Do you think that one of the reasons for this war could be that others know that, and therefore they have preemptively striked against the Middle East in order to prepare for that moment? And does that reaffirm your belief?