Whats Wrong with ISPR Press release emphasizing "BETTER GOVERNANCE" from Political Leadership

[VCheng]

I would fully support.... not taliban version but one with humanity...

By the way u know how people embazzling public funds are dealt in sharia??

You may like it, but the real test is whether enough people in Pakistan support it and demand it. So far, they do not.

 

[Paksanity]

Sir, those claims of better economic performance need to be understood in conjunction with the deals made by the dictators with foreign powers for billions of dollars in support in exchange for certain "services", and the fact that they left the people of Pakistan with greater problems than they solved.

How stupid of people of Pakistan, then! A person in US knows better who have solved their problems. Have you ever been to a Pakistani police station? A government office? Tried to start a business that competes with local politician? People of Pakistan go through this every day and know full well who exploits them. Don't get me wrong. I am no advocate of military intervention or martial law but what is happening in Pakistan is NOT democracy. It's downright robbery and feudo-monarch exploitation that puts medieval France to shame. I'm sorry, having seen personally the horrors unleashed on my people, I can not support these people.

 

[VCheng]

How stupid of people of Pakistan, then! A person in US knows better who have solved their problems. Have you ever been to a Pakistani police station? A government office? Tried to start a business that competes with local politician? People of Pakistan go through this every day and know full well who exploits them. Don't get me wrong. I am no advocate of military intervention or martial law but what is happening in Pakistan is NOT democracy. It's downright robbery and feudo-monarch exploitation that puts medieval France to shame. I'm sorry, having seen personally the horrors unleashed on my people, I can not support these people.

Sir, I know Pakistan far better than what you might suspect. You are correct, it is downright robbery. Didn't I say earlier that it was looters and then thugs, thugs and then looters, taking turns, including the military as well as the "feudo-monarchs"?

 

[Mrc]

You may like it, but the real test is whether enough people in Pakistan support it and demand it. So far, they do not.

As u said your self ....pakistan is no america ...
People here do have very different mind set....
Many are zardari in their own right....

Sharia have worked in past...and will work in future....

Even american system is a borrowed roman system ( senate with budget, president directly selected heads military but has no budget...its a photocopy)

 

[Paksanity]

Sir, I know Pakistan far better than what you might suspect. You are correct, it is downright robbery. Didn't I say earlier that it was looters and then thugs, thugs and then looters, taking turns, including the military as well as the "feudo-monarchs"?

Military has changed a lot. It has evolved and recent times are witness to that. Military is dynamic and not dynastic. Its officers are educated and have a sense of belonging to this land. Fight with TTP and Al-Qaeda have changed them. They have lost people and families, their kids too. It isn't the military that it use to be. Politicians are a far cry in contrast. They have to improve the governance. Hollow claims, calls of sacred constitution, Shaheed this or that carry no weight any longer. Constitution, parliament, judiciary, police, elections and polity, all have lost their credibility simply because they don't deliver. Military delivered on its words. People will follow politicians and constitution when it delivers. They will defend it against any intrusion, military or other. Till such time, military can not be faulted for failure of polity. Politicians never had such golden chance to strengthen democracy but alas!

 

[VCheng]

As u said your self ....pakistan is no america ...
People here do have very different mind set....
Many are zardari in their own right....

Sharia have worked in past...and will work in future....

Even american system is a borrowed roman system ( senate with budget, president directly selected heads military but has no budget...its a photocopy)

Exactly why I argued in "Eight Good People" that Pakistan needs to evolve its own system that works for it given the ground realities of the present abysmal situation.

Military has changed a lot. It has evolved and recent times are witness to that. Military is dynamic and not dynastic. Its officers are educated and have a sense of belonging to this land. Fight with TTP and Al-Qaeda have changed them. They have lost people and families, their kids too. It isn't the military that it use to be. Politicians are a far cry in contrast. They have to improve the governance. Hollow claims, calls of sacred constitution, Shaheed this or that carry no weight any longer. Constitution, parliament, judiciary, police, elections and polity, all have lost their credibility simply because they don't deliver. Military delivered on its words. People will follow politicians and constitution when it delivers. They will defend it against any intrusion, military or other. Till such time, military can not be faulted for failure of polity. Politicians never had such golden chance to strengthen democracy but alas!

The claims that it is a new military are thus far unproven with no evidence to support them. Let us see what happens over the next few election cycles.

 

[Indus Falcon]

so we let them loot wow great idea what bright minded you are

Bright minded nahi, Goobar bhudi kehtay hain.

 

[That Guy]

Personally, I think this should have been expressed in private, but this should send a message to the civilian government. The army may not be willing to commit a coup (the time of committing coups is dead), but they won't tolerate shitty incompetence when it comes to governance. The message is clear, "if you don't get your act together, next elections we'll support the opposition"/

 

[koolio]

Nawaz sharif doesnt have much time, He has to deliver on his promises which at the moment is minimal, CPEC alone will not save him unless he brings in reforms, stamp out corruption and make the system more transparent, Its clear from ISPR press release they are not happy with PMLN performance so far.

 

[Humble Analyst]

Very likely one of the contributing factors.



It is you who is attempting deflection. The Martial Law episodes have destroyed the institutions that led to the poor performance of the politicians, and even during civil governments, the Army's illegal meddling in politics has been very effective in preventing the emergence of any real challenge to to exercise of supra-Constitutional authority. It is mighty rich to now claim that the civilian government is not doing its job, don't you think? The same people who "choose" Martial Law are also the ones who want it gone after ten years of being deprived yet again.



Then amend it, following due process, if it is not working. The Constitution is never a static thing, but a living document.

Why the legislators are not amending it? They will only amen to continue their rule and protect the corrupt leadership and no sincerity towards country or ordinary people.

Mine too

Mine too

Somebody had to say it. Our people are not questioning the corrupt inefficient government. Along with borders protection, Army is given law and order, natural disasters management, elections facilitation and now telling government stop mismanagement. They are tired of Nawaz protecting Zardari and Altaf.

 

[genmirajborgza786]

Who has stopped them from performing here? May be, just may be, the repeated disruptions of the due process caused by Martial Law had something to do with it? May be?

You hit the target Right in The Bull's Eye !

"Lajawab" +ve

As a fellow democrat , i envy your wit's sir

 

[SamantK]

You hit the target Right in The Bull's Eye !

"Lajawab" +ve

As a fellow democrat , i envy your wit's sir

And his patience to keep responding with calm and logic.

However, I'm amazed why even the TTs don't get the simple logic.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Mahmoud Khan Achakzai who ?

The same delusional old fool who fed Carlotta Gall a pack of lies about 'confirmed ISI/Pakistan Army knowledge of Osama Bin Laden hiding in Abbottabad ...

Who has stopped them from performing here? May be, just may be, the repeated disruptions of the due process caused by Martial Law had something to do with it? May be?

Going on 8 years of continuous democratic rule now ... while I don't expect all issues to be addressed, the time for trotting out this particular excuse (that you referenced) is over. It's about time the politicians start delivering, even if incrementally, and the NAP implementation needs to part of the first set of 'incremental improvements'.

 

[VCheng]

Going on 8 years of continuous democratic rule now ... while I don't expect all issues to be addressed, the time for trotting out this particular excuse (that you referenced) is over. It's about time the politicians start delivering, even if incrementally, and the NAP implementation needs to part of the first set of 'incremental improvements'.

Sir, the recent dharna soft coup drama and the present threat indicate that the tradition of illegal meddling in politics is alive and well at the GHQ. This 8 year claim is false. The Army knows that if the civilian authority starts delivering, their hold on power in under threat. The classic strategy of having one's cake and eating it too is at play here. The Army will not allow the civilian authority to gain its rightful power and yet chastise it in public for the failures that they themselves engineer.

Sad, but true.

And his patience to keep responding with calm and logic.

However, I'm amazed why even the TTs don't get the simple logic.

Nothing to be amazed about here, there are none as blind as those who do not wish to see.

Why the legislators are not amending it? They will only amen to continue their rule and protect the corrupt leadership and no sincerity towards country or ordinary people.

Because there is simply no demand for change by the people. They are comfortable with the system now in place, since it works for a majority of those who are well-connected. Take the membership here at PDF as an example of that cross-section of the society.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Sir, the recent dharna soft coup drama and the present threat indicate that the tradition of illegal meddling in politics is alive and well at the GHQ.

What 'dharna soft coup drama and present threat'? The Dharna was entirely Nawaz Sharif's own doing, out of his usual obstinate, since all he had to do was agree to an independent commission to investigate rigging allegations, and instead he dragged out and allowed a minor issue to become a major one.

The current statement is nothing more than an essential and necessary reminder that the Elected government is doing very little to implement the part of the NAP that falls under its purview, and essentially resting on the short-medium term peace won by the Army through battle. The only thing the elected government has to do is actually implement policy changes and reforms documented by multiple commissions under the PMLN and PPP government. The Army statement is out of exacerbation at the continued refusal of the elected government to implement something that's sitting right in front of it, that the public overwhelmingly supports, that the Army supports - what on earth else do the elected leaders need in terms of support to move their arses into action and implement policies and reforms related to domestic security?

This is no longer a 'failure engineered by the Army', this is a potential failure snatched from the jaws of victory by the elected leadership, a leadership that has the blueprints for victory sitting in its lap and the entire country - the public, media and military - pushing it to implement said blueprint, and yet it is doing little to nothing.